Missing posters

[LizzieMaine]

I thought I might chime in here; I still really love reading this forum, but after one unpleasant encounter I stopped feeling comfortable posting in some of the threads. I guess I'd like to say that there is a significant difference between being openly insulted, bullied, or threatened, and being subjected to rudeness. From what I've experienced personally and have seen around various threads, I'm under the impression (and please correct me if I am wrong) that a lot of the behavior is directed at women.

I get plenty of pressure at work and don't feel a need to engage in it off-hours. I only post on this forum when I'm at home, and I just don't want to bring untoward remarks about women into my home.

I understand that moderators can't spend their entire lives reading every thread and slapping down every rude poster. That's not reasonable. I just wish that there were a way to ask some folks, gently and reasonably, to try to be a little more gentlemanly.

I'm glad to see you back around, St. Lou., and I remember very well the incident you're referring to. Unfortunately, it wasn't in a forum where I'm moderator, because if it was, I would have put an immediate stop to it.

In general, the men around here are decent sorts. There are a few stone-headed reactionaries, as you're likely to get in any "retro" forum, but there are also men of quality who tend to keep the former type in their place. As always, if you find yourself having trouble with a specific member, feel free to report it directly to the moderator of the forum where the incident took place, and it will be investigated.

 

[Tomasso]

I remember very well the incident you're referring to.

Would you kindly post a link to the offending post?

 

[LizzieMaine]

Doing so would serve no good purpose. St. Louis and I know what the incident was, and that's sufficient.

 

[scotrace]

Lizzie is 100% correct in this judgment.

 

[LizzieMaine]

Thread is now reopened and officially designated "Women Only." Further posts by male Loungers will be deleted without notice. We play hard ball here.

 

[sheeplady]

Thread is now reopened and officially designated "Women Only." Further posts by male Loungers will be deleted without notice. We play hard ball here.

I do wish you could "like" posts. So this message will have to do.


I've noticed that there are some women whom only seem to post in the powder room. Is that because of interest only in the topics here, experiences elsewhere in the forum (like the ones we are discussing), or something else?
I imagine that there are men who only post in one part of the lounge or another, but that's not what we're discussing.


I've had a few interactions here that have ruffled my feathers. I also have a relatively thick skin, a big mouth, and don't mind a rumble.

Maybe it is a matter of support that we need to show more of? For instance, if we see another lady being mistreated/ inappropriately shown rudeness we should step in?

 

[LizzieMaine]

Solidarity is always a good thing. I don't advocate pigpiling, but a well-placed "Hey, she told you to lay off. I suggest you do it," followed by a PM to the moderator of whatever room the incident is in would not be out of line.

 

[LizzieMaine]

As for members who only post in the PR, I don't think that's all that unusual. There's an entire army of members who only post in the hat room, or the leather-jacket threads or whatever other specific interest they have -- go in those rooms and you'll have no idea who some of the people are, even if they have thousands of posts, because they never go into the general-interest sections of the Lounge. I think that's just a consequence of a forum trying to cover as vast an amount of ground as we do here. I don't think there's anybody on here who's interested in *everything* that's discussed, and that's perfectly fine.

People should contribute where they feel comfortable contributing. They don't owe us any more than that.

 

[sheeplady]

As for members who only post in the PR, I don't think that's all that unusual. There's an entire army of members who only post in the hat room, or the leather-jacket threads or whatever other specific interest they have -- go in those rooms and you'll have no idea who some of the people are, even if they have thousands of posts, because they never go into the general-interest sections of the Lounge. I think that's just a consequence of a forum trying to cover as vast an amount of ground as we do here. I don't think there's anybody on here who's interested in *everything* that's discussed, and that's perfectly fine.

People should contribute where they feel comfortable contributing. They don't owe us any more than that.

Oh, I wasn't suggesting that people should feel the need to post everywhere and I hope that doesn't come across as critical of people who only post in one area. I know there's some ladies here who are mostly interested in fashion, so this is the place for them and they have no interest elsewhere. There's some forums I just plain never look at, and I imagine it is the same for the others. I am just curious.

 

[Stormy]

Well, I've had a near-miss "rumble" or 2 since I've been here. I know how bad I can be at times if pushed to far, so I just ignore some things. I must say that I feel a bit of relief at knowing that it's not just me who has been picked on a little around here. Now that I'm aware, I won't hesitate to put on my red cape and step in to help other ladies out if necessary. Some of the fellows here did indeed step in for me when I was being pushed around. THANKS GUYS I also must apologize in advance for any future crude, unlady-like behavior on my part. As I said, I know how I can be at times.

 

[swinggal]

I guess I don't post a lot any more because many of the old gang here that I liked have gone or rarely post. I also feel that that sometimes opinions are stifled. I'm not talking about rudeness, sexism, politics etc, just opinions.

I also don't like the creepy factor of those men who try to initiate intimate PM's with complete strangers out of the blue.

 

[Flicka]

I stopped coming to the FL, partly because I felt there was a rather toxic atmosphere on many boards (not the PR), caused by male posters' attitude towards women. I've been on quite a number of internet forums, and I've moderated one or two as well, but for a board where so many male members seem to want to be considered gentlemen, it is rather remarkable how few seem to be bothered by rudeness towards the female members. I feel, to be frank, like I'm walking past a bunch of catcalling highschool boys when I venture into many parts of the Lounge (despite heavy use of the "ignore" function). Not a one "bullying incident", but several where I felt ordinary decorum was passed with a wide margin in regards not necessarily in regards to me but to other female members. I felt I was coming close to the point where I was about to start telling people to stick it, and really, does the internet need more drama?

So, instead, I quietly withdrew, but I'd love an opportunity to be able to talk with people with similar interests without the Old Boys' Club static in the background.

 

[LizzieMaine]

Sometimes one has to walk thru a room banging a skillet with a ladle to get the necessary attention. I can assure you folks that the skillet has been banged, and that the top management of the Lounge is now paying very close attention to the issues thus brought before them.

Flicka, you've been missed.

 

[Flicka]

Flicka, you've been missed.

Thank you so much. You saying that really means the world.

 

[Lily Powers]

I stopped coming to the FL, partly because I felt there was a rather toxic atmosphere on many boards (not the PR), caused by male posters' attitude towards women. I've been on quite a number of internet forums, and I've moderated one or two as well, but for a board where so many male members seem to want to be considered gentlemen, it is rather remarkable how few seem to be bothered by rudeness towards the female members. I feel, to be frank, like I'm walking past a bunch of catcalling highschool boys when I venture into many parts of the Lounge (despite heavy use of the "ignore" function). Not a one "bullying incident", but several where I felt ordinary decorum was passed with a wide margin in regards not necessarily in regards to me but to other female members. I felt I was coming close to the point where I was about to start telling people to stick it, and really, does the internet need more drama?

So, instead, I quietly withdrew, but I'd love an opportunity to be able to talk with people with similar interests without the Old Boys' Club static in the background.

Kind of off-topic, but your comment about the "high school boys" brought to mind the now closed "Women in Men's Fedoras" thread. That was one particular thread that went unmoderated for quite some time and any decorum went out the "locker room" window. so to speak, before someone closed it. Certainly not up to gentlemanly standards on the FL and would have been better communicated via their own personal emails. And thanks to all the ladies who post here - I may not post often, but I enjoy your knowledge, skills and style inspirations!

 

[Lady Day]

Gasp!

It is so good to see so many ladies peeking back in. I've missed a lot of you! I hope this change gives many reason to return and continue sharing your knowledge.

 

[Dexter'sDame]

(Hopefully this reply won't result in a double post, as I wrote one last night and the screen went blank when I hit the button to post!)

Forums evolve and change, sometimes for the worse. Trolls discover a new place to spout a lot of negativity, early posters get sick of it and leave while some of the ones who remain are entertained by it and get sucked into it, and the culture of the forum is permanently altered or the forum dies altogether. Ironically, what can save the Fedora Lounge from a similar fate is the members' penchant for nostalgia and memories of "the good old days."

I've been an infrequent binge poster since early 2008, due to a strange schedule, illness, and losing my screen name and password combo at one point. During the past couple of years, I read but didn't bother to post because so many of my friends had left and I'd noticed a change in the tone of the Lounge. When you've been away for a while, a culture lean toward things like a more derogatory attitude toward women, politicized discussions, intolerance, and flat-out rudeness that wasn't there before is quite jarring. The Lounge I knew and loved was like a fun cocktail party, or depending on the thread, a Sunday salon, full of interesting conversations about our shared love of Vintage. Lively, yes, but never rude, and on the rare occasion a troll came in or someone said something unsavory, other members stepped in. The last few times I lurked on the Lounge, I wasn't seeing any of that.

I have an extremely thick skin, but like many people, I use my Vintage life as a fun escape from my Modern life. To paraphrase another poster who put it more eloquently, I'd rather not invite negativity into what, for me, is supposed to be a fun hobby. Life's too serious to be so serious.

That said, the vast majority of the Loungers are great people, and it's only a few that are the bad apples. The fact that Lizzie and LadyDay and our other Bartenders and FL management care so deeply about this place speaks volumes and gives me hope for the future of the Lounge.

That's a very long answer, but...you asked! And I'm so glad to see it wasn't just me that felt this way.

(edited because I misspelled Lizzie's name! My apologies.)

 

[Puzzicato]

I mostly stopped visiting because I was being inspired to spend too much money!

 

[LizzieMaine]

Well, we're glad to see you back. It doesn't cost anything to look.

 

[Puzzicato]

That's true! But my willpower is somewhat lacking.