"Mad Men" on AMC (US) - (Spoilers Within)

[PADDY]

Must be the cross Atlantic thing of Tum-ate-O..etc. Not to worry *sigh*...so MadMen will be ending soon. Hopefully Boardwalk will be showing next

 

[flat-top]

Must be the cross Atlantic thing of Tum-ate-O..etc. Not to worry *sigh*...so MadMen will be ending soon. Hopefully Boardwalk will be showing next

The saddest line of the night: "Only 3 episodes left."

 

[AmateisGal]

The saddest line of the night: "Only 3 episodes left."

GAH! What will I do on my Monday lunch breaks when it's done???

 

[Young fogey]

I never heard it pronounced Jag-U-AR until the latest round of car advertising within the last few years. Since the sixties, it was always Jag-waar here in the States - both the car and the big cat.

Right, and I think Pete/Vincent was saying it a little differently, 'jagwire'. Might be his accent or just him.

 

[C-dot]

It was very fun to watch Don and Joan in the bar, most fun I've had watching Mad Men in quite some time.

I agree, it was such a great scene. I like to think it's because Don is such a man and Joan is such a woman, and the fact that they don't get together makes it more fun to watch.

Ladies, did any of you swoon ever-so-slightly when Don draped his coat around Joan's shoulders before they grabbed an elevator? And his note on the flowers at the end was so touchingly thoughtful. It must have given her some of her old pluck back.

 

[AmateisGal]

Ladies, did any of you swoon ever-so-slightly when Don draped his coat around Joan's shoulders before they grabbed an elevator? And his note on the flowers at the end was so touchingly thoughtful. It must have given her some of her old pluck back.

Loved that part by the elevator - and how dashing he looked while they were at the bar. Great stuff.

 

[Wire9Vintage]

Tonight's episode was devastating. Not only the Joan/Don stuff but the Peggy/Don scene just about did me in. I've never seen a more moving hand kiss!

What, oh what do the next two weeks hold in store? I'm not sure I can take it!

 

[AtomicEraTom]

I've missed the past couple episodes, it's really making me sad!

 

[William Stratford]

Granted I have never seen Mad Men but I do not understand its popularity - are not the Advertising and PR agencies a key force in corroding traditional decency and replacing it with degeneracy?

 

[Doctor Strange]

William: The show may be set in the advertising business, but its real subject (as has been gradually revealed over the seven years passing within the series) is observing the ways that people respond to societal changes and the associated challenges. Its popularity is due to its brilliantly on-point writing, tremendous intelligence, deep humanity, ability to distill so much history into the lives of its fascinating, complex characters, and the show's astounding attention to detail. Not to mention that the cast, sets, clothes, cars, etc. are gorgeous!

Fellow true believers: Another one knocked out of the park! Events of seismic significance, and once again, several stories/characters reflecting the same thematic concern... and counterpointing it beautifully. As inevitable as everything that happened in this episode was, it was still a series of gut-punches. I'm still processing it all...

Forget the fifties: NOW is the Golden Age of TV Drama!

 

[Angus Forbes]

Having myself lived through the period covered by Mad Men, I would have to respectfully disagree -- in my opinion, the cultural aspect of the show is quite grossly incorrect. Nevertheless, the costumes and settings are wonderful, and the story line and characters are fascinating. Basically, Mad Men is a high budget, high quality, impeccably executed period-piece soap opera. But it says next to nothing about the actual culture of the period. Anyone who believes that adults of the time actually behaved like Don, et al, has been seriously misled.

 

[Doctor Strange]

Hey, I'm in my late fifties and also lived through the period - admittedly, at Sally Draper's age. But my parents were pro photographers, and I knew lots of NYC-based ad execs and commercial artists, and I recognize a lot of the behavior. Of course, as I observed back near the start of this tread, everything on the show is very heightened and compressed for dramatic purposes, and certainly it is primarily a (very) classy soap opera. But I don't think it's as far off reality - at least NYC ad man reality - as you seem to think.

 

[Angus Forbes]

The show might well describe a splinter of society as you have said. However, and unfortunately (in my opinion), many young people in my experience have taken it to represent the general culture of America at the time, which, I would maintain, is grossly incorrect. Until this bizarre and fairly recent inversion of reality, much of the criticism of the MM times was directed toward conformity, regimentation, and religiosity (which are often exaggerated as well). I guess that one way for the Hollywood media to prop-up the cheesy culture that we have today is to try to discredit the culture of better times and better people in the past.

 

[William Stratford]

Speaking as someone who:

* has never seen even one episode
* sees the post-war era as where it all started to fall apart
* holds the view that the change in approach to advertising was a large part of this beginning of decay (see "Century of the Self" by Adam Curtis)

could you please say how it is that Mad Men differs from / embodies the time of the 60s?

 

[AmateisGal]

Tonight's episode was devastating. Not only the Joan/Don stuff but the Peggy/Don scene just about did me in. I've never seen a more moving hand kiss!

What, oh what do the next two weeks hold in store? I'm not sure I can take it!

The Peggy and Don scene...I actually cried. I thought Don was going to start crying, too. Wow. Powerful stuff.

 

[rue]

Hey, I'm in my late fifties and also lived through the period - admittedly, at Sally Draper's age. But my parents were pro photographers, and I knew lots of NYC-based ad execs and commercial artists, and I recognize a lot of the behavior. Of course, as I observed back near the start of this tread, everything on the show is very heightened and compressed for dramatic purposes, and certainly it is primarily a (very) classy soap opera. But I don't think it's as far off reality - at least NYC ad man reality - as you seem to think.

Yup. I asked my mom about it and she said it is pretty spot on, even for my grandfather, who was a prominent business man in Los Angeles during that time. I don't think it was the same for people that lived in the mid-west (for example) though.

 

[rue]

The Peggy and Don scene...I actually cried. I thought Don was going to start crying, too. Wow. Powerful stuff.

I haven't watched this one yet, but I can't wait after reading everyone's thoughts!

 

[Angus Forbes]

To Mr. Stratford: Well, it seems to me that the 1960's were indeed the beginning of decay. However, it was just the beginning, and a great deal of traditional decency remained intact. The notion that the typical businessman of early 1960's America was a philandering, chronically drunk lout, which is central to the depiction of most of the male MM characters, is simply ridiculous. The idea that women were easy marks for office creeps is simply ridiculous. To the extent that men had their affairs they were shrouded in secrecy and privacy. I knew one guy who had an affair, which he tried everything he could to hide. Never, never, never was there any open sex on company premises. Never! Many companies had a no-alcohol-on-premises policy -- the fastest way to the door at IBM or AT&T in the early 1960s was to have an open bottle in your desk. Never, never, never were women treated in such a humiliating and disrespectful way as shown on MM (quite the contrary, in my opinion, although I agree that women's opportunities for professional advancement were limited). In the upper-middle-class corporate culture of the time, Black people were never openly insulted (behavior in private may well have been different). And so forth. The cultural aspect of MM regarding middle-class-and-higher corporate life is, in my opinion, completely wrong on all of these counts. All that notwithstanding, I must say that I enjoy the program very much. It's just not cultural history.

 

[William Stratford]

To Mr. Stratford: Well, it seems to me that the 1960's were indeed the beginning of decay. However, it was just the beginning, and a great deal of traditional decency remained intact. The notion that the typical businessman of early 1960's America was a philandering, chronically drunk lout, which is central to the depiction of most of the male MM characters, is simply ridiculous. The idea that women were easy marks for office creeps is simply ridiculous. To the extent that men had their affairs they were shrouded in secrecy and privacy. I knew one guy who had an affair, which he tried everything he could to hide. Never, never, never was there any open sex on company premises. Never! Many companies had a no-alcohol-on-premises policy -- the fastest way to the door at IBM or AT&T in the early 1960s was to have an open bottle in your desk. Never, never, never were women treated in such a humiliating and disrespectful way as shown on MM (quite the contrary, in my opinion, although I agree that women's opportunities for professional advancement were limited). In the upper-middle-class corporate culture of the time, Black people were never openly insulted (behavior in private may well have been different). And so forth. The cultural aspect of MM regarding middle-class-and-higher corporate life is, in my opinion, completely wrong on all of these counts. All that notwithstanding, I must say that I enjoy the program very much. It's just not cultural history. Maybe I was just lucky to have had such a good 1960's experience . . ..

Thankyou for that, I was wondering if that were the case.

 

[Lily Powers]

...Well, it seems to me that the 1960's were indeed the beginning of decay. ...The notion that the typical businessman of early 1960's America was a philandering, chronically drunk lout, which is central to the depiction of most of the male MM characters, is simply ridiculous. The idea that women were easy marks for office creeps is simply ridiculous. ...All that notwithstanding, I must say that I enjoy the program very much. It's just not cultural history.

"Decay" is in the eye of the beholder; folks said the "modern" and wild shenanigans of the Roaring '20's was a downfall for mankind, too. I don't think the series in any way promotes itself to chronicle "the typical businessman of the early 1960's" or to be cultural history (that's better left to the documentarians). It a portrayal of characters who behave in such ways, that's all. And you know it's fascinating to watch.

My favorite part of last night's episode was the dual versions of Don going to Joan's home to speak to let her know she didn't have to go through with Pete's suggestion on how to land the Jaguar account - the first time we think he's discouraging her and the second time... well, it was so sad to know it was too late and to see the look on her face when she cast her eyes downward.

The 60's are coming in strong and Don's power is waning because he's firmly rooted in the past and afraid to/can't/won't keep up.