M-422A v AN6552

[Edward]

So.... difference? I'm confused! I've been looking at the USN jackets on Aero's website, and I spotted these two. it's not clear whether they were issues at different times but I presume there must have been some reason like this for the existence of two separate designs. Am I right in saying that the AN6552 was the wartime successor to the prewar M-422A design?

(Every time I think I have a handle on this.... lol).

 

[BuzzTheTower]

M-422a an AN-6552

Hi Edward,

This is a commonly asked question. We tend to think that a different spec number would equate to a difference in design. The only major difference would be the label and that most have a US stamp on the back of the collar, rather than USN. The real differences in design actually come from the makers of the jackets. Though the Navy had some expectations for the design, there are strong differences from one maker to another in the design.

Gordon & Ferguson made both M-422As and AN-6552s. There aren't any appreciable differences in design, though I think Conmars were used on the latter (often too short). Willis & Geiger made the M-422, M-422A, AN-6552, and AN-J-3A, and I think the differences from one to the next only amounted to them adjusting the sleeve and body length to make a better fit. Edmund T. Church became Burjac Sportswear between contracts and their jackets look very similar throughout.

Often people talk about the AN-J-3 as a USN jacket without the fur collar. There were a small number made like this (and one was photographed in the Class 13 catalog), but really, all AN-6552 jackets are AN-J-3s. That's what the contract paperwork states, though for some reason the labels don't show this. In the same way, the AN-J-4 sheepskin jacket was also the AN-6553, and the AN-J-2 cloth jacket was the AN-6551. Those last two jackets had both numbers on the labels.

If you want to see big differences, just compare an M-422A by Fried, Ostermann to an AN-6552 by Bogen and Tenenbaum. Though they have all the required parts that the Navy expected, the designs of the two are very different. This only had to do with the interpretation of the jacket by each company.

John

 

[aswatland]

So.... difference? I'm confused! I've been looking at the USN jackets on Aero's website, and I spotted these two. it's not clear whether they were issues at different times but I presume there must have been some reason like this for the existence of two separate designs. Am I right in saying that the AN6552 was the wartime successor to the prewar M-422A design?

(Every time I think I have a handle on this.... lol).

I have owned originals of both and currently own an AN6552 by Block. There is very little difference between this jacket and the G&F M442A which I owned. I believe M442As were made from 1941-3 and 6552s in 1943. I presume the "AN" prefix indicates Army or Navy like the AN-J-3 series?

 

[Edward]

Thanks for the replies, guys.... If I'm reading you rightly, it sounds something akin to the differences between A2 manufacturers, or between pre- and during-war A2s, or Irvins? In which case they're both, essentially, the same model - a proto-G1 as it were - but delineated in some way closer to an order or contract number than a jacket model type as such?

 

[greyhound68]

I have had an original 422A, AN6552 and my current ANJ-3A all very similar. I have to say I like the ANJ-3A the best. Collar is smaller than the 422A and 6552 at least on the model I have. It is interesting the fit. The 422a was a bit strange in that it was tight in the shoulders, the 6552 was really long both were 42s. The ANJ3A even though a 40 fits the best. Normally I take 42s in G-1 jackets so the 40 fitting was a real surprise. Here is a pic of it.

 

[Edward]

Good looking jacket! Was a time when I didn't care for the look of the fluffy collar, but I've become a real fan. Once I'm sorted with a nice A2, some one of these could be an option.... for practicality's sake, I'll probably end up with a shearling (be it a B6, or a B3) first, but one of these would be really nice. Especially like the looks of the Aero models with the red lining, in goatskin.... might be a nice difference and a way of justifying one as against the FQHH A2 I have in mind first...

 

[Edward]

I asked this in the A2 v G1 thread also, but it seemed to make sense to raise it here... The later G1s I see a lot of on eBay. How do they compare in fit - did they go down the baggy route of the modern A2s, or were the 70s jackets still the narrower fit?

 

[cherrypicker]

flight jacket jacket spec

I have recently picked up a jacket that was said to be an anj-3-a.I actually think that it is more likely to be an an-6552.The spec label is missing.The jacket has no epaulets,which the anj had?,and the interior pocket has no press stud fastening.The collar is ginger mouton,the zip is a brass talon and it has a bi-weave waistband.The pocket flaps have rounded edges,going into a rounded point beneath the button hole.
Can anybody shed any light or correct me on anything I may be wrong on?

 

[greyhound68]

ANJ-3A nd the 6552 are really the same as John Chapman explained above. The jacket you described without fur and eps is the ANJ-3.

 

[Alan Eardley]

ANJ-3A nd the 6552 are really the same as John Chapman explained above. The jacket you described without fur and eps is the ANJ-3.

True. Some of the jackets you see have different buttons to the 'normal' M422a/AN6552/G-1 issue. They are plain and seem to be in a phenolic resin, rather like some civilian buttons of the era. I have one such jacket and I have been told that this was one contact of AN-J-3.

Does anyone know anything about this?

Alan

 

[handworn]

ANJ3a on ebay?

Hey all,

Very new here, but I've been impressed as a lurker with the general level of knowledge and friendliness.

This early AN-J-3a jacket is on eBay now:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=290212637991

It ends this Friday, March 14, and you'd get it for ten bucks if you were the only bidder. No bids yet as of now (March 10).

Hope someone can give it a home. I'd hate to see it trashed, which could well happen if no one bids on it.

 

[Edward]

Returning to this thread, I'm now the owner of an Aero jacket labelled AN6552 (eBay auction was titled ANJ-3, which makes sense given what I've read above). I won it in the end for about what I'd have expected a going market price to be for a used Aero, though at that I saved the guts of £200 as against the new price plus postage. Pleased with that. We'll see what the jacket is like when it arrives, hopefully later this week. I know a lot of folks round these parts don't always care for Aero, feeling others to be the more accurate, though to be honest I doubt I could tell the difference myself. Although I've been reading a reasearching on here for about ten months now, this will be my first upscale repro jacket. I had intended an A2 would come first, but this happened along and here we are. I'll put some photos up when it arrives. It's in seal with dark brown knits (I've never seen the characteristic rust knits on an Aero navy jacket - were those only to be found on the USAAF jackets?) and rust mouton. Should be just the thing if this cold snap continues!

 

[jeepjeep13]

Hi guys,
Hope this is the right place to post this question. I found a WWII USN M-422A by Fried Ostermann and it's a size 40, but the guy selling it claims it's a long because it's 27" in length. While that does normally sound like a long size, from the research I've done, there were a fair amount of these style jackets made to that length. Any advice or suggestions or input?

 

[El Marro]

That does sound a bit long to me for a size 40. I wear a size 46 in the navy flight jackets and the back length is usually right around 26".

 

[Skyhawk]

Well they didn't make Long sizes so that is not true. It is probably a bigger size. The later G-1 contracts have a tolerance of +1" - 1/2" on length. Still though that would only put a size 40 at 26" max. The modern specs state 22 1/4" without the knits. Add about 3" for knits and a 40 should be around 25-26" by modern specs. Sounds like the seller is measuring the chest wrong, and estimating the size incorrectly. I assume there is no marked size on the jacket.

 

[jeepjeep13]

I seem to think he's pretty reputable since he claims to restore vintage leather jackets, but there's still something fishy about the fact that it's listed as a 40L. I'm thinking the same thing you guys are that they didn't make long's back then and stuff, but here are the measurements he took of them. He actually even provided pictures of the length measurement.
Shoulders 17"
Sleeve length 26" to 26 1/2"
Pits 21 1/2"
Back Length 27" (measured from the collar seam to the end of the waist knits)

 

[jeepjeep13]

and yes, it is missing the actual size tag so he could be off, but the shoulder/pits indicate 40 to me as well.

 

[nick123]

Hi guys,
Hope this is the right place to post this question. I found a WWII USN M-422A by Fried Ostermann and it's a size 40, but the guy selling it claims it's a long because it's 27" in length. While that does normally sound like a long size, from the research I've done, there were a fair amount of these style jackets made to that length. Any advice or suggestions or input?

How did he measure? Sometimes the front knit will dip a little below the back when measured from the back, and sellers can mistakenly include this...or even measure from collar to bottom, not collar seam to bottom. I would clarify.

I had a 1943 w&g AN-6552 I got for a steal. Sold it. It’s perhaps my most missed jacket. Totally near mint. I’m an idiot. The thing fit beautifully at 6’2”. Nicest goatskin I have ever handled.

 

[jeepjeep13]

Damn, that thing fits beautifully and is one fine jacket. I like how the AN6552's were labeled with just the US as opposed to the USN that came later with the M422.

Yea, I'll see if i can include a pic of the measurement he took for me so you can see for yourself if it is what you're talking about.

 

[jeepjeep13]

The knits look like they could be new and longer than the originals which could account for the length.