Little Boy, August 6

[LordBest]

Oh, quite so, my apologies.

You seem to have misunderstood or misinterpreted my post LordBest.

The simple point here is that violence begets violence.

 

[Ed Bass]

No offence taken.
Enjoy your day.

 

[Edward]

You seem to have misunderstood or misinterpreted my post LordBest.

The simple point here is that violence begets violence.

Alas, that is the story of the human condition all too often. I have no doubt that the activities of the American Volunteer Group of the Chinese Air Force were influential in the decision to mount the Pearl Harbour attack, and before that, no doubt it was something else in turn which led the US military to the decision that the AVG was something they wanted to support.... and on and on....

 

[LaMedicine]

You seem to have misunderstood or misinterpreted my post LordBest.

The simple point here is that violence begets violence.

The point is, WHO has the courage and integrity to stop the vicious cycle?
Such is what the Hiroshima-Nagasaki Memorials mean to us. The will to put an end to nuclear destruction that holds the possibility of total human annhilation more than any other weapon that is in use today.

 

[Aristaeus]

Alas, that is the story of the human condition all too often. I have no doubt that the activities of the American Volunteer Group of the Chinese Air Force were influential in the decision to mount the Pearl Harbour attack,

Unlikely since the A.V.G. did not become active until Dec 20th.

and before that, no doubt it was something else in turn which led the US military to the decision that the AVG was something they wanted to support.... and on and on....

The U.S. military were opposed to the A.V.G.

 

[Silver Dollar]

The point is, WHO has the courage and integrity to stop the vicious cycle?
Such is what the Hiroshima-Nagasaki Memorials mean to us. The will to put an end to nuclear destruction that holds the possibility of total human annhilation more than any other weapon that is in use today.

The purpose of the high number of nukes during the Cold War was deterrence rather than endorsing the use of nuclear weapons. Any sane world leader would have the good sense to realize that if he/she attacked the U.S. or their allies with nuclear weapons, the consequences brought down on their own people would be too much to bear and way too horrible to think about. Those sane leaders have the courage, integrity and good judgement to say "no, this is not an option". I believe the U.S., Russia (the former Soviet Union) and China are among the sane. They will definitely think twice before acting. The problem nowadays is not the sane world leaders but the nut cases who will act irresponsibly in a fit of emotion and total stupidity that we need to worry about. They don't give a darn about anything but their own agenda without regard to the consequences. As far as I myself am concerned, I saw the consequences of nuclear, bio and chemical warfare and I wish the weapons and all the ways to make them would be eliminated forever so that no one could ever use them against any form of humanity again. As long as the raw materials exist in nature which they always will, some knucklehead will always go against good judgement and try something stupid.

 

[Edward]

Unlikely since the A.V.G. did not become active until Dec 20th.

Oops, I must have missed my dates up - I stand corrected on that. Yes, on review, I see that the 1st AVG, although several months in the planning and assembly, wasn't mobilised until after Pearl Harbour.

The U.S. military were opposed to the A.V.G.

Officially, yes, but in reality it was clandestinely organised, involving military personnel, and approved by the CiC himself.

 

[Silver Dollar]

One of the things Roosevelt was concerned about was Chennault not pulling too many U.S. pilots and ground crews out of the U.S. military. The service branch chiefs didn't want to give up their men at first but were convinced to after a while. There was a heck of a lot of wheeling and dealing going on but they finally got the bugs squeezed out of the works. The AVG concept was definitely not new to China. There was a group called the 14th VBS or Volunteer Bomb Squadron that came first staffed by men from Russia, England (I think) and a few other nations. They were there pretty early on but did not have the success the AVG saw. They also used a version of the famous blood chit before the AVG used it.

 

[Story]

South Korean President Lee Myung-bak on Sunday termed Japan's recent apology for its 35-year colonial rule of the Korean peninsula "one step forward," but he said more must be done to foster better relations between the two nations.

In a nationally televised speech to mark the anniversary of liberation from Japanese rule, Lee focused on the future instead of the pain suffered at the hands of foreigners.

Many older South Koreans remember being forced to adopt Japanese surnames, fight as Japan's soldiers and work as prostitutes, or "comfort women," for the military.

http://articles.latimes.com/2010/aug/15/world/la-fg-adv-korea-apology-20100815

 

[Grant Fan]

thought I would share these with the group.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/video/2009/05/19/2574723.htm

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/29865222/

 

[HepKitty]

the nuclear fuel for these two bombs came from the Hanford site, near the Tri-Cities WA. because of this, the mascot of Richland HS is the Bomber. in the foyer there is a mural of a 40s style bomber plane, and the rest of the school, letterman jackets, yearbooks, etc, are all plastered with mushroom clouds. what a terrible thing to glorify no fixing it now though, it's local history

this is what they taught us in WA state history, especially at that school

 

[kampkatz]

Thank you Grant Fan for the info on the only double A-bomb survivor. It is a powerful witness for avoiding any more nuclear attacks.

 

[HepKitty]

thought I would share these with the group.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/video/2009/05/19/2574723.htm

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/29865222/

thank you for sharing these

 

[LaMedicine]

Thank you Grant Fan for the info on the only double A-bomb survivor. It is a powerful witness for avoiding any more nuclear attacks.

There are actually 9 double A bomb survivors on record. There was a s TV documentary special released there this summer on them. Yamaguchi is the only man still alive today. Funny how both governments (even if they are their own citizens) and media twist the facts to fit their own agenda :eusa_doh:
At least, I am glad to know that there is some coverage on this in the US.

 

[Tango Yankee]

While the long-term effects of radiation poisoning may not have been known at the time, what was known was that we (the US) now had a very powerful weapon available for use.

A few things to consider: we were not only at war, but it was all-out war with the goals of winning and putting an end to the war as soon as possible.

We saw how Japanese forces defended such places as Peleliu, resulting in the thought: if they are willing to go to such extreme lengths to defend an almost useless bit of coral, to what lengths will they go to defend Japan itself?

We did have, and use, other terrible weapons in the fight. The firebombing of Tokyo was horrific. If we were going to invade that would have been just the beginning of what was in store.

One bomber + one atomic bomb = massive destruction was the intended message.

My personal opinion (not that it matters in the great scheme of things) is that dropping those two bombs did far more good than bad in the long run. The goal of not invading the Japanese home islands was realized, saving who knows how many lives on both sides. We did learn an awful lot about the effects of such weapons and that knowledge surely helped to prevent a nuclear war. If we hadn't have learned then, would MADD have been as effective? (I know, there are those who would argue that MADD didn't actually work, but who's to know? I think that fact that we didn't have WWIII is a big argument for it having worked.)

Is it fair that so many continue to feel the effects of those two bombs so long after the fact? No, but not much about war, or even life, is fair. After all, there were countless people who were wounded during the war by more traditional means and while they may not have dealt with radiation poisoning for the rest of their lives many certainly had to live with being crippled, perhaps in constant pain, or if not physically injured then mentally. They live(d) with it for the rest of their lives as well.

Our leaders were in a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" position. If they hadn't used the atomic bombs, today they might be vilified for not using them when their use could have resulted in hundreds of thousands of spared lives.

While I do hope to see the end of nuclear weapons, I doubt I will in my lifetime--not when you have so many "up and coming" countries who seem to view gaining nuclear weapons as a way to earn their rightful place in the eyes of the world. That is the saddest part of all.

Regards,
Tom

 

[thunderw21]

When viewing the atomic bomb uses against Japan we must do so through the lens of context.

Why do the atomic bombs stand out in our memories when many more people were killed and wounded in the nightly firebomb raids made by hundreds of B-29s? Those firebombing attacks against dozens of Japanese cities are lost on the average viewer of history, yet the atomic attacks are so prevelant.

Why is that? Nearly every major participant in WW2 carried out major attacks against enemy civilian targets (Dresden, multiple other German cities, the Blitz, etc.), why do the atomic bombs garner such attention and hatred?

Is it because of the horror that one plane and one bomb can bring?

 

[LordBest]

One atomic bomb, one plane, one moment, one dead city.

It is the instantaneous nature of the destruction, stemming from such a relatively small thing which people find particularly horrific, I believe. Tens of thousands dead, more potentially, dead in the blink of an eye.