It`s all been done before.

[bburtner@moran]

I am sitting here at the computer at 0:600, reading some of the threads that the members post.I do not want this to be a long winded post mind you but I must express my view on the subject( It`s all been done before).At 56 years old and still spending my time chasing down the vintage stuff,be it watches,pens,leather,ie jackets,briefcases,pigskin gloves (try to find a GOOD pair)guitars you name it and I have had it sold it traded it still have it or threw it out!40yrs ago a Rolex was just a watch,bought my first Oyster Perpetual used in NYC for 60.00,GMTs, Explorers,1&2s,Subs.....I have owned them all.Right now I do not own one.The Explorer 1016 hack that I paid 400.00 for is now 6500.00!Sold it. All of the so called "collectable"Vintage" items are now at a point of being STUPID money!,mind you it has not stopped me from searching high and low for the "sleepers",but the money people have taken the wind out of this man`s sails.Who would have known that a pre war Martin D18 would rise to the sum of $60,000 !!!Or that old Gruen pink gold Curvex to 1000.00.I buy my khaki pants at Target for 20 bucks and they are just as good as any other,my Brooks Bros dress shirts at the Salvation Army 5 bucks!I refuse to pay hard earned money NOW for things that just are NOT worth it.Who cares if you drive a BMW or wear a Patek watch I certainly DO NOT.Its been done before,its nothing new folks,its BS.I guess I am just becoming a crotchity old man and see these young bucks sporting there vintage watches,cars,clothes name it its been done before,your not doing anything different,been there done that,and who cares.Be an individual.Stop following the foolish trends,Play you own music!!!

 

[Max Flash]

I hear you and there is a lot of truth in what you say. I can't stand it when I see a young guy wearing a Patek or an oversized Rolex and thinks he knows it all, when in fact he is just a sucker for airport/GQ ads. Watches are intensely personal things - you don't just buy the latest one out and think everyone will consider you have great taste.

Things do cost a lot now for no reason - when you can have a suit tailor-made for the cost of some off the peg suits, there's a problem (with the cost of the off the pegs, that is). However, I think the reason for the cost of vintage items is because of demand for quality items - there's a reason they last longer: better materials and better workmanship than many items nowadays. Also scarcity increases the value: an original wartime flight jacket was presumably easier to come by 30 or 40 years ago than it is now.

Finally, let's not forget that people have more disposable income now than even 20 years ago. And people will spend what they have, even at silly prices.

 

[Pilgrim]

I'm in pretty much the same place.

What I think it means is: we have common sense!

Something is only "worth" what it's worth to you. I love some of the hats I've seen go for $200 or more, but I simply don't have $200 to spend on a hat - so I don't. I'd love to have a better Panama and I intend to buy it from PanamaBob, but my targets of opportunity are about $75 and under - so it waits.

I have a 1963 Fender Precision bass upstairs, and it's probably worth over $2000. But I didn't pay that for it - my parents bought it and a Bassman amp and speaker cabinet in 1967 for about $300. And I will assure you: as an instrument, that 1963 P-bass is NOT WORTH $2000. It's no better than a brand-new P-bass that you can buy used (as we did) for $700 or so.

The problem with many prices is that as people age, they get more money - and many of them spend it on things from their childhood or that they are nostalgic about. I frankly don't know where people GET the money, but they spend (IMO) silly amounts on things that are nostalgic.

Look at the market in 60's muscle cars. Big-block Chevelles and Camaros are north of $60,000 in impeccably restored shape. Numbers-matching hemi 'Cudas bring a quarter-MILLION dollars! That's silly money any way you cut it. The people buying them have the money - and it's theirs to spend - but even though I make a good living, I'll never have that kind of money to drop on a car - and I would not do so if I could.

I buy my jeans at Ross or TJ Maxx - I have Ralph Lauren Polo jeans that I paid $16 for. That's just about right. I paid $34 for some 501's last year, and that's the most I've EVER paid for a pair of jeans.

You guys stick to your guns, buy smart, pay only what it's worth to you, and enjoy life. :eusa_clap I use Ebay a lot because it's a great way to increase my options at low cost.

Just because someone is willing to spend silly money for a watch or anything else doesn't mean it's a good idea.

 

[nicemouth]

Sounds like sour grapes to me.

If you buy your khakis at Target, what do you care what others spend their money on? Are you irritated that the "young bucks" have gobbled up the vintage khaki "market" by spending too much for the same old stuff that you want to buy? If so, you've found a solution: Target. More power to you.

I collect lots of antiques and vintage clothing. If something is too expensive or I can't afford to buy it, I don't. Simple as that. No one has a gun to my head. Complaining about the price of anything (unless it's a basic necessity-food, water, heat, etc) when there are clearly so many other options available (Target for pants) is silly.

I know collectors who seek out antique cocktail swizzle sticks. Some of those swizzlers go for HUGE $$. Have they stopped collecting? No, they buy what they can afford and enjoy the collection process while learning about the history. It's not about the money, but even if it was, who cares??

There has always been, and will always be, inflated prices in every market, both justified and unjustified. Everything has indeed been done before, but that doesn't stop me from enjoying the ride right now.

 

[Doug C]

Well, I think that the young "bucks" that you see sporting the vintage stuff, are doing it to set themselves apart from their peers or rather the general population of their generation who typically are not doing the same things and who are not aware of how cool certain items from the past are. I just see it as being more unique than most of the hip-hop based youth wear that you usually see. But, I do feel there is a huge lack of creativity in design, dress, style, music... everything nowadays and that's really sad.

Doug C

 

[Matt Deckard]

It's always new to be old. That's where the new comes from.

I'm glad it gets people riled up sometimes, shows that somewhere deep down they care.

Anywho, It's not about having the coolest toy sometimes... nor about getting reactions sometimes like the one in the first post... it's about feeling good and sometimes feeling like you look good whether it be a stone sundial watch or a Hamilton Reverso.

Has it all been done before? Not on me!

 

[MadelienneBlack]

If Khaki from Target suits you fine, then wear it. But don't put down those who it may not suit.

To ditto the sentiments of some of the others who have posted here, no one forces me to spend thousands of dollars on a vintage item. I recognize that certain things are just not worth their high price tag. But to me, some items are worth a little extra dough. So I'll save up for them, or wait until they drop to a reasonable price. I'm not about to make myself bankrupt to have an antique record player.

Like Matt said, "it's always new to be old".

I have a few vintage sweaters and dresses that fit me better than any other article of clothing I've ever owned. So for me, it's about the feel of the clothing, not about looking cool or seeing what reaction I can get. For me, Target doesn't always cut it.

I guess my point is just because it may not seem worth it to you, doesn't mean that's the truth for everybody.

 

[Dr Doran]

Almost everything I find is very cheap or free ... I spend fairly good money on a (very) few things, but even those are usually things I find on discount ... and that's what works for me.

But part of this seems to be about feeling beaten in the competition of collecting vintage and that is a part of feeling outmatched by other people in general, people who you don't think have taste as good as you have.

Here is my attitude, and it works for me. Even if some young (or older) bucks have cooler watches than my pseudo-repro Stauer, there are things I know (and possess) that are cooler than they will ever, ever dream of, ever possibly conceive of.

No matter how many Patek Phillippe watches they have, they cannot read ancient Greek, and that's something that no one can take away from me -- and it is arguably cooler to be able to read Homer in the original, as well as more difficult, and much more unusual in America, than to collect a lot of vintage knickknacks that can be lost in a fire or a robbery. Even if they can read ancient Greek, they don't have the old punk rock records they have. And even if they have those, they haven't collected the experiences I have, and they don't have my taste.

So, not much angst here, but I understand your annoyance. The buddhists have a point in the way they talk about desire, and how desire is the source of so much angst. In my opinion you're probably doing the right thing by buying Target trousers. You may get sick of them and start collecting vintage again, or collecting something else, or learning more languages, or discovering other things that you find to be as incredibly interesting and cool as collecting vintage ever was ... there is a lot of interesting stuff in this world waiting for you to find it, to immerse yourself fully in it.

How about learning Portuguese and cultivating an expertise in Brazilian cinema? Becoming an expert on economics? Learning carpentry? Learning to surf? Investigating the history of Bali? Acting in plays? Reading all of T.S. Eliot and John Donne? Learning, really learning, oil painting or Chinese brush landscape painting? Judo? Krav Maga? Investigating Israeli-Palestinian politics and history to the point where you can confidently say your understand the conflict better than anyone else on the face of the earth? Collecting something almost no one collects now, such as rare leaves? All kinds of things are out there to fire you up, and you can put vintage on the backburner for a few years and get back to it when you are 65! It'll still be there for you ... and who knows? maybe the craze will have died down again, and prices will have become reasonable again.

 

[KY Gentleman]

I think the prices of certain vintage items are ridiculous, too.
But there are many items other than hats, watches that are still very reasonable. Vary your interests on the "vintage era" stuff and you'll find other items that are less expensive. Then sit on them for awhile and you may have found the prices have gone up on those items as well and you'll have the last laugh.lol

 

[mannySpaghetti]

Geez, prices on just about everything is cock-eyed isn't it? I've seen prices on vintage items skyrocket as of late just like you bb, but being the bargain predator I am, I find what I need. I leap for joy when I make a score and just say "shucks!" when I fail to. But that's the fun part of it, the thrill. Bah, let the youngin's have their fun too, you know? Hey, iIf they want to spend a kajillion dollars on something, let 'em and when they're starving and have no money, maybe they can eat it. lol Don't let it get under your skin so much. Everytime it get's your blood boiling, it takes away the joy for you and that ain't good.

 

[bburtner@moran]

Good Replies Folks

I see some threads here and I respect your opions ie "sour grapes" you have to be my childs age,she spends 200.00 on blue jeans!Hey its her dough.We can all debate this till the cow`s come home(it`s and old expression HAH,HAH).I picked out the threads from the older set and they seem to get it.But hey what do I know I have only lived 56yrs and have been at the same job for 37yrs!! and still can not retire.I am high school educated and a NYU drop out,and maybe and I do mean maybe middle class,lambasted,It`s another OLD expression)by my kid that I should have gotten my degree,thats why I bitch and moan about most everything, ie money,the change in the neighborhood,the music that I listen to or play the "Target" khakis that I buy she knows NOTHING yet!She may educated to the max and much smarter than the old man,but she is not a "MUSTANG"for you younger folks coming up through the military ranks from a private. Well I still don`t get it.Sorry about that.Yes I am bitter,you bet, and have every right to be,worked hard all my life for the so called material things I have, left the nest at 18,back then,yes way back then who wanted to live with mommy and daddy.So throw some more NEW opinions in or let it rest.I will leave this problem with the younger generation they are smarter than me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[LordBest]

As a 'young buck' who wears vintage, I have to say not all of us do it to be trendy or hip. I wear vintage clothes, or at least vintage style clothes, because I love the styles, and they suit me. Modern clothing most definitely does not suit me. I try to buy cheap in thrift shops and on eBay because that is economical, if there is something I really want, like an exceptionally fine Homburg, I will pay more for it.

 

[nicemouth]

I have read your second email. I see now that your frustration goes much deeper than the current price of antiques and vintage. Perhaps you can share your experience and knowledge about the marketplace with other young folks, including your daughter. Since it's true that everything comes back around again, I'm sure it would be appreciated...if not now, certainly in the future

Good luck to you~

 

[carter]

You know, I've been following this discussion and think it's worth mentioning that people of all ages are spending good money for older/vintage items. There are older folks who buy these items for at least two reasons. One is because they've reached a point in life where they can afford things that they could not when they were younger. That's easy to understand. The second is that they are purchasing things that remind them of a certain time in their life. This could be about a person, a place, an event, etc. It's easy to see how the two work together.

The value of vintage items is set by the marketplace. The marketplace is people. Sure, some of this may be trendy (it could as easily be speculation or investing) but a lot of folks are following their own drummer.

In the end, I believe we'd all be well advised to accumulate friendships and experiences. Possessions can come and go. A lifetime of memories can be treasured. A life well-lived can be it's own reward.

 

[shortbow]

Great thread. Glad somebody saw fit to bring it up. Bottom line? Lots of folks now days are confused about the difference between value and price.

 

[Fletch]

bbburt, I know how valuable time and space can be to a New Yorker (I used to live amongst you). But it couldn't hurt to tap the spacebar a little more often, and maybe, once in a while when you're feeling particularly expansive, the return key.

Beyond that though, I applaud your thrifty instincts and wish you continued good hunting and balm for your psychic sorenesses.

 

[nicemouth]

Amen to that.

Take THAT, bburtner! How DARE you post your thoughts without first consulting the most recent edition of the Acceptable Online Keystroke Guide for Internet Forum Postings...

(Actually, I could read your ideas very clearly and appreciate your experienced opinions--thanks for them)

 

[J. M. Stovall]

bbburt, I know how valuable time and space can be to a New Yorker (I used to live amongst you). But it couldn't hurt to tap the spacebar a little more often, and maybe, once in a while when you're feeling particularly expansive, the return key.

Beyond that though, I applaud your thrifty instincts and wish you continued good hunting and balm for your psychic sorenesses.

Maybe he sold his space bar back before it was trendy to have one.

 

[Tomasso]

Oh, I see that I'm late to the pity party. Yes, markets blow up and price people out. Every market that I've ever participated in has done so to me at one time or another.


C'est la vie, mon ami.

 

[bburtner@moran]

My Apology Folks

In my thread I had no intentions of raining on anyones parade,I guess there are other sites to vent a persons thoughts.....I guess the Lounge is really just for people who are into feeling good about things.Enjoy your endeavers.It was nice.BB