Is there a line and, if so, how/where do you draw it?

[Superfluous]

A while back, I used to peruse StyleForum – I have not in many months. I was frequently perplexed by photos of $4,000 leather jackets owned by self-described students/low-earners. It appeared that some members were allocating a remarkably high percentage of their disposable income to clothing that was arguably disproportionate to their other assets and living circumstances, and likely compromising other aspects of their life to fund their considerable clothing expenditures.

I suspect that it is relatively common for people to spend disproportionate amounts of their disposable income on pursuits/products that they are passionate about, and to make sacrifices in other aspects of their life to fund their passions. For example, when I was an active watch collector, I encountered fellow enthusiasts who spent over $10,000 for a new watch, notwithstanding that they were living pay-check to pay-check. In the car community, I have encountered people who drive $100,000 cars, but live in $1,500 per month apartments. Is that out of alignment?

I suspect that, if you asked disproportionate spenders why they sacrifice certain things in order to fund their passions, they would reply that the identified sacrifices are not sacrifices at all because they don’t care about the car/watch/clothing/fill-in-the-black that they are foregoing. The kid who drives the $100,000 car, but lives in a $1,500 apartment, could care less about his living quarters, but derives immense pleasure from his car. Is he wrong?

Whether it be watches, jackets, cars, wine or art, I personally believe that there should be some rational relationship between one’s passion expenditures and one’s disposable income and living circumstances. I personally would not dream of foregoing home ownership to fund a jacket, car or watch. That said, my opinion is exactly that – a subjective opinion. I might be perplexed by how others allocate their disposable income, and what sacrifices they make, but who am I to judge or disapprove. If they are happy with their allocation, and can take care of anyone they are responsible for caring for, god bless them if they want to wear a $4,000 jacket and a $10,000 watch while riding a bus to work because they cannot afford a car.

What do you think? Are the hobbyists out of their mind for spending a significant portion of their disposable income/savings on what makes them happy, notwithstanding the sacrifices they must make to fund the expenditures? Or, are the conservative, budget conscious folks foolishly compromising their happiness by denying themselves more of what makes them smile? Where is the balance, and how is it achieved? Do you endeavor to strike a balance? Is there a line and, if so, how/where do you draw it?

 

[xmr]

Aren't a lot of these accounts (especially on instagram etc) paid for by the clothing industry and used as product placement?

 

[navetsea]

I would say I don't care about what others spend their money on, as long as it doesn't make them criminals.
personally I won't spend +$1000 on anything hobby related or being victimized by trend or consumerism, because it won't bring lasting happiness.

I think my limit is how mentally I can see it just as another stuff I use and wear, so I can behave and function perfectly normal around things and people.

 

[Seb Lucas]

People have been trying to fill holes in their lives through the relentless pursuit of consumer goods for a long time. I've done it. I guess it's better for you than substance abuse. Owning a showy watch may well feel better than renting a nice apartment. Who can tell when people's emotional needs are in play?

I personally prefer minimalism these days and am loathed to spend more than $100 on anything.

 

[Harris HTM]

well, I guess your "needs" are always proportional to your income. 15 years ago as a college student I was happy with a pair of jeans worth 30e. Not anymore.
As for me, I wouldn't pay more than 2000e per year for a hobby item, let it be a leather jacket, a musical instrument or a better pair of floor speakers. Moreover I always want to have a minimum amount of savings.
If in 15 year I earn double then maybe I will spend more.
On the other hand I know people who live with roommates but spend half their month salary to get the new i-phone or i-pad.
Everyone has his own line. For me it is strictly defined by my income and savings. For others not - that's why there are so many people with debt on their credit cards.

 

[HoosierDaddy]

I've allowed myself, had the opportunity, and then got 'caught up' in having/obtaining objects that many would declare impractical in some ways. Enjoying many of them along the way, it seems I gradually found myself becoming more 'down to earth' (if you will) finding more enjoyment in just having fewer 'premium' possessions decided upon with the knowledge I did gain by years of pursuing these somewhat top of the line items.
Now less seems to offer better appreciation or value for me. Many struggles and long searches have led me to where I am now. My fascination with sports cars has changed more to comfort (although I can still get 'fired up'), but I do now manage to reign myself in actually to a happier place (perhaps it's age). My joy has changed to wearing, using the premium items that I have rather than always on the hunt for something that is perhaps the next step up. However, I never was one to finance things to the hilt and push things to or beyond the limits.
This might sound kinda 'goody goody' or even maybe self promoting but I also would rather help and surprise others. Whether a Grandchild with college help, even a stranger in need..or just a little dream for someone else.
I guess what I am trying to say is...I don't care to judge anyone in their quest for life. Yet..an 'addiction' is something to overcome and CAN lead to actually a better place.
HD

 

[Fanch]

Well said HD.

 

[scotrace]

"But live in $1500 apartments..."

That would get you a palace with servants in these parts. It's all relative.

My own life has gone through many, many changes in the last seven or eight years. A complete upheaval, and it isn't done heaving yet. Such a thing completely refocuses your priorities and your view of possessions. The hats, jackets, suits, ties, shoes (and other material items and collections) in my world, once a source of pleasure, are now viewed as burdens and stranded cash. The market is such that I'd scarcely recoup my investments, and there it all sits, taking up space, requiring space I don't want to provide it. I've seriously thought about having the auctioneer in to get rid of everything but the few threadbare things I still wear. But few, if any, in my area would pay anything for the things I've been so passionate about.
I'd like to be shed of it all, and do something meaningful. God has better things for me to do than acquire and admire my things.
I think it's a shift, as one gets older, also, as HD said. In time, you weed out the things you really don't need and seek to lighten the burden. I don't judge others for their passions, and I love to see what others here are finding and sharing. But for me, the pleasure comes in people, in experiences, in quiet prayer, in reading and study. As much as I like to see everyone's jackets, hats, etc., I like to see the pleasure you derive from finding something new more.

 

[Carlos840]

You would be surprised how many people live over their incomes and find it completely normal!
My brother has a nice flat, in a converted factory, all 4 flats in there share the same heating system. Recently work had to be done on the boilers.
One of the family living there is a couple with two kids, mother doesn't work, father does, they do a lot to appear upper class.
They have lunch out every day just across the road, each have a nice BMW and the husband has at least 7 collectible cars ( old maserati, beetle, jags) and they go on holiday all the time.

When the bill for the work done on the heating came along they couldn't pay 1500 euros! They literally said they couldn't afford to pay the bill, because they had just gone on holiday.
The idea that you would spend all your money on restaurants, holidays and cars, whilst not having at least some sort of savings to deal with unplanned spending is madness to me, but normal to them...

In my opinion, as long as you have enough money saved to live at your current rate of spending for a few months (which could also double as an emergency fund), and an income that allows you to keep saving a little monthly, then spend away!

 

[cuchulain]

I earn a good wage as an IT executive, but I also have a lot of bills, I own two leather jackets each well under 1K, three watches with the most expensive being a Seiko MM300, I drive a Honda Civic, etc... Point is I've always stayed within my means until this year when I put in a swimming pool. That project was awful, everything that could pop up as an extra cost did, I ended up putting a lot on credit until I can pay it off with my bonus in February. I've never done that before, but I just needed the project done so I went with it. I hate the stress it creates and I can't wait to getting back in the black.

I couldn't live constantly extending myself on objects, it's crippling really.

 

[RJR]

I've allowed myself, had the opportunity, and then got 'caught up' in having/obtaining objects that many would declare impractical in some ways. Enjoying many of them along the way, it seems I gradually found myself becoming more 'down to earth' (if you will) finding more enjoyment in just having fewer 'premium' possessions decided upon with the knowledge I did gain by years of pursuing these somewhat top of the line items.
Now less seems to offer better appreciation or value for me. Many struggles and long searches have led me to where I am now. My fascination with sports cars has changed more to comfort (although I can still get 'fired up'), but I do now manage to reign myself in actually to a happier place (perhaps it's age). My joy has changed to wearing, using the premium items that I have rather than always on the hunt for something that is perhaps the next step up. However, I never was one to finance things to the hilt and push things to or beyond the limits.
This might sound kinda 'goody goody' or even maybe self promoting but I also would rather help and surprise others. Whether a Grandchild with college help, even a stranger in need..or just a little dream for someone else.
I guess what I am trying to say is...I don't care to judge anyone in their quest for life. Yet..an 'addiction' is something to overcome and CAN lead to actually a better place.
HD

+1

 

[Lean'n'mean]

"Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen pounds, nineteen shillings, and six, result happiness. Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds ought and six, result misery." - Mr. Micawber in 'David Copperfield'.

 

[Doctor Damage]

"But live in $1500 apartments..."

That would get you a palace with servants in these parts. It's all relative.

Ha ha, I was just going to say the same thing! Outside NYC, $1500 gets you a pretty nice apartment...

On a side note, clothing is actually a 'safe' thing to spend money on since it requires little or no maintenance, has longevity, and (if you stick with classic styles) has long-term currency. What do you get more bang for your buck from? A conservative looking $500 suit, or the latest $500 Apple product? Only one of those two purchases will still be useful to you in 5 or 10 years from now.

 

[tblay]

You pose an excellent question, @Superfluous, and as always, I enjoy reading your thoughts here. For me, it has to do with two questions:

1. What is enough?
2. Am I causing harm to myself or others?

The second one can be complex, but much less so. There's a reason Debtor's Anonymous exists. During a certain period of my life, I ran through 50% of my savings trying to, as someone else pointed out, fill a void via consumerism. The answer to my second question above became a resounding, "Yes." Philosophers have been attempting to answer the first question since time immemorial.

 

[Lean'n'mean]

We live in a society where satisfying one's desires & whims primes over everything else. It's normal that those raised in such a mindset should pass their lives in a state of perpetual want & see no harm in succumbing to temptation, even if it puts them in financhial difficulties...... frustration for them is a far worse fate than not being able to pay the bills.

Interesting that the OP used these terms;

certain things in on what makes them happy,

foolishly compromising their happiness by denying themselves more of what makes them smile?

suggesting that firstly, happiness can only be achieved by obtaining what you want & secondly, happiness should be their main concern.......I pity the poor fools who don't want anymore & are content with what they have, there's no place for them in this world .

 

[nick123]

My dad is on the verge of retirement and the discussion pertaining to it revolves around what plane to buy. From my vantage point I see this as probably not the smartest way to handle one's cash and I worry. Better to buy gold and stash it in the walls or build a fallout shelter. The same way I foolishly and blindly splurge on a jacket anytime I find some disposable income. But we both find comfort in these outlandish purchases relative to our income levels and I think this impulse is normal. But yes, if it brings harm to others by foolishly spending better to not buy.

 

[skydog757]

It depends on what's driving it. Possession acquisition/purchases and substance abuse can both be maladaptive behaviors if done in excess. There are many others, but what they all fail to do is deal with the root cause of the problem. Many profoundly unhappy people, rather than put in the work to gain the insight to truly change, continue this maladaptation until some crisis inevitably forces them to change the behavior (but not the mindset). Change, good or bad, is hard. We tend to get entrenched in our thinking and put off self examination for as long as possible; after all, it's much easier to go out and buy another (insert favorite item here) and get that fleeting 'good' feeling than admit that what you've been doing for years just doesn't work and you've wasted so much time and money. If doing was as easy as saying, there'd be no need for counselors, therapists and psychiatrists (or jails and prisons for that matter). I do know that there are a lot of unhappy people out there trying to stave off depression one buy at a time and will deny that until the day that they die.

And on the flip side, there many individuals who are able to find that balance. Having a beer or buying something that you don't really need aren't inherently bad things, you just have to be honest about what it is that you are trying to achieve or avoid. If it interferes with your life as you would like it to be, then it's a problem.

 

[Seb Lucas]

I pity the poor fools who don't want anymore & are content with what they have, there's no place for them in this world .

They are my heroes.

 

[navetsea]

sometime their motive to buy stuff is to be acknowledged by others, to join a "club" of owners, let it be vehicle or wristwatch or gadget or fashion item or even exotic animals, and once they're in the club it would only getting deeper into it because they talk about it all the time and can't help but buying more to stay relevant within the group.
I think that motive is wrong, and probably it is wise if that person would stay away from such group and re-evaluate his feeling for a moment and draw line for himself if they truly desire those things they bought.

 

[ton312]

I think what gets people upside down is the pursuit. Of happiness, of material possessions, of things in general, none of which provide any real, lasting joy. The acquisition offers much less satisfaction. It's the thrill of the hunt, that drives people beyond their means. Myself very much included on many an occasion. My bizarre fixation fostered by this personality disorder has landed me Locked in the pursuit of "the perfect leather jacket." If I had it I wouldn't recognize it, and I'd continue on because it's the hunt that provides the thrill. Ive long been on a catch and release approach. I could've stopped collecting jackets ten years ago and had a perfect, by all reasonable accounts, set of leather jackets, mostly vintage, with a combined worth of less than the cost of one used Aero. Fit and quality all good enough by any real means of measure. Yet here I am. I do feel as though I'm coming to the end of my journey with this pursuit. Just a realization that what's driving me to collect these things is not the object itself and that energy is honestly better spent elsewhere. I've spent more than I probably should but sold back enough to break even, if not close enough. My name is Tony. And I'm a jacketaholic.