Is "Boys/Men Only" too Taboo?

[Derek WC]

I completely agree with Chas. It may be me, but if I am around humans of the opposite equation too long, I start to go nuts. I mean, I do not dislike women, we men just need our own time to set down and talk about manly things.

 

[SGT Rocket]

I concur

There have always been the need for oppurtunities for both sexes to congregate in a same-sex situations or environments; I think that it is vital. There should be men-only clubs and organizations, and visa-versa. I was fairly active in a men's group for awhile during my "Iron John" phase, and I had some pretty positive experiences of that. The women that were connected to the men in the group respected it and it worked. I think that it's good for kids to congregate from time to time in same-sex peer group situations as well.

In many societies it is the men that initiate boys into manhood; the women do the same for the girls. We could learn a lot from that.

To suggest that children be denied the experience of being in a same sex group for a significant part of their upbringing is narrow-minded, to say the least.

I too went through a "mens movement" phase, though not the Iron John type (good book though). I concur with your post above. I also think it depends a lot on the individual.

And, with respect to other posters and the "research" that is out there saying that boys and girls think alike, that has not been born out with my experiences with my own children, friends, and relatives. I think it is "nature" and "nurture." There is no way I will believe a statistical study with verbal scores, brain diagnostics, and voodoo that says women and men are alike. If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, and looks like a duck; then it's a duck.

A quick google search found this: http://www.medicaleducationonline.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=46&Itemid=69

I still go with the duck statement above. I think, sometimes, present company excluded of course, that people can become so over educated that they lose their common sense.

 

[MissHannah]

So research projects done by actual psychologists, sociologists and neurologists are deemed so untrustworthy as to necessitate the use of speech marks, but your personal anecdotal observations about your own kids are facts that can speak for the rest of the human race? Fascinating stuff.

Nice comparison between brain diagnostics and voodoo too.

 

[John in Covina]

So research projects done by actual psychologists, sociologists and neurologists is deemed so untrustworthy as to necessitate the use of speech marks, but your personal anecdotal observations about your own kids are facts that can speak for the rest of the human race? Fascinating stuff.

Nice comparison between brain diagnostics and voodoo too.

People dismiss anything that was funded by big business such as big tobacco or the oil companies.

 

[Fletch]

Growing up should be less about becoming a man or a woman and more about becoming an adult.

It's never too late to learn your gender identity. Hell, I'm still working on masculinity in my 40s. It's a shade tree project, like an old car that never quite runs perfectly.

 

[LordBest]

There was an article recently in one of my mothers psychology journals detailing a study which found that boys perform better in a co-educational environment whereas girls perform better in a single sex environment. Rather awkward, if accurate.

 

[Undertow]

It's never too late to learn your gender identity. Hell, I'm still working on masculinity in my 40s. It's a shade tree project, like an old car that never quite runs perfectly.

:eusa_clap

 

[Puzzicato]

There was an article recently in one of my mothers psychology journals detailing a study which found that boys perform better in a co-educational environment whereas girls perform better in a single sex environment. Rather awkward, if accurate.

That was what we were taught at university. But yeah - hard to engineer.

 

[SGT Rocket]

Yes, that is correct.

So research projects done by actual psychologists, sociologists and neurologists are deemed so untrustworthy as to necessitate the use of speech marks, but your personal anecdotal observations about your own kids are facts that can speak for the rest of the human race? Fascinating stuff.

Nice comparison between brain diagnostics and voodoo too.

Sorry, I didn't mean to offend. But, I do believe my own observations over research that probably has an agenda. I also have other inputs, like my world view (from my religion, I'm not a literal-ist), experiences of others, and other research~note my link.

 

[Undertow]

People dismiss anything that was funded by big business such as big tobacco or the oil companies.

I've been on the fence with this issue.

In my eyes, where there's money, there's greed. Where there's greed, there are lies. And when people are lying to one another over money, you may as well fill out your own funeral arrangements ahead of time because you'll inevitably be a number on a sheet somewhere sooner or later.

On the other hand, I don't want to believe that a group of professionals would so willingly comprimise their reputation and ethics. [huh]

 

[MissHannah]

Sorry, I didn't mean to offend. But, I do believe my own observations over research that probably has an agenda. I also have other inputs, like my world view (from my religion, I'm not a literal-ist), experiences of others, and other research~note my link.

You didn't offend me, you horrified me.

 

[SGT Rocket]

You didn't offend me, you horrified me.

Wow, I've never "horrified" anyone before. Well, I did horrify my mom one time when I came home from a "punk" concert in High School.
fftopic:
What is it about my post that horrified you? The anthropologist in me is intrigued. Are you sure you mean horrified? Have you never met anyone with ideas/beliefs far different from yourself?

Never mind, I apologize for horrifying you. We can just agree to disagree. Friends disagree all the time. I don't want to take this too far from the theme of the original poster.

 

[BoPeep]

Just to toss this into the mix . . . last year a public elementary school in Green Bay, WI, split the 4th and 5th grade classes for several hours of the day. The local news reported how the testing scores for both boys and girls improved over the course of the year. While split, the two groups had topics better suited to them (ie. the boys were reading action/adventure books instead of Charlotte's Web). Reportedly, there was less distraction of the boys picking on the girls and less of the girls snickering about the cute boys. But having a co-ed class for part of the day avoided the social development warping problem. I think this points to the benefits of both structures.

 

[skyvue]

I have traveled around the world, literally, and I have found that no matter what the race, nationality or for the most part, culture, that all men tend to think and act alike and all women tend to think and act alike.

I say this with all due respect, but in my opinion, that's a vast overstatement. Throughout my life, whenever I've come across magazine stories, quizzes and such that compare and contrast the sexes, I have invariably answered or identified more as a woman would than a man.

And yet, I'm strictly heterosexual with no particular feminine leanings. All man, as some would say. But I don't fit the cliches that are blithely tossed around about how men are supposed to think and behave.

Is that nature or nature or personal choice?I don't know, but there it is. And I don't think I'm alone in this.

The notion that gender is more distinct than race is arguable, at best. Come to NYC -- I'll introduce you to dozens of people who will have you questioning that theory: butch women, fem men, trans men, trans women, and everything in between (and I run in pretty standard circles, I'm not hanging out in shadowy waterfront bars). There's a whole spectrum of behavior and lifestyle and biology out there.

As for single-sex schooling, I can see its benefits, but I consider the social aspect of education as vital as the academic. One might well emerge from 16 or more years of single-sex schooling very well educated, but will one be prepared then to make one's way in society? I question that. Similarly, I wouldn't send my kids (if I had them) to an exclusive private school. The academics offered there might be top-notch, but the social education would be lacking.

 

[MissHannah]

Thank you Skyvue - I'm so glad to see somebody talking some sense here. I was starting to despair of the human race.

 

[Tomasso]

Thank you Skyvue - I'm so glad to see somebody talking some sense here.

You mean besides yourself.....

 

[Honey Bee]

Hmmm...all very interesting.
I made an observation when I taught preschool (3-4 yrs) for our city run program a few years back. Each day I put out all the toys which included dress up clothes, trucks, the playhouse, dolls, legos...they were put out for play each day by all of the children. It was very interesting to watch...in one class, the girls "ruled" the house, dresssed in the mens' suits as well as heels and they told the 'man' of the house what needed to be done.
However, in another class we would have girls dressed in the feather boas and heels, playing mommy, saying no boys allowed!
Never did I hear the boys tell the girls they couldn't play with the trucks, play soccer outside and they like...it was always the girls telling the boys, "girls only".
I found this rather interesting because in the class where the girls did the "bossing" as a mother put it to me one day when she came in to help and her little guy got "bossed" by the girls (and obeyed them, much to mom's chagrin!), the only thing I could come up with was that when the girl with the stronger personality got together with other girls of similar personality, she would say no to the boys....when that girl was there on her own because the others were absent that day, she just did her own thing, was less vocal in general and ignored the play areas she favored when her pals were there. She needed to feel encouraged by her peers to be strong or she was simply timidwithout them.
While I never took a course after high school in psychology, I always wondered about how at 4 years old, she had already developed that awareness and would it serve her well or not in her future?

 

[LordBest]

I think I have found the study report I mentioned previously, if anyone is interested:
http://www.education.gov.uk/research/data/uploadfiles/RR636.pdf

Evidence in favour of the development of single-sex classes for some subjects, from both students' voices and from an analysis of levels of academic achievement, is nonetheless persuasive.

This may be of interest, too:
http://www.seductionlabs.org/2008/06/23/scientists-find-men-and-women-really-do-think-differently/

 

[Miss Neecerie]

...
(and I run in pretty standard circles, I'm not hanging out in shadowy waterfront bars). ...

Darn...

I needed a shadowy waterfront bar guide...

 

[SGT Rocket]

Interesting

Very interesting article Lord Best.

I opened up the PDF as well, I'll have to skim it and give it a through reading in the near future.

The article seems to go with the link to the article I posted above, which discussed the physical differences between the male and female brain.