How to Store Hats

[hatsRme]

I use uline hat boxes. They are cheap and are acid free.
http://www.uline.com/BL_5614/Hat-Wreath-Boxes

Trust, yet verify... Where do they specify the boxes to be acid free, Ed? It was not on the page linked, but I assume it's mentioned somewhere in their nomenclature.

 

[viclip]

Trust, yet verify... Where do they specify the boxes to be acid free, Ed? It was not on the page linked, but I assume it's mentioned somewhere in their nomenclature.

And now I'm all interested in picking up a load of the 16" square boxes of 7" height. I find it hard to locate boxes with that height, which is ideal for use in my shelving units (15" spacing between the shelves so I could double up the boxes).

 

[T Jones]

Moth Ball Smell

Regarding the moth balls...I like the smell of moth balls too but I wouldn't want my hats to smell that way, especially when I'm wearing them in public where everyone could smell it....so wouldn't the hats pick up that moth ball smell too?

 

[JonnyO]

Believe it or not it's getting cool here already

You aren't kidding, I think we skipped a month of summer this year.

 

[gtdean48]

Regarding the moth balls...I like the smell of moth balls too but I wouldn't want my hats to smell that way, especially when I'm wearing them in public where everyone could smell it....so wouldn't the hats pick up that moth ball smell too?

The reason I use cedar balls instead of moth balls...

 

[viclip]

Trust, yet verify... Where do they specify the boxes to be acid free, Ed? It was not on the page linked, but I assume it's mentioned somewhere in their nomenclature.

Being in hat storage crisis mode, I contacted uline's Canadian branch as to whether their hat boxes as well as their corrugated boxes, were acid free. Herewith their response:

<
Thank you for contacting Uline Customer Service.

The S-7960 - 16 x 16 x 7" Two-Piece White Hat/Wreath Boxes and the S-16747 - 15 x 15 x 7" Corrugated Boxes are not acid free. Please see the links below to some of our acid free boxes we carry.

Acid Free
http://www.uline.com/Product/AdvSearchResult.aspx?keywords=acid free

>

The link to their acid-free boxes didn't disclose anything that would be useful for my hats.
So now I'm on the hunt for acid-free hat boxes...does anyone know of a verified source?

 

[TheDane]

As I understand it, Art and Penman buy their at Sarah's Hat Boxes. There are also some from Hollinger - and University Products - and The Container Store - and The Empty Container Company - and The Family Archives - and you can probably find more via Google. You may have to make a hat ring from acid free cardboard for some of the 'cheaper' boxes, though

 

[The Wiser Hatter]

Should add that I use a plastic hat stand inside the box.

plastic-hat-stand
keeps the brim and crown nice between wearings.

 

[TheDane]

Ed, if acid free and chemical reactions are not of any interest - or for shorter periods of time - they are fine, but if I have paid a lot of money for an acid free hat box, I would not use a plastic stand in it.

 

[wine65]

Does anyone know if the Optimo boxes are acid free?

 

[The Wiser Hatter]

Ed, if acid free and chemical reactions are not of any interest - or for shorter periods of time - they are fine, but if I have paid a lot of money for an acid free hat box, I would not use a plastic stand in it.

You use the stand to keep your hat brim and crown from getting bent either in a box or on a shelf.
The original Hat boxes for Stetson, Mallory and to this day hat manufacturers do not worry about acid free.
I worry more about temperature and moth's.

 

[T Jones]

You use the stand to keep your hat brim and crown from getting bent either in a box or on a shelf.
The original Hat boxes for Stetson, Mallory and to this day hat manufacturers do not worry about acid free.
I worry more about temperature and moth's.

What would be a good temperature for storage? I keep my hats in my room away from heat and sunlight. Do I need to do more?

 

[mayserwegener]

I buy my boxes from Capas.

http://www.capasheadwear.com/

They sell low cost hat store boxes but there is a quantity limit (30?). They come with hat inserts. My guess is they are not acid free which doesn't matter to me.

I can also get Mayser hat boxes but there is a 50 quantity limit (probably about $7.00 a piece) although only 5.7 inches in height. Also their classic box which doesn't have a quantity limit (probably about $45.00 a piece).

I have a few of the classic ones which are really nice.

 

[The Wiser Hatter]

What would be a good temperature for storage? I keep my hats in my room away from heat and sunlight. Do I need to do more?

Like most things its the extreme temperatures that to me would cause problems Anything over 90 degrees and below freezing for long periods of time is what I am concerted with. That's why I use a closet. I am lucky in that my office has two large closet's. Previous owner was a woman who loved clothes so every bedroom has two of them upstairs.

 

[TheDane]

The original Hat boxes for Stetson, Mallory and to this day hat manufacturers do not worry about acid free.

The problems about storing materials started in the late 50's and 60's - Stetson, Mallory and others indeed made acid free hat boxes, just as everyone else did back in the day. They didn't know how to make boxes in any other way.

It's probably true, that today's manufacturers don't care about acid free hat boxes. They don't care much about hats in the first place, which is why most of us buy vintage on EBay. Furthermore most contemporary manufacurers of anything consider 'producing to last' as counter productive. What's good for you is not always good for the company [huh]

When we're able buy almost mint hats from the 1920's, 30's and 40's, it's very much due to careful storing in a neutral environments. If our parents and grandparents had had cabinets, drawers and boxes, made from the materials that we have today, we would not have all those beautiful old hats to choose from. Many of them would not still be in mint condition.

Technology, new materials and knowledge about these have given us a responsibility our ancestors didn't have. If we care about our children and grandchildren and their future number of artifacts of historical interest, we should care about how we handle and store these artifacts. It depends on whether we see ourselves as preservators of the cultural historical artifacts we buy - or not

 

[mayserwegener]

How do you know that old hat boxes were acid free? In some cases I have seen yellowing of old hat boxes. I am going to check if the Capas and Mayser boxes are acid free.

 

[TheDane]

How do you know that old hat boxes were acid free?

Because the problematic glues didn't exist, then. They were invented up through the 50's and 60's as a result of the scientific reserch, boosted by WWII. Modern plywood and chipwood is also made with these glues - and furniture made from such materials are not suited for archival storing and can not be used by museums.

Back in the 20's, 30's and 40's cabinetmakers also made furniture from glued together 'block board' - a lot of long 1/4" wooden battens, glued side by side between two rather thick (around 1/8") veneers. Boards like that was glued with hot glue, made from animal hides - almost neutral in acidity and free from chemestry. Today cardboard, plywood and chipwood is treated with a multitude of chemical substanses and glued with PVA and other glues, that are acidous and ooze off harmful gases

 

[The Wiser Hatter]

I have seen many hats that where not stored properly. Because no one really cared. They just put them in a box and stashed them away. No thought at all was given to the storage of a hat. It was not of any importance to the original owner at all. Its a miracle that the vintage hats we buy and wear get to us in good shape.

 

[mayserwegener]

Because the problematic glues didn't exist, then. They were invented up through the 50's and 60's as a result of the scientific reserch, boosted by WWII. Modern plywood and chipwood is also made with these glues - and furniture made from such materials are not suited for archival storing and can not be used by museums.

Back in the 20's, 30's and 40's cabinetmakers also made furniture from glued together 'block board' - a lot of long 1/4" wooden battens, glued side by side between two rather thick (around 1/8") veneers. Boards like that was glued with hot glue, made from animal hides - almost neutral in acidity and free from chemestry. Today cardboard, plywood and chipwood is treated with a multitude of chemical substanses and glued with PVA and other glues, that are acidous and ooze off harmful gases

What about paper hat boxes? I have seen discoloring and breakdown of old paper hat boxes.

Here is a article I found with some interesting information regarding acid free and the lack of lignin removal.

http://www.centuryboxes.com/features.php

I have seen some felt discoloration (lighter colors) in some hats stored in original boxes (NOS). I am not sure if this was from the boxes or a by product of the felting process. Felt damage is usually due to moths or some other insect. Storage temp and humidity being a big factor regarding sweatbands.

 

[TheDane]

Ed, I totally agree - it's a wonder, many are so well preserved. If the hat was put away in an old box back in the 50's or 60's, it's not that big a wonder, though. A felthat can easily live for many decades in a box from the 40's. Hats stored in a modern box today will most surely not be in mint condition in 50-70 years from now. Storing and chemistry in the environtment is probably the biggest problem for museums today. The issue is of gigantic proportions, as it seems to undermine the finances of museums all over the world.

My dad worked as a wood preservator on The Royal Danish Army Museum, and I remember how all at the museum panicked, when the government introduced a new law back in the late 60's (I think it was). If a fisherman got a canon or other historic artefact in his net, he was no longer allowed to let it glide back into the sea. He was obliged to take it ashore and contact a museum.

The intentions were really good, but the law resulted in a big loss of canons and other priceless artefacts. As long as a canon is under seawater, it can last for many many centuries. As soon as it gets up in the air, the corrosion and degeneration of the metal will destroy it in a week or three. It has to be 'drowned' in alcohol or clean salty water immediately as it reaches the atmosphere to survive.

A hat can survive many generations, when stored in a suitable environment. When replaced into an unhealthy environment, it can degrade seriously within few years.

What about paper hat boxes? I have seen discoloring and breakdown of old paper hat boxes.

Old paper and cardboard from before the late 50's is most likely acid free. What is the source of the discoloration is hard to say, but it does not necessarily have anything to do with acid or degrading chemistry