Horsehide mcycle jackets

[pjstrass]

has anyone compared Hillside USA with Legendary (made by Schott) compared to Aero and Lost Worlds

 

[Tommer45]

Hey PJ.. I can't help you out with all the brands you listed, but I do own Schott and Lost Worlds horsehide jackets. While the Schott is a quality jacket I don't think the horsehide is comparable to that of LW. The LW horse is just awesome.

My LW is 4+ oz HH and in my opinion it's a little heavy for motorcycle riding. I've been riding for 14 years and the thickness/stiffness of the hide is a little distracting (always trying to adjust for comfort). If I had it to do over again I'd go with a lighter horse. But in the end I usually always wear my Langlitz on the cycle anyway.

Tommer

 

[Tommer45]

Thought I might add this too.. I recently cut out the lining of my Schott 641HH cafe racer to get it relined with a lighter, non-quilted lining (for summertime use), and I found there to be a thick white felt fused to the horsehide. After contacting Gail at Schott I've learned that it adds body to the HH and helps to stiffen it up (otherwise it feels super thin!). Here are some quick pics with my cell phone of the felt. I'm having the jacket relined without the felt (took a while but I ripped it all out) so the jacket will really have a much lighter feel to it.

Tommer

 

[pjstrass]

Horsehide jackets

my Legendary HH by Schott is not too heavy IMO....and not as stiif and heavy as my U.S. Authentic A -2 HH. The info on the Schott lining is amazing news...I have the same jacket in naked leather...it is quite supple. I assume the Langlitz is their medium weight cowhide. Thanks for the replies.

 

[Tommer45]

I've got one Langlitz Cascade in medium weight cow and another in heavy cow. Both are awesome, and after a few coats of leather dressing over the past year and a half the medium weight nearly outweighs the heavy one.

Tommer

Heavy cowhide...

Medium-weight cowhide with a straight front zipper.

 

[Brutus]

Great looking jackets Tommer! Doesn't get any better than Langlitz.

 

[HoosierDaddy]

has anyone compared Hillside USA with Legendary (made by Schott) compared to Aero and Lost Worlds

Strange...I'd never heard of Hillside USA..although I've ridden motorcycles for years. However,their website layout looks very familiar. Wonder if they changed names in the past? I do like the looks of their D pocket.
http://www.hillsideusa.com/Horsehide_Collection_s/22.htm
I ride quite a few miles a year..and find a "super" hvy leather jacket..a bit too much. Comfort also means alot to me. I probably just don't have the patience or tolerance level to break-in a maximum hvy hide on the road. For that very reason I sold on a newly aquired Aero MC jacket made from their Hvy FQHH a few years ago. I do like and have quite a few Aero Hvy FQHH utility jackets and,in my view,for the street..is hard to beat.
My main riding jacket now is a lighterweight HH MC jacket (legendary..Schott)that was mostly comfy the day I purchased it. I think it comes down to personal preference..and what you're going to use the jacket for.
HD

 

[pjstrass]

Schott Legendary Horsehide

those comments are very helpful. I just discovered as a result that my horsehide Legendary by Schott does indeed have the felt lining as shown here. That said, I am concerned that what I thought was a very heavy 4 oz. horsehide might be less than that ...its' feeling of being so heavy and thick obviously comes to some degree from the inner lining. I am also concerned that if it gets wet enough, drying it out with felt inside could be a problem. Since you guys are more expert at these jackets than I am, does anyone have any thoughts about how thick / heavy the Schott horsehide actually is.....I note that Schott on its website does not quote a thickness or weight, as Legendary does....thanks....

 

[Tommer45]

Hey pjstrass.. I suspected that the Legendary jackets by Schott also had the felt "fuseable" as Gail referred to it. I'm kinda bummed that they do.. I love the Black Stallion and now I know that if I do buy one I'd have to rip out the lining, tear out the felt and get it relined if I wanted to enjoy it!

My 641HH Cafe Racer from Schott is nowhere near 4oz. With the quilted lining out, and the felt removed I was really shocked at how limp and thin the HH was. I wouldn't put it in the same ballpark as my LW 4+oz HH or my Langlitz in heavy cow. To be honest it's not even as thick as my mid-weight Langlitz. I'm no leather expert, but I do have quite a few jackets, and I'd probably say that at the absolute thickest some parts of the jacket are 3oz. Schott may be able to tell you differently.. I don't know.

As far as having any problems due to wetness, I had the jacket soaked through on one occasion where even the lining was soaked. I put the jacket on a nice wide hanger and let it dry for a few days... no problems whatsoever. No weird smells coming from the lining or felt beneath it.

Tommer

 

[Tommer45]

Figured I'd add this as well.. it's Schott's own words on the felt that is fused to the horsehide. Even after reading it several times I'm still not sure I totally understand what they're getting at.

In regards to your question on the material that is in your horsehide jacket. This is a vintage jacket and we still produce this vintage jacket the way it was made 60 years ago. Horsehide may be thick but the fibers holding it together are denser than they are flexible, horsehide is not a leather that is suppose to drape, it is known to have a very rigid hand. The material in the jacket is a heavy fuseable we apply to enhance the body form of the leather and for added protection of the leather when riding.

 

[CopperNY]

my "between the lines" reading is:

"we artificially stiffen the horsehide to make it feel like better horsehide."

 

[pjstrass]

horsehide

thanks..I agree ....it bummed me out, too. Gail did not answer my question on how thick and heavy the jacket is..as advertised by Legendary ....but her previous explanation really was that when the horsehide is from an older horse it may not be as robust as others and then they use the felt liner..seer her answer to my question on the Schott blog in their website.....guess I have to still rely on my old Vanson to have a bulletproof jacket....

 

[OneEyeMan]

I like Schott jackets as much as the next guy.
But if you ask me, Vanson makes the best motorcycle jackets.
True, they don't do HH any more, but their cowhide is super thick, nice grain, and really breaks in nicely.
Plus, the fit and finish was spot on for me.
Nice details like 2 internal belts at the waist keep external features to a minimum. They're adjusted by velcro so that everything is really flat. That's what you really want if you ever go down.
All that other stuff, pockets, belts, etc on the outside that stick out is really for show and won't help your hide if you go down.
Lenny

 

[Tommer45]

I've handled a few Vanson jackets and I agree that they are superbly made. Since I've never owned one though, my vote goes to Langlitz for the best motorcycle jackets available. Custom made to your sizes & specs. Here's my cafe race (their Cascade model). By far the most comfortable and best fitting leather jacket I have ever owned. It's 3.5-4oz cowhide (they have heavier stuff available).

Tommer

 

[CodeRed]

I hav a vanson HH, an aero HH and a langlitz in heavy steer. I would take the vanson over the others in the event of a spill, but difficult to use otherwise as it is really thick. Mine took about ten years to break in properly. Why did they stop the HH anyway?

 

[OneEyeMan]

When I inquired, they told me it was too hard to get or some other lame excuse. Aero and others don't seem to have much difficulty sourcing it.
I was all prepared to drive up to Vanson and try on jackets. Really like the Enfield, but not being able to get it in HH was a deal breaker for me.
So, I'm now waiting for an Aero Highwayman. The 2 jackets are really similarly styled.
But the Aero has the benefit of a beautiful tartan wool lining which the Vanson didn't. Plus, of course, it's HH. Plus, it's about the same price. (I ordered when the GB Pound was at it's lowest against the $).
Initially, I was apprehensive about ordering something without trying it on, but reading everybody's posts here gave me a good comfort level.
Now, all I have to do is be patient. Not something I'm good at.
Lenny

PS: Tommer, those Langlitz's are gorgeous. What's the red spot just below the breast pocket on the medium weight one?

 

[Peacoat]

I hav a vanson HH, an aero HH and a langlitz in heavy steer. I would take the vanson over the others in the event of a spill, but difficult to use otherwise as it is really thick. Mine took about ten years to break in properly. Why did they stop the HH anyway?

There are some on this board who believe break-in for a heavy HH jacket is a myth, and they are fine to wear fresh out of the box. Those of that persuasion probably never wore a heavy unbroken HH while riding a motorcycle (or any other activity that requires ease of movement).

 

[Martinis at 8]

The key is the thickness of the leather and the stitching. Racing leather suits are usually 1.6-1.8mm in thickness. For jackets, the same thickness and stitching can be obtained from Vanson. The liners are generally provided as insulation for warmth, not really for added protection (weight). So even without the liner, if the thickness is as described above then the abrasion protection remains the same. Vanson advertises the thickness used on its high-end jackets. When it doesn't advertise it, you are probably not getting racing thickness.

Personally I wear a synthetic mesh two-piece suit as show below.

The above suit gives adequate protection on par with leather at the velocities I travel (less than 90 mph), and it has armor in the right places. The drawback with synthetic suits is that they sacrifice themselves to save your skin. After a slide they need to be replaced. The drawback with leather, I have found, is that it has weather implications here on the Gulf coast where it is really hot and humid. In addition, it does not allow me to layer up/down for my long rides.

In a recent ride from Houston, TX to Saltillo, Mexico my elevation change was over 5,000 feet. I went from hot and humid Houston weather, to cool and arid mountainous weather in Mexico. With the synthetic suit I could expand and contract it in accordance with my layer needs, plus I have a wind/rain liner for it. The leather jackets aren't really engineered for this type of travel, though one can squeeze a heavy wool sweater underneath.

Nevertheless, I carry a fashion leather m/c jacket in my roll bag. This way I at least have a jacket to keep me warm when I get to my destination and am on foot, instead wearing the bulkier and armored synthetic jacket, which of course also has sleeves that are too long for normal wear. The picture below shows my m/c fashion jacket (Wilson's) once at my destination of Saltillo, Mexico. Notice my hat. Kinda hard to carry a fedora on the bike, plus a fedora would look kinda silly with an m/c jacket lol

 

[Graemsay]

I'd say the the thickness of leather is a bit thinner in the (European) suits that I've seen.

Most mass market motorcycle gear (Alpinestars, Hein Gericke, etc.) use 1 - 1.2 mm leather (2 1/2 to 3 oz.).

The better stuff, in particular CE rated suits, use around a 1.4 mm (3 1/2 oz.) thickness. BKS offer a 1.6 to 1.8 mm (4 to 4 1/2 oz.) thick hide as an option.

I've really got to post an update on my BKS experiences. (All good so far.)

As far as I can gather, these roughly correspond to the light, medium and heavy leather options from Langlitz.

A lot of racing suits are made out of kangaroo these days. This only comes in a 1 to 1.2 mm thickness, but is stronger than cow hide, so you can make a lighter suit out of it. That said, it's more of a crash once material, so if you want to fall off more often the stick with cow.

I'd be looking for double thickness leather on impact points (elbows and forearms, knees, backside, shoulders) to help cope with abrasion. Armour is also good, preferably the soft, rubber kind.

I heard a couple of things from an accident investigator too.

Firstly, the one piece Power Ranger suits are bad. They're harder to remove than a zip together two piece by an ambulance crew, and this has been known to cause pain and problems. Neither of which are a good result.

The zips on a two piece rarely, if ever, fail. And even if they do a properly fitted and constructed jacket shouldn't ride up.

Secondly, a well fitted (i.e. tight) leather jacket acts as a splint and can prevent damage from being worse than it otherwise would.

Oh, I agree that the Langlitz jackets look great.

 

[Tommer45]

PS: Tommer, those Langlitz's are gorgeous. What's the red spot just below the breast pocket on the medium weight one?

The red spot is nothin' special.. just a cool looking AMA pin that came with my membership. My brother has no idea what it is so I tell him it's my secret society pin and that I shouldn't be talking about it.

Tommer