Himel Brothers Leather

[HorseHide]

I used to impulse buy watches. Wife did not like that too much as they were about 1.5 Himel's each :lol:

+1 (I mean, except for the "used to" part :eusa_doh On the plus side, they take up much less closet space...

 

[Jeff M]

MM makes an interesting point. At the top end of the market, in terms of quality, it surely becomes a question of degree in terms of hide, build and design? Could you stick a GW next to an ELC and say "not only is the GW better, it's several hundred quid better"?

This is the same question that has been gone over again and again and again.
Intrinsic value vs. perceived value.
If it's worth it to the person who spent the money, then it's worth it to the person who spent the money.
If somebody doesn't think it's "worth it", then it's not worth it. To them.
If there is market for an item at a specific price point, then it is worth it to the market they are aiming for.
If there is no market for an item at a specific price point, then it won't sell and the manufacturer will either have to lower their prices or go out of business.

 

[Sloan1874]

I'm not being critical, god knows if I had the disposable income I'd be throwing it at them. If I was to modify the question and remove the second question about 'perceived value', perhaps it makes it more straight forward. After a certain point it becomes like the 100m dash nowadays: incremental - you move into the realms of time invested, research etc?

 

[HoosierDaddy]

I finally made my way to Self Edge in SF (which carries a dizzying array of denim - what a store!) to see the Himel Brothers products. They had both the Heron (a brown button front) and the Kensington (a black cafe racer). Both jackets are made with Japanese tanned horsehide and the design, fit and finish of the jackets is exquisite - top shelf stuff. But I walked out without either jacket (and without any regrets).

The Kensington is a nice garment - the stitching and liner really pop. But I paid just north of $1000 for my Goodwear Californian Racer and the Kensington is $1950. I'm not certain I would choose the Kensington over the Californian Racer if they were identically priced but with the meaningful difference in price (which I understand is smaller following the price increases at Goodwear) there is no question which jacket I would choose.

The Heron is a little different because you are also getting a somewhat unique style (which at first blush looks quite like the Levi's LVC Menlo) and that style is great IMO. The Heron is so loaded with fine details you can tell it was a labor love for DH. Great garment, just not something that I feel compelled to purchase at that price point.

Thanks,HH,for your up close review.. and personal comments. Interesting.
HD

 

[Ishmael]

Very happy to hear I was able to reverse psychologize you all in to believing I'm not an a**hole. LoL.

I can't respond to all the different comments, and anyway I obviously agree that there is a need to suss out the "value" of a jacket; that is, to consider how a jacket's "use value" (i.e. its utility, broadly conceived, to the user, and including possibly ethical-social-ecological ramifications) converges with its "exchange value" (the price it can fetch when it has to make the leap into the market Hic Rhodus, hic salta).

But, in the end, for me, it comes down to getting the jacket I want. Since I'm not a collector (exchanger), but a user (wearer), that means letting "use value" entirely trump "exchange value".

 

[andyfalzon]

Sure the Heron jacket is nice but way overpriced considering it is made of top grain horsehide, i.e. a lower quality leather than the much better Victory full grain horsehide that we offer (which is currently underpriced as an introductory price).

To give you an indication of the prices, see below a pair of boots made with Victory horsehide. Price close to Eur 1K

You realize of course that you need at least 4 times the quantity of leather to make a jacket.
One of our Victory horsehide jackets (with photos) is currently in the classifieds section.

On a side note, some people who say wouldn't spend more than $500-$700, I believe have not seen any jacket actually worth more than that. A jacket that really worths $2000 (and is not simply overpriced) makes others (of the $700 category) look like garbage compared to it. Such is the difference in the quality of the leather. Irrespective of if one can afford to pay such sum for a jacket, or if he can afford would not by his choice, at least he should be able to admit and recognize the value of something like that when he sees it (provided he has the ability to evaluate it).

 

[HoosierDaddy]

Good ending for this thread. Another jacket manufacturer intervening with a put down to then advertise his wares.

 

[ButteMT61]

Good ending for this thread. Another jacket manufacturer intervening with a put down to then advertise his wares.

Yeah, whoda thunk that someone would hijack a thread on TFL to pimp their business - almost never happens...

 

[Jeff M]

FWIW, I understand that Himmel Bros and Good Wear use some of the same leathers.
I've been very impressed with GW's leathers to date.

The person I referred to earlier who has a Heron on order received his jacket a few weeks ago. He is very familiar with the different leather jacket manufacturers who are often discussed here, including GW, with quite a collection of GW's passing through his hands.
He was very impressed with the Heron he received, specifically referring to the leather used.
He returned the jacket for some sizing adjustments.....last I heard is still awaiting the final product.

 

[Fletch]

I'm sorry, but I just keep seeing this thread and thinking the title is: Hitler Brothers Leather

No comparison intended! My contact lenses are disposable, and it's probably time to dispose them!

 

[andyfalzon]

Just helping you get the fact rights.
Top grain leather is lower quality than full grain, it's even written in Wikipedia.
But how are you supposed to know that if you are not into the leather business?
I don't see why being a manufacturer does not allow me to speak the truth.
People can read and make up their minds. We 're all grown ups here.

And it wasn't advertising. I got enough advertising in the classifieds section. I was pointing you there to see how the full grain leather looks like.

 

[Ishmael]

That boot is nasty.

 

[HoosierDaddy]

Yeah, whoda thunk that someone would hijack a thread on TFL to pimp their business - almost never happens...

Yeah..I thought vendors normally stuck to the merchant section for self promoting ads. Satisfied or potential researching customers usually post pics or admiration out here in the main thang. Maybe not.
We may even have jacket company 'wars of the better leathers' now. :cheer2:

 

[ForestForTheTrees]

That boot is nasty.

No kidding. Top shelf leather or not, those boots are best worn after dark, long after dark. Preferably on a moonless night.

 

[ButteMT61]

I didn't see the potential for humor in this thread. It's turning out to be more entertainment than I'd hoped for!

Victory Horse.

Mustang

What's next, Patton Battle Horse?

 

[Dr H]

We call our horse 'minced beef'...

 

[HoosierDaddy]

I don't know. Just feel there is a much better way of expressing what are top quality hides by another Jacket maker without stomping on Himel's hide. Could be wrong......
HD

 

[Fletch]

No kidding. Top shelf leather or not, those boots are best worn after dark, long after dark. Preferably on a moonless night.

Now those could bear the name Hitler Brothers. lol

 

[ButteMT61]

Now those could bear the name Hitler Brothers. lol

All I can muster is club-footed Victorian spinster...

 

[andyfalzon]

I don't know. Just feel there is a much better way of expressing what are top quality hides by another Jacket maker without stomping on Himel's hide. Could be wrong......
HD

Nothing against Himel, he's doing a great job. Each vendor has the right to price his goods as much as he likes. Price also depends very much on his costs. Returning to the issue of the $700 jacket, a NYC leather jacket company who is known since the 1950s and sells jackets by the thousands can afford to price them $700. Himel on the other hand, and others like Himel, address to a tiny small market and sell a very small number of jackets. Also, jackets like Himel's are all hand made and and not mass produced like others. But customers need to be educated to be able to tell the difference between those products.