It’s not a repro of that jacket per se. It just happens to feature the ribbon label. I have a version of this jacket (the one you’ve just posted, not the one in the link). The details are interesting but compare them and you’ll see the differences such as epaulette shape.
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Hidden in Plain Schott: the 613SH Perfecto
It’s not a repro of that jacket per se. It just happens to feature the ribbon label. I have a version of this jacket (the one you’ve just posted, not the one in the link). The details are interesting but compare them and you’ll see the differences such as epaulette shape.
Looks great with the collar and belt buckle details
Canuck Panda
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This 'Michael" perfecto is a version of 613US from 10 years ago. I got it NOS condition from Japan. I searched by using Japanese translation ショット・パーフェクト (Schott Perfecto), and paid ¥90,000 ($650). Same jacket in different sizing listed in English were asking for ¥140,000+ ($1000). So it pays to use Google translator and search using Japanese characters to get some better deals... If Schott offered this jacket in their regular line I will have no issue paying its full retail. It's that good!
This 613US variants is only 24" length, both back and sleeve. But the sleeve works because wide shoulder and there is almost 35" sleeve length measured from center back. This one is a size 44 but it fits very similar to the 2022 US version 618HH in size 42 I have, just without footballs. This HTC variant was made with extreme care, triple stitched seams throughout. IMO this should be the flagship 613 in the line right now. The leather is steerhide but looks and feels like Shinki.
24" fit length:
My 2022 618HH size 42 fit for comparison. This one is 25" so one inch longer both sleeve and back:
www.thefedoralounge.com
BTW, HTC is very cool. I didn't learn about them until now... Now I get there was a La Brea with the HTC belt. Wish I kept that photo...
This 613US variants is only 24" length, both back and sleeve. But the sleeve works because wide shoulder and there is almost 35" sleeve length measured from center back. This one is a size 44 but it fits very similar to the 2022 US version 618HH in size 42 I have, just without footballs. This HTC variant was made with extreme care, triple stitched seams throughout. IMO this should be the flagship 613 in the line right now. The leather is steerhide but looks and feels like Shinki.
24" fit length:
My 2022 618HH size 42 fit for comparison. This one is 25" so one inch longer both sleeve and back:
What Jacket Are You Wearing Today?
The jacket actually has lots of patina up close. The wind flap over the zipper and two of the back belt loops have gone full tea core I guess :) My wife actually loves this one….it has a certain “Je ne sais quoi”… Love the jacket. After several years of wear, the Cal will shine! You have...
BTW, HTC is very cool. I didn't learn about them until now... Now I get there was a La Brea with the HTC belt. Wish I kept that photo...
Marc mndt
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Now that's a great looking jacket, congrats.
It's nice to see Schott finally getting some traction here on the lounge. Yes their 90s / 00s jackets weren't all that good and I really hate their contemporary elongated styles but when they get it right, they get it right!
Canuck Panda
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The current 618 is really good. Not too long, not too short, just perfect. 25” is the sweet spot, covers the belt and has an extra half inch sleeve length. The underarm footballs are really good too. It gives excellent range of motions and also staying slim at the same time.
The old 613US has nicer leather and fancier stitching but the pattern isn’t as good as the current 618/613.
My ‘22 618 size 42 can actually be measured as 24” P2P at my armpit level which is about 11” down from neck, or 23” P2P at the middle (12” down), this is how Schott measures it, or 21.5” at the seam or the lowest football level (13” down). Essentially, the upper half of the football hides in part of the sleeve, the lower part hides in the torso. The football is not an add on thing if I look at the jacket flattened.
A better shot of this great pattern, notice the gradual Y curve from first football down:
once I go football there’s no going back.
in comparison to the 613US at a size bigger, the 613US 44 feels too big and too small at the same time, the actual curve down from actual arm pit area (11” to 12” down for me) is too extreme, goes from 28” (too big) down to 22.5” too fast. But really nice leather and stitching.
If Schott did a current pattern 613 in a fancy leather and fancy stitch work, my wallet will open its leg fast…
The old 613US has nicer leather and fancier stitching but the pattern isn’t as good as the current 618/613.
My ‘22 618 size 42 can actually be measured as 24” P2P at my armpit level which is about 11” down from neck, or 23” P2P at the middle (12” down), this is how Schott measures it, or 21.5” at the seam or the lowest football level (13” down). Essentially, the upper half of the football hides in part of the sleeve, the lower part hides in the torso. The football is not an add on thing if I look at the jacket flattened.
A better shot of this great pattern, notice the gradual Y curve from first football down:
once I go football there’s no going back.
in comparison to the 613US at a size bigger, the 613US 44 feels too big and too small at the same time, the actual curve down from actual arm pit area (11” to 12” down for me) is too extreme, goes from 28” (too big) down to 22.5” too fast. But really nice leather and stitching.
If Schott did a current pattern 613 in a fancy leather and fancy stitch work, my wallet will open its leg fast…
That would be the standard Schott steerhide. Incredibly underrated leather.
That's what the current thread is about. The 613S/SH (and as of this year, the JDM 613 UST/SJH/UHT) have a refined pattern that is basically the current refined Perfecto pattern, minus footballs (for an accurate vintage appearance). It has excellent range of motion, though not *quite* as good as that of the underarm footballs version; it is much better than the previous Japanese cut and previous American 'slim' cut (still available on some jackets).
Your jacket is a 100th anniversary jacket that took some design cues from early 1960s Perfectos; I have one of these as well, from when they were initially testing shifting the Japanese jacket to an improved pattern (which has since happened).
mumpy
Practically Family
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Inspired by Canuck's purchase, this is a 613US size 44 that has just arrived from Japan (gift for my dad):
Canuck Panda
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Real nice. Congrats (to your dad!)
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Great jacket! Not to be a downer but did you check measurements (at one point this jacket was about 21 PTP for a 44 lol).
mumpy
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Yeah I checked before purchasing, it works out to around 23.5 inches or so. Looks reasonable!
Excellent!
Although it is not a summer jacket, i have worn my brand new Schott 613SH one day last week for the fun.
First, it is quite heavy, as heavy as my Schott 118 if i am not mistaken, although the leather seems slightly slimmer. It is definitively an autumn/winter jacket.
Second, It is not much pliable at the start, less than a schott 618 brand new, and much less than a 118 that is basicaly super supple from the start.
Third, it is super shiny. I like shiny jackets as a principle, I think they rock. Just look at the photo, this is so beautiful ! But well, it is really very noticeable. It looks like it is made to be worn by a rock star - say Rob Halford, or Lou Reed in the Rock'n Roll animal phase - on the stage of a concert, and that is about it ! It is not super appropriate to wear in your everyday life, let's be honest. And I am a person who has no problem rocking à 118 at the office !
The cut is not really the classic cut of the Schott 613. As it has been said, it is "less" a biker jacket and more a style jacket, despite the fact that it is a heavy jacket. The footballs under the arms are gone and to compensate this, there is a little more room around the shoulders. It gives the jacket a slighly broader look around the shoulders but it is still slightly less comfortable than the footballs.
Around the waist it is very close to the 613/618.
There is one important difference : the back is 24 inches (vs 25 inches in the 613/618 current jackets), but there is not the classic back drop of the Perfecto Jackets. The 613/618 are about one ich shorter in the front than in the back. Here, the front seems about one inch longer in front than behind. So if you seat with the jacket closed, it may tend do go up to your chin, like some piece of tin armour. I don't ride, and I already have one 613 and one 618 that retain the classic back drop, so no hard feeling. But I think it should be mentionned.
I should also mention that, as for every Schott jacket i have bought, and I have bought many, the fit is great from the start. It is not too narrow, or too short, or too long, or complicated in any way. I know Schott is not the most loved brand around here, but as far as fits and cut goes, it is always reasonably confortable for me if I buy a 38 or medium jacket. Whenever I buy a Schott US jacket, I know I will have no problem, even with the very tapered ones. It is the perfect brand for my body type !
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mumpy
Practically Family
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Great review!
It is worth mentioning that the shine does diminish over time (a few months of wearing) especially after you get caught in the rain a few times. It is still there but less noticeable than when it was new.
Your measurement notes are correct and helpful for someone cross-shopping, but I wanted to note a couple of things.
The shoulders are actually narrower on this pattern than on the modern pattern, by about a quarter inch but it's noticeable. (I can wear a 618 in 40, but a 613SH in 40 will not go over my shoulders.)
The 613SH (and other jackets on the same pattern) are the classic cut of the Perfecto. The modern changes like the underarm footballs and the curved back drop are arguably performance improvements, to be sure, but they're newer innovations. This pattern actually is more or less identical to my 60s vintage jacket.
jeo
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My experience has been different.
Recently went to the Schott store. Tried on the 613SH in a size 36 and a size 34. They both measured 24” in the back which is very long for a size 34/36. I have 3 Perfectos from the 60’s all size 36 and they all measure between 23”-23.5”
613SH size 36
For comparison a size 36 618H
Early 60’s ribbon label size 36
Mid-late 60’s cactus label size 36
Another mid-late 60’s cactus label size 36
My 70’s bull label size 38 actually does measure 24” in the back but shorter than the 613SH size 36 in the front and overall fits better on me.
The size 34 613SH fit me kind of like how all my 60’s size 36s fit except the lengths which was way long on the SH at 24”.
Is your SH and 60’s perfecto the same size?
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I think this is because of the amount this particular leather creases up. My size 42 613SH has a 24" back length now, but when it was new off of the shelf, it felt longer (and I didn't like that aspect). Both TooManyHats and I experienced that the SH basically shrinks and loosens up with wear.
Yeah 24" on a size 36 would feel insanely long, unless the jacket was going to someone extremely unusually shaped.
Yes, and the SH fits like a size bigger. I also have a sample jacket from their factory that is basically a size 40 613S (because it's a sample it doesn't have a designation) and that one fits identically to the size 42 60s Perfecto.
Although to clarify what I meant when I said it's comparable to the 60s pattern, I meant the shape of it, not the size labeling. The shape is the biggest difference from the post-80s Perfecto. Your photos demonstrate this such the square kidney panel in place of the oval. The sleeves hang differently too on the underarm football models. The silhouette of a worn-in 613S(H) shows this well, though of course it takes breaking in of a new jacket to see how it hangs without the new leather stiffness.
jeo
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Got it.
Was hoping the SH would work for me as the HH on it is really nice, but even the size 34 at 24” back and sleeve length was ridiculously long.
The 618H fit me well but I already have one in steerhide. I would like to find a good condition used 613H. Shame they discontinued it.
Thanks for the precisions.
When i was writing about the "classic" 613 and 618, I was talking about these models in the last ten years, not about the perfecto look of the 60s which I was not specially looking for.
Although the Schott website says the jacket back of the 613SH is 25 inches long, i've just measured it and it IS 24 inches long in the back out of the box, and it is 25 inches in the front. Those are the opposites of my recent 618 40 which is 25 inches in the back and 24 inches in the front.
I too prefer the shorter front in general.
I guess it is the long front that makes the 613SH seem longer.
It seems to me that the recent Schott patterns tend to favor tall people...
True, the shoulder to shoulder is narrow, about 17 inches for a 38 against 18 inches for a 613 38. I stand corrected ! But it feels less narrow, i guess because there is more room around the armholes ?
When i was writing about the "classic" 613 and 618, I was talking about these models in the last ten years, not about the perfecto look of the 60s which I was not specially looking for.
Although the Schott website says the jacket back of the 613SH is 25 inches long, i've just measured it and it IS 24 inches long in the back out of the box, and it is 25 inches in the front. Those are the opposites of my recent 618 40 which is 25 inches in the back and 24 inches in the front.
I too prefer the shorter front in general.
I guess it is the long front that makes the 613SH seem longer.
It seems to me that the recent Schott patterns tend to favor tall people...
True, the shoulder to shoulder is narrow, about 17 inches for a 38 against 18 inches for a 613 38. I stand corrected ! But it feels less narrow, i guess because there is more room around the armholes ?
Madhouse27
One of the Regulars
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Manolito, I too have recently joined the 613sh ranks. It’s been little on the warm side to get much wear in, but I have taken a couple of night rides on the bike to start the break in process. I too noticed the slightly longer front (as compared to my same size 618hh). It’s not crazy excessive and I think some creasing and maybe a slight shrink program will do the trick.
Other than that, the jacket is quite a work of art. Even while still stiff, it fits a little bit trimmer in the body than my 641hh. I could possibly drop down to a size 42 in the 641hh (to get the snug fedora fit) but wouldn’t try it in the 613sh. My 641hh is from 2014 which I picked up used with real low miles. I’m not sure about the current production, but the horsehide on the 613sh is definitely thicker and more robust…it’s really quite a hide!
Despite being such a looker, I think the 613sh is going to be a great riding jacket. The thickness of the hide gives a sense of security and huge props to Schott for practically overdoing the arm length. My Triumph has old school beach bars which are kind of wide and low slung and the mobility and reach on the jacket was excellent right out of the box. I’m thinking the shoulders might require a bit of break in for the Harley guys with their ape hangers. Another plus was the non-snap collar just seemed to work and fit better when the jacket was fully zipped with the lapels folded in (which is how I often wear a Perfecto when riding).
Thanks to Aloysius for the great thread and turning us on to an easily missed gem! The 613sh has become my clear #1
