Help with choosing a leather jacket

[Capesofwrath]

Well I wasn't the one who said they were top notch. But they are at least as well made as Aero's, maybe better in my recent experience of that company's jackets is anything to go by. I'm not at all sure that Aero really is top notch anymore...and that's my objective opinion based of many years of buying their jackets and being really unimpressed by my last dealings with them.

However I wouldn't have been so frank if you hadn't been so biased and one sided in all your posts on this subject.

 

[scrawlysteve]

Objectively, companies who are top notch don't need to repeatedly slash their jacket prices or sell bags of leather off-cuts for a fiver a pop on eBay. I have handled one of their jackets, one of the Highwayman rip-offs, it didn't inspire me.

Highwayman rip-off ? Seems a a bit strong--isn't that design venerable enough to pre-date Aero as well as AL ?

 

[Seb Lucas]

Well I wasn't the one who said they were top notch. But they are at least as well made as Aero's, maybe better in my recent experience of that company's jackets is anything to go by. I'm not at all sure that Aero really is top notch anymore...and that's my objective opinion based of many years of buying their jackets and being really unimpressed by my last dealings with them.

However I wouldn't have been so frank if you hadn't been so biased and one sided in all your posts on this subject.

From my experience I'd say the Al jackets are marginally better put together than Aero. But so are Johnson Leathers. Aero are still pretty good though.

 

[ProteinNerd]

The only reason I can tell a difference between my Aeros and AL's are because of the different leathers used. FQHH for both the Aeros and a mid weight HH and Steer for the AL's.

As for the actual construction quality, realistically why would there be a difference, its a very real possibility that people are comparing an Aero jacket to an AL jacket that was made by the same person.....

I'm actually guessing its possible that AL have more experienced makers than Aero do atm, didn't Aero have to take on a lot of apprentices to fill the gaps of people that left for AL? Personally, I don't think there is enough difference between them quality wise for that to be a factor in your decision of which to go with.

 

[Smithy]

Ok, put it this way: AL set themselves up as basically 'Aero, but cheaper'. Not better, not different, or more accurate, just off-the-mark Xerox's of their jackets, and essentially that's all people who own their jackets seem to claim.
As far as a selling point, it's not what you'd call 'top of the market', I very much doubt Good Wear, Lost Worlds or ELC have considered this as a marketing strategy.
I'm not saying that won't make you a solid, workmanlike product, what I'm saying is that it's not 'top of the market'.

Sloan, I like a lot of your posts and especially your enthusiasm for leather jackets, however the constant sniping and bitching on about AL that you do is really wearing very thin.

AL have been around for nearly a year now, and for nearly a year now you've made it blatantly clear that you don't like them. And fair enough too. But can you maybe give it a rest now? I don't think there's any doubt that not one regular visitor to the Outerwear section knows that you don't like AL. If you don't like a maker you don't have to nag on about it in every thread that concerns that maker. It would be like somebody going into all the Aero threads and saying how crap they are or making catty little remarks, it just gets soooooo boring.

It is also probably having the opposite effect of what you might ultimately like to see happen, rather than driving people away from purchasing from AL you might be making people more interested in them - indirectly it probably doesn't do Aero any real good having one of their fans whingeing on about the opposition ad nauseum.

Whether you like how AL came about or not, that doesn't change the fact that they are here now and apparently make excellent quality jackets (from the reviews here and at other sites at or above the quality of Aero) and they seem to be enjoyed and loved by a great number of members.

 

[winterland1]

Thanks Guys,

I am pretty seriously considering Alexander leather jackets at the moment.

I like their styles a lot, I am particularly fond of their Jerky Horsehide, and they have been very friendly so far and willing to do customizations.

Would anyone have any general thoughts on Alexander?

Also, would anyone have any general thoughts or opinions on jerky horsehide? It doesn't seem too popular and I'm wondering if there is a reason for that.

Ahh well, the hunt continues...

p.s. are there any high quality US makers who are similar to Alexander, have access to jerky horsehide etc..?

MuyJingo let us know what you get. Hopefully our battle of the leathers helped some.

 

[jglf]

What's the deal with Aero Adventures, on ebay, selling AL jackets. They seem to be selling them for substantially less than through AL directly. Are these jackets made by apprentices, use cheaper leather, test jackets, etc...?

 

[Edward]

What's the deal with Aero Adventures, on ebay, selling AL jackets. They seem to be selling them for substantially less than through AL directly. Are these jackets made by apprentices, use cheaper leather, test jackets, etc...?

That the guy "Drifter Promotions" who posts here under that name, or at least used to (not seen him about here in a while). Previously he listed AL jackets as "Aero Leather, Alexander Leathers" - presumably so that they would turn up in returns when anyone searches for 'Aero leather jacket' or similar. I've seen all sorts of people do this over the years - search 'Aero leather' and you'll see some truly bizarre garments with no Galashiels connection at all. Presumably eBay have clamped down on this recently - it's against the eBay rules to use the brand name / trade mark of a company to sell another's product - this falls under the section on "search and browser manipulation". Drifter Productions seems now to be trading under the name of Aero Adventures, and so is using that in their auction titles. They have never to my knowledge commented as to why they do this, although clearly one reason could be because they want to try to keep some way of retaining "Aero" in their auction titles as it is likely to throw up many more hits on their auctions. Seems to me to be a fairly clear case of trade mark infringement, though that won't go anywhere unless Aero as the mark holder choose to take action on the matter.

In short, while it appears to be a questionable sales tactic, what they have to sell is a genuine Alexander Leathers product if that is what you wish to buy. Seemed expensive to me, but then I'm comparing that to the regular big-money-off sales they have via their website rather than their full retail, which if memory serves is about where Aero were a couple of years ago.

 

[winterland1]

What's the deal with Aero Adventures, on ebay, selling AL jackets. They seem to be selling them for substantially less than through AL directly. Are these jackets made by apprentices, use cheaper leather, test jackets, etc...?

I am sure they are the regular quality jacket. Send them a message on eBay if you have any questions. I have myself. They also have posted on here before as mentioned.

Sent from my ADR6300 using Tapatalk 2

 

[ButteMT61]

What's the deal with Aero Adventures, on ebay, selling AL jackets. They seem to be selling them for substantially less than through AL directly. Are these jackets made by apprentices, use cheaper leather, test jackets, etc...?

A cheap way to work off the reputation of Aero while selling someone else's products. He got called on it here as well as posing as just a "regular guy". He's a rep for AL, and like many other things, there's much more to it than it appears. Look around here and you'll find lots of info - more than enough to keep you busy this winter...

 

[Mark]

Hi, just been reading this thread and curious to know if Amanda went to AL from Aero? Always wandered what happened to her. Thought she was great when helping me buy my first Highwayman in 2010.

Regrads

Mark

 

[Capesofwrath]

What's the deal with Aero Adventures, on ebay, selling AL jackets. They seem to be selling them for substantially less than through AL directly. Are these jackets made by apprentices, use cheaper leather, test jackets, etc...?

They seem to be selling into the US market and the prices probably reflect the lack of UK VAT. If you add that in they're about the same as the prices on their website for jackets made to order. They would be the same as any other AL jacket I should think and are probably made for stock. Just like any other maker including Aero make stock jackets for trade customers.

I don't think AL are having sales anymore. I did get a bargain from them a while ago but they seem to be concentrating on their full price jackets now.

Edward: A little cheaper about seventy five quid, for UK buyers than one made in similar hide from Aero. So if that's expensive.....But no four to six months wait for UK buyers either. Me I'm done with buying leather jackets for a while. I don't wear the ones I've got as much as they deserve, and I've downsized them recently too.

 

[Capesofwrath]

Hi, just been reading this thread and curious to know if Amanda went to AL from Aero? Always wandered what happened to her. Thought she was great when helping me buy my first Highwayman in 2010.

Regrads

Mark

Yes she did.

 

[Don Tomaso]

Whoooo, whoooo, I see an conspiracy here!!!

 

[Edward]

Hi, just been reading this thread and curious to know if Amanda went to AL from Aero? Always wandered what happened to her. Thought she was great when helping me buy my first Highwayman in 2010.

Yes, she moved to AL at the same time as the other Aero staff who chose to do so. As far as I know she fulfills much the same role there as she did in Galashiels.

They seem to be selling into the US market and the prices probably reflect the lack of UK VAT. If you add that in they're about the same as the prices on their website for jackets made to order. They would be the same as any other AL jacket I should think and are probably made for stock. Just like any other maker including Aero make stock jackets for trade customers.

Yes, true, they wouldn't need to pay VAT, afaik, on jackets sold to the US. I should assume they are stock jackets in the same way as Thurston and many others order in stock from Aero, which would make sense.

I don't think AL are having sales anymore. I did get a bargain from them a while ago but they seem to be concentrating on their full price jackets now.

Edward: A little cheaper about seventy five quid, for UK buyers than one made in similar hide from Aero. So if that's expensive.....But no four to six months wait for UK buyers either. Me I'm done with buying leather jackets for a while. I don't wear the ones I've got as much as they deserve, and I've downsized them recently too.

I imagine getting in early on in a company's life-cycle is a good way of avoiding a long wait-list; as a company becomes more popular, chances are waiting times creep up, alas. I know what you mean about wanting to make sure you get maximum wear out of your jackets. One reason I hated the weather this year so much... Winter dragged on into an unbearable, depressing, hot Summer which dragged on forever... it's only in the last couple of weeks I've been able to wear my leathers for the first time in maybe six months. Ah, for the halcyon days of Summer 2012, when I was still able to wear leather in July....

 

[Mark]

Thanks Capesfwrath and Edward for that. Did the Aero staff go to AL as a result of the Steer/HH scandal ? Just curious.

I am considering an A2 for my next jacket and thought i'd go the Aero route for that just based on my Highwayman, service was second to none and the jacket simply beautiful. However, reading the above thread (bits of it really) i had not considered AL or any other maker. I had a look on AL web site, mmm not sure, only one style of A2 and web site not a patch on Aero's. But then they seem to have the best staff from Aero. What do you more seasoned jacketeers think?

Mark

 

[Edward]

Thanks Capesfwrath and Edward for that. Did the Aero staff go to AL as a result of the Steer/HH scandal ? Just curious.

I am considering an A2 for my next jacket and thought i'd go the Aero route for that just based on my Highwayman, service was second to none and the jacket simply beautiful. However, reading the above thread (bits of it really) i had not considered AL or any other maker. I had a look on AL web site, mmm not sure, only one style of A2 and web site not a patch on Aero's. But then they seem to have the best staff from Aero. What do you more seasoned jacketeers think?

Mark

Ohhhh, now that's a can o'worms....

I think that all that needs to be said here is that there was a disagreeance of views regarding Aero and its running between former management and the ownership of the company, which resulted in former management leaving. Mix of the storse hoo hah and other things that aren't at this point in time worth raking up all over again. There are now two companies. AL, whose staff are comprised of a number of former Aero personnel, and Aero, with some old faces, and a number of new people. Much of the AL product line will look very familiar to long-standing Aero fans, and certainly the people making those jackets have a lot of collective experience in putting them together, as the company point out. I've not personally been interested in one of their jackets, but there's no reason to doubt that they are any less well constructed than the same folks managed in the past. I can't comment on the quality of the hides they use (obviously if you wanted Horween FQHH, you'd be out of luck with AL, but that's not a standard hide for an A2). I have seen a number of examples of work by the newer Aero staff, and they are without exception outstanding. I have an 'Apprentice Made' Highwayman myself which I would put up against any made by anyone who works or has ever worked at Aero. I wouldn't worry on that accord (I would have thought this would be even less of an issue in relation to the range of designs added since the changes in personnel - Aero have almost doubled their range of stock civilian model designs as of April 2013, with more rumoured to be on the way this year).

As to the A2 specifically.... I've not seen the AL option in person, so maybe it is just a poor photograph that makes it look odd. They don't really seem to be concentrating their business much on the military models so far. I have two A2s myself - an Aero 42 contract pattern in goat, and an Eastman Roughwear in horse. Both superb jackets. The Eastman is, I believe, considered by those with far more knowledge than myself to be a notch or two more accurate than the Aero. As functioning jackets I would rate them about the same. I would also note that the goatskin (and this would be the same for ELC's goat, it's not exclusive to Aero) has stayed newer looking while the horse has rapidly developed a lot of patina marks. To my eye they both look great, though I would reach for the goat for the office or anywhere I wanted to look just a bit "tidier", if that makes sense. It's worth having a look around and deciding what you want in an A2, as there's a whole lot of choice available both in terms of repro makers and in terms of individual contracts. If you want all-out stitch for stitch accuracy, be prepared to spend big; if you're prepared to compromise a little on that, you can spend less. Personally, I'm very happy with what Aero do on that front, but then price is an issue for me and while I agree that there are others who are more accurate, for me personally the price difference isn't worth it for what are to me minimal differences. That said, I also play into the mix that I'm approaching the guts of two decades older than the kids who wore them in WW2; I'm also bald, overweight, and not seeking to put together a living history repro, so there are some details that might matter less to me on that front. Everyone has a different opinion on this one, from those who would be happy with a current issue jacket right up to the looney that used to troll these parts insisting that any reproduction A2 at all was "inferior rubbish" because it wasn't a "real" wartime A2. Funny guy... FWIW, I'm sure I read somewhere that Ken has been doing a spot of rejigging on Aero's patterns for the A2 contract repros, improving their accuracy, but I can't comment on that from experience.

If you're not in a rush or after a very specific contract, it's probably worth keeping an eye on eBay: both my Aero and my ELC came from the Bay at very reasonable prices (about 50% of retail). Maybe keep an eye on Aero's sale page too (they occasionally sell on discounted trade-in jackets or pattern-test jackets). Going used doesn't necessarily mean trading down: such is the nature of the collector end of the A2 repro market that you'll often see almost new and unworn jackets selling at a good saving over retail as someone seeks to fund the next jacket or 'upgrades' to their collection with originals or a GoodWear (widely regarded as the top end of the repro market) or whatever.

 

[Capesofwrath]

Thanks Capesfwrath and Edward for that. Did the Aero staff go to AL as a result of the Steer/HH scandal ? Just curious.

I am considering an A2 for my next jacket and thought i'd go the Aero route for that just based on my Highwayman, service was second to none and the jacket simply beautiful. However, reading the above thread (bits of it really) i had not considered AL or any other maker. I had a look on AL web site, mmm not sure, only one style of A2 and web site not a patch on Aero's. But then they seem to have the best staff from Aero. What do you more seasoned jacketeers think?

Mark

Yes I agree with Edward about looking around at what's available. I don't think AL's military stuff is their strong point. Certainly their A2 is an odd looking beast. Unless they've changed it recently.

I did try one of their Memphis jackets, a fifties flight jacket or bomber type, in the sale a while ago and that was I assume based on the same pattern as their A2. It fitted me like an Aero A2 38 pattern. High arm holes and a good fit for a chimp. It was a bit big elsewhere though oddly. It went back.

 

[Jeff M]

Thanks Capesfwrath and Edward for that. Did the Aero staff go to AL as a result of the Steer/HH scandal ? Just curious.

All you will get here is conjecture. Legal issues are apparently still in play.
The management running Aero at the time of "cowgate" left to work at AL. No reasons give on either side that I am aware of.

I am considering an A2 for my next jacket and thought i'd go the Aero route for that just based on my Highwayman, service was second to none and the jacket simply beautiful. However, reading the above thread (bits of it really) i had not considered AL or any other maker. I had a look on AL web site, mmm not sure, only one style of A2 and web site not a patch on Aero's. But then they seem to have the best staff from Aero. What do you more seasoned jacketeers think?

Mark

I own several of Aero's civilian designs, and like them quite a bit.
I ordered an A2 from them a little over a year ago. Not their strongest design...at least back then. Waiste too short, arm pits too high and tight, too tight across the chest and shoulders. Returned it for a re-do, better..but I still prefer more room in my repro A2's.
Leather OK....but not in the league with other high end A2 repro manufacturers.
I've owned/comissioned military design jackets from several makers, including Good Wear, Eastman, Superior Flight Apparel, Aero, Gibson and Barnes, Bill Kelso.
At the top of my list for military design is Good Wear, followed closely by Superior Flight Apparel. Great jackets custom made to fit. Top quality leather. Pleasure to deal with.
Next is Eastman (if they were more "custom fit" friendly, I'd own more.) Then Aero and G&B.

 

[Mark]

Thanks guys, useful info. I think my budget may determin who i go with for an A2, so that counts out Good wear and any of the U.S makers. Reading other threads it seem ELC jackets are too roomy. I have been considering Aero's Real Deal jacket simply cos its the cheapest! With regards sizing could you not simply go with your next size-up? I briefly had an Aero 38 contract (i think it was) from their sale page. it was in my normal size but was so tight under the arm and accross the shoulders it made it unwearable. Shame as it was a lovely jacket.

Mark