Help me choose my B3

[aswatland]

As a collector of original A2s, B-3s and Irvins jackets I only buy the most accurate repros and would never buy an Aero military jacket as they fall short of my exacting standards. Therefore GW A2s and Eastman B-3s are the only repros worth investing in IMO. Unfortunately no one makes a repro Irvin accuarate enough to buy.

 

[Jeff M]

If you are an "odd size", I'd recommend going with Aero.
As much as I love Eastman's products...I send my business Aero's way because of the custom fit.
I take a size 44 jacket. Standard maker arm lengths are generally an inch too long.
As much as I like "spot on" reproductions...I tend not to wear a jacket if it doesn't fit comfortably.

 

[ButteMT61]

Well, you're special. I'm not.
I didn't fly in WWII.
I didn't fight in WWII.
I'm guessing you didn't either.
A repro is no investment. It's a jacket. It will possibly hold value better, possibly not. I don't buy to retire on my jacket sales. I buy to enjoy them.
Cheap sorry me lol

 

[aswatland]

Can you prove that pics by pics?

Here is the Aero B-3. First they claim it is an exact copy on a 1942 B-3. But it is not. The shearling is based on veg tanned, hand dyed Shearling, used to make B-3s prior to late 1941. The finish resembles plastic. It has a three piece back, yet issued pre-war jackets had a two piece back. The fleece is too thick at the cuffs. The horse hide trim used on the sleeves is too smooth and the wrong colour. The buckles are stamped with "Aero" and they are too thin.

Their seal version is better, but again the fleeece is too thick, especially at the cuffs.

Here are some pics of two of my originals.

This is the pre-War redskin.

 

[aswatland]

and now my 1942 B-3 from the same maker.

I can'y copy pics of the B-3s on the ELC site. But you can see from these two links how much more accurate they are than Aero B-3s.
http://www.eastmanleather.com/product_info.php?products_id=237
http://www.eastmanleather.com/product_info.php?products_id=160

 

[cuthbert]

Here is the Aero B-3. First they claim it is an exact copy on a 1942 B-3. But it is not. The shearling is based on veg tanned, hand dyed Shearling, used to make B-3s prior to late 1941. The finish resembles plastic. It has a three piece back, yet issued pre-war jackets had a two piece back. The fleece is too thick at the cuffs. The horse hide trim used on the sleeves is too smooth and the wrong colour. The buckles are stamped with "Aero" and they are too thin.

So...the main problem is that they make a late 1941 jacket and they sell it as a '42? For the three pieces back, I'm pretty sure that if you order a two pieces back they'll make it, for instance, my redskin D-1 has a two pieces back while the pics of the website shows a four pieces jacket. Point taken for the buckles and the horsehide trim, but for the fleece don't you think that your original are thineer because they're 70 years old?

I'm a little scared to know what you think about my Kelso Roughwear A-2 then.... :O

 

[aswatland]

Point taken about wear to the cuffs on an original B-3, but my 1942 B-3 is in near mint condition with no wear to the fleece so the jacket is much as how it was when issued. The fleece thickness varied on original B-3s with thinner fleece being used on most pre-war B-3s. I have owned mint examples of pre war jackets and the fleece at the cuffs is not over thick as seen on Aero repros.

Here are a couple of pics of a near mint 1941 B-3 in exceptional original condition with thinner fleece used on the cuffs-very different from the Aero jacket.

I'm sure Aero would do a two piece back on a redskin jacket, but they would need to get the fleece correct and avoid the plastic finish, which ELC gets correct on their redskin RW jacket.

 

[tonypaj]

Point taken about wear to the cuffs on an original B-3, but my 1942 B-3 is in near mint condition with no wear to the fleece so the jacket is much as how it was when issued. The fleece thickness varied on original B-3s with thinner fleece being used on most pre-war B-3s. I have owned mint examples of pre war jackets and the fleece at the cuffs is not over thick as seen on Aero repros.

Here are a couple of pics of a near mint 1941 B-3 in exceptional original condition with thinner fleece used on the cuffs-very different from the Aero jacket.

I'm sure Aero would do a two piece back on a redskin jacket, but they would need to get the fleece correct and avoid the plastic finish, which ELC gets correct on their redskin RW jacket.

I agree about the fleece and the straps. The finish is in real life less plasticky than in the pictures, especially after a bit of wear. Also the horsehide matches better after a while, but the color is a bit off. Anyway, would you happen to know where to get stouter straps for a redskin? I'd be interested in changing mine.

 

[aswatland]

The best source for B-3 straps is a from a wrecked original jacket. Alternatively you could contact ELC and see if they will sell you some of theirs.

 

[Peacoat]

Andrew, thanks for finally posting in this thread. I have read the thread with interest as I am considering a B-3 (probably more jacket than I need for this area), B-6 or a D-1. While I am not particularly interested in an exact reproduction--which I doubt actually exists--I would like something reasonably close.

I had just about settled on the Aero B-6 Redskin, until your remarks above. The ELC is out, as I had a recent not so good experience with them and don't care to do any more business with the company. So, it is back to the drawing board.

Thanks for sharing your expertise in this area.

 

[aswatland]

You are quite correct, no one makes a 100% accurate B-3 or B-6. Although ELC get the close the fleece side of their shearling is not close enough to originals. It is almost impossible to source shearling these days that is completely like Wartime fleece. John Chapman has made a very nice B-6 and it would be worth contacting him as his jackets are by far the most accuarate.

 

[ButteMT61]

Why are ELC still being discussed when we know that they don't make a 50?
This thread was asking for help, not a p*ssing match over members collections.
If a maker can't make a jacket for me or others needing a 50+, why debate them here?
I see a three piece Eastman B3 on eBay tonight. I've also seem ELC's with skins that look like crappy cardboard.
I don't go bashing them in threads.

 

[aswatland]

Why are ELC still being discussed when we know that they don't make a 50?
This thread was asking for help, not a p*ssing match over members collections.
If a maker can't make a jacket for me or others needing a 50+, why debate them here?
I see a three piece Eastman B3 on eBay tonight. I've also seem ELC's with skins that look like crappy cardboard.
I don't go bashing them in threads.

I mentioned ELC to correct the subjective Aero worshipping displayed by some people here which tends to plague this forum.Moreover should the new member lose weight then an ELC B-3 would be an alternative to an inferior Aero. Please do not resort to swearing on the forum and I do not want you or anyone urinating on my jackets!

As far as the 20+ year old ELC jacket on Ebay is concerned it should be compared with the B-3s Aero were making back then since ELC have raised their game over the ensuing two decades.

There are many people here seeking a B-3 who can wear a jacket that is a 48 or smaller and will follow this thread with interest, so for this reason alone those makers who do not make size 50 jackets should not be excluded.

 

[ButteMT61]

I mentioned ELC to correct the subjective Aero worshipping displayed by some people here which tends to plague this forum.Moreover should the new member lose weight then an ELC B-3 would be an alternative to an inferior Aero. Please do not resort to swearing on the forum and I do not want you or anyone urinating on my jackets!

As far as the 20+ year old ELC jacket on Ebay is concerned it should be compared with the B-3s Aero were making back then since ELC have raised their game over the ensuing two decades.

There are many people here seeking a B-3 who can wear a jacket that is a 48 or smaller and will follow this thread with interest, so for this reason alone those makers who do not make size 50 jackets should not be excluded.

Not swearing - perfectly acceptable term, and I love jackets too much to do that!
I was looking at some of the original B3 in Aero's collection at their shop. There were some with very thick fleece. The sleeve fleece is of course worn, so it appears to me much of this is due to wear - based on their jackets used for making copies. I'll post a clip of it once I'm settled from the trip.

Check out this new Eastman with a three-piece back.
New Eastman B3

I think the term I've seen here before "Aero worship" is a sad thing to say. People obviously like them - myself included. Why insult folks like that? I think some of you guys have a stick implanted over letting folks enjoy what they have. I also think some here are incredibly rude and love to show off. But maybe it's just my jet lag and lack of sleep. I'd just like to see less of the superiority complex seen here lately... :eeek:

 

[aswatland]

So do I take it really are an Aero worshipper? Their B-3 jackets as I pointed out with reference to originals are inferior to Eastman's current B-3s in terms of accuaracy. Yes, Will has a great collection of original jackets. It's a real shame these jackets are not used in the same way John Chapman does to make a really accurate repro. I sorry you find some people "incredibly rude" here especially when they disagree with you.

 

[ButteMT61]

So do I take it really are an Aero worshipper? Their B-3 jackets as I pointed out with reference to originals are inferior to Eastman's current B-3s in terms of accuaracy. Yes, Will has a great collection of original jackets. It's a real shame these jackets are not used in the same way John Chapman does to make a really accurate repro. I sorry you find some people "incredibly rude" here especially when they disagree with you.

Disagreeing isn't rude. I quite enjoy disagreements as much is learned from them. But that term is rude, and the inference is unneeded here. I think some worship things here for sure. But I wouldn't rain on their parade even if I think so. That's what I'm saying. Unless someone's breaking rules, let all enjoy their gear. Not everyone has the desire/means/budget to obtain a closet full of original and/or repro gear. I think Aero are highly accessible, which makes them successful. The others are not as easy/affordable to get a jacket from.

I could post pics of my great house and cars and watches, etc. ad nauseum in a fashion to make others feel small, or I can participate to be a part of the community. I just choose the latter. I don't like digs at people's gear/choices here. And if we're in disagreement, that's cool.

 

[Peacoat]

This has been a good thread with a lot of good information and pictures posted. Let's not let it degenerate any further. I don't want to see it get locked.

 

[aswatland]

Of course there is no harm in disagreeing here. Everybody is entilted to their choice of gear, it is just that some is more accurate than others. The reason why many of us post pics here is not to show off their collection, but to share them with those who may wish to buy a similar repro or if an original to show the details to others who are interested. It is only by posting pics here that people can build up their knowledge in what is quite a specialised field. I await with interest to see the next set of your jacket pictures or anything else you might care to post.

 

[PADDY]

Gents - here's the choice. Discuss the jacket in a balanced & civilized manner appropriate to the mannerly way we conduct ourselves here on TFL, or I can only assume this subject has run it's natural course to closure.

 

[cuthbert]

Check out this new Eastman with a three-piece back.
New Eastman B3

It's obviously an INFERIOR Eastman!