Help Finding a Cafe Racer

[Seb Lucas]

The Schott 641XX Monitor posted above is great. I have had Aero, Alexander's, Johnson Leathers and Australian made premium bike jackets. The Schott is as well made as any of them.

But quality manufacture isn't everything. My favourite cafe racer jacket is made by Brooks. Like most Brooks jackets in this pattern it is made of indifferent leather, not all that well stitched, has a funny looking synthetic liner, and is very light. It's still the best looking cafe racer I've seen.

 

[ton312]

but I'm not the first to experience fairly wide size fluctuations from Aero.

I experienced a similar thing with my j-106 jackets. One a 40" the other a 42" but measured exactly the same across shoulders and chest. But I bought the 40" second hand and it may have been spec'd closer to a 42"...

 

[bn1966]

I'm with Seb on the Brooks...love mine

 

[Dickie Teenie]

I don't really want to spend more than $1500 or so, but might consider going higher if I can find perfection.
And waiting 2 years for something from JC doesn't really appeal, although I should probably just get on the list and figure what to buy when my name pops up.

I think you have your answer if you can wait. John is the one person that might be able to dial in tailored measurements of 0.25".

 

[GregO]

I experienced a similar thing with my j-106 jackets. One a 40" the other a 42" but measured exactly the same across shoulders and chest. But I bought the 40" second hand and it may have been spec'd closer to a 42"...

You cannot specify a change in the chest or shoulder measurements on an Aero. Theoretically, all, say, size 40 Aeros of the same pattern should measure exactly the same across chest and shoulders. But they don't, and it sounds like your experience is the same as mine.

 

[Monitor]

I fully agree, justhandguns, but that isn't really fair toward such a venerable company. Sure, it's true they've been producing some of their stuff overseas, but there's zero confusion in that regard as not a single item from their motorcycle/leather line is being made in the Asia & that's something they've made quite clear. It's just some cheap textile stuff, etc., nobody really cares about that's made offshore. It's not like they're trying to cheat people into buying jackets made in countries where good jackets cannot be made, so that there's anything to be careful about.
The have been producing some leather jackets in Asia, intended strictly for the European marker but nothing that resembles Schott trademark line.

People may think one thing but the standards by which their moto range is being made has remained the same for decades and I don't see this changing any time soon. Proof in point is that they're constantly releasing the more fashionable cousins of their main line, like the lighter Perfectos, CR's, etc. - & NOT replacing it - for the people who can't deal with the weight or the stiffness of their leather; but the classic moto lineup is still there & from what I've seen, it's as good as it has ever been.

So yeah, they've ventured into the mainstream fashion but really, what's wrong in that? If anything, it's a good thing as it means they've secured their place & will be around for a little longer. And just how they've made a few questionable (by moto standards) fashion jackets, for that same reason we also got those incredible Horween beauties which, in my not so humble opinion, seriously stand alone at the very top!

Besides, Vanson is constantly collaborating with high-fashion brands and so are some other brands people talk about here, and none of them has lost an edge. It's as if some people are just waiting for Schott to do something, anything, to jump on 'em.

Finally, Schott does custom sizing, but it costs a lot.
https://www.schottnyc.com/customsizing.cfm

Actually, it costs around the same as with other premium brands, just that this seems to be the problem when it comes to Schott...

 

[handymike]

I recently tried on a vintage Schott cafe racer. It was nice, but next to it was a brooks in the same size. I preferred the Brooks.
With so many choices it can be difficult to narrow down exactly what is and isn't working for you. I think Greg knows exactly what he's after.
I think at this point it's time to call JC and have a lengthy and detailed conversation.
Or, get to San Francisco to try on Technovox's HD jackets, and then take them into Alan for fitting and pattern making.

 

[ProteinNerd]

Another fact is that Schott NYC is now more of a fashion brand than a hardcore leather jacket maker, it gives people idea that they are not serious anymore. From what I have seen, as long as Schott NYC keep their higher end production line in the US, their quality should be guaranteed.

I certainly thought they had "sold out" to the fashion brand business model like Belstaff i.e.: prices up, quality down and more money and effort spent on marketing and image. I'm the first to admit I'm not a schott expert though but the fact that they even have an arm of the business gong that way pretty much takes them off my prospective list.

 

[ton312]

I wish they'd just do more with the CXL hides. I think they're dedicated riding gear is still quite good and I don't look into anything they offer past that. I don't particularly care for their CR's but the 618 and 118 are bedrock M/C jackets!

 

[cuchulain]

I wouldn't go as far as to call Schott a fashion brand at this point. They're no Aero in terms of quality and the stoutness of their jackets but they're not Michael Kohrs or Calvin Klein either. The latter use very thin cheap leather and the quality of construction is poor. Schott still uses a thick high quality leather with much better quality of construction than fashion brands.

I wouldn't use them as a motorcycle jacket, but they're pretty nice for what they are, a solid jacket and heads and shoulders above most of the other garbage out there passing for a leather jacket these days.

 

[the loco]

Off-topic a bit but if Schott ever does a 118 in a see CXL I'm buying two!

I think Schott's recently had a perfecto in brown CXL but it wasn't the 118. It was a limited edition at around 2x the price.

 

[jacketjunkie]

Why do people keep saying they are not as good as Aero? Show me one Aero jacket which is 50 years old and in as good shape as some Schott jackets out there. Right. You can't. And even if they were better, what the heck do you need better than lasting for 50 years? Your grand-grand-childs won't wear it anyway.

The reason some people talk bad about Schott is that they have been in the business for a long time and expanded into a company with world-wide recognition and a very big market. More people buying their jackets doesn't make their jackets worse. It's still heavy leather, long-lasting very functional leather jackets, all you could possibly ask for. Imagine Aero 50 years ahead from now... they will (hopefully) have expanded and have as big a market as Schott now. Will you stop buying from then then because more people wear the jackets? Because that is what fashion means. More people wearing it.

 

[the loco]

I'm looking for a casual café racer too, but I'm not sure about the Mandarin collar though. I think that could go with the Schott 671 (easy rider) this time.

 

[l0fielectronic]

Why do people keep saying they are not as good as Aero? Show me one Aero jacket which is 50 years old and in as good shape as some Schott jackets out there. Right. You can't. And even if they were better, what the heck do you need better than lasting for 50 years? Your grand-grand-childs won't wear it anyway.

The reason some people talk bad about Schott is that they have been in the business for a long time and expanded into a company with world-wide recognition and a very big market. More people buying their jackets doesn't make their jackets worse. It's still heavy leather, long-lasting very functional leather jackets, all you could possibly ask for. Imagine Aero 50 years ahead from now... they will (hopefully) have expanded and have as big a market as Schott now. Will you stop buying from then then because more people wear the jackets? Because that is what fashion means. More people wearing it.

I think one reason might be the licensing or product produced for overseas. I'm not quite sure how it works but I do remember reading somewhere Schott produces lesser,'budget' jacket lines for UK/Europe.

This would make sense to what I've seen of their jackets as the four or five I've seen in person, or tried on, have been the kind of thing I see described on here as 'Mall Jackets'. I.E. very average to poor leather and nothing at all special or that feels like it would last. To be fair to them the pricing of those jackets is normally in line with the 'quality' of them, but these are the jackets you seem to see here unless you seek out a specialist motorcycle shop and so is how most people will view the brand.

It wasn't until I read the article about the company that I at least understood some of the high pricing I was seeing of their jackets elsewhere and that they had a reputation for making quality jackets, as well as these fashion items.

 

[TREEMAN]

I for one am glad Schott is getting some good publicity in this thread. I recently purchased one of there café racers, the 641 in steerhide. IMO it's a good looking jacket...much better than others. It has the large single piece back panel which is a trademark of a TRUE cafe racer. That single back piece just flows better than the ones with horizontal or vertical seams.

 

[cuchulain]

Why do people keep saying they are not as good as Aero? Show me one Aero jacket which is 50 years old and in as good shape as some Schott jackets out there.

I think Schott makes a very, very good jacket, better than the vast majority of leather jackets you find people wearing, but having owned three Schott's and now, well an Alexander Leathers jacket there's no comparison, the AL is just a much better put together jacket than the Schott. Schott churns a lot of volume, Aero hand builds each jacket by one maker, of course the Aero is going to be better overall, it's also twice the price give or take so that's expected, that's not a knock on Schott, but more a compliment to Aero's quality.

As for a 50 year old Schott, let's be realistic someone bought that Perfecto 118 in 1963 wore it for a few months or a year then it went into a closet for the next 53 years only to find its way to eBay half a century later. No one, or likely very few people have worn a Schott Perfecto 118 or CR for 50 years straight.

 

[navetsea]

I think at heart people are hipsters, they love thing until everybody loves it, and then they distant themselves from it and try to find something else other people don't find yet the more obscure the better

 

[Monitor]

No offense, but that stuff about Schott being inferior to Aero is one hundred per cent pure nonsense. The leather Schott is using may not be as visually appealing to some people but that's because Schott's primary concern isn't looks but functionality and durability. I mean, I love Aero as much as the next guy but their motorcycle jackets literally cannot touch Schott in terms of functionality.

The irony is that compared to Schott, Aero is literally a fashion brand, by every definition & their own admission.

As for a 50 year old Schott, let's be realistic someone bought that Perfecto 118 in 1963 wore it for a few months or a year then it went into a closet for the next 53 years only to find its way to eBay half a century later. No one, or likely very few people have worn a Schott Perfecto 118 or CR for 50 years straight.

Schott Perfecto is the most distinct and recognizable style in the history of leather jackets so I'm pretty sure that these jackets are quite literally the ONLY jackets that indeed HAVE been actually worn and used for that long - or at least much, much longer than any jacket from any other manufacturer. I mean, the popularity of the style didn't just happen on its own. Riders have been wearing the same Schott jackets for decades! Heck, the Perfecto literally became synonymous with this kind of life style and I doubt that happened because those guys were buying new jackets every few months. The fact that there are so many people that have been wearing their Schott jackets for the most part of their lives is the main selling point of the company! So yeah, if there's a brand whose jackets have truly been worn and used for that long, it's Schott.

 

[rocketeer]

Schott Perfecto is the most distinct and recognizable style in the history of leather jackets so I'm pretty sure that these jackets are quite literally the ONLY jackets that indeed HAVE been actually worn and used for that long - or at least much, much longer than any jacket from any other manufacturer. I mean, the popularity of the style didn't just happen on its own. Riders have been wearing the same Schott jackets for decades! Heck, the Perfecto literally became synonymous with this kind of life style and I doubt that happened because those guys were buying new jackets every few months. The fact that there are so many people that have been wearing their Schott jackets for the most part of their lives is the main selling point of the company! So yeah, if there's a brand whose jackets have truly been worn and used for that long, it's Schott.

A bit of flag waving here .
During the 1950s-60 Great Britain's motorcyclists had their own style jackets, some popularised by the jackets worn in the film 'The Wild One', also the good old waxed cotton styles which we will ignore. Leather jackets such as produced by Rivets, Kett, Mascot, Lewis, Highwayman etc were often quite distinct from those of companies in the US such as Buco, Harley Davidson, and of course Schott.
Most of the way through the 1950s all the way to the 80s The British companies made the same jackets, but as motorcycles changed so did the clothing styles with many companies closing or being absorbed into others, the black leather still being out there but with padding and other embellishments including design cut, moving slightly away from the traditional style.
Fast forward to the mid 1980s in England and the re-release of the film 'The Wild One'. Suddenly the old Brando/Schott style was everywhere. Since then it has been the dominant traditionally styled black jacket made and sold here, not counting the Power Ranger types for us sports bikers and some smaller companies making some black armoured jackets for the retro(read modern Triumph/Royal Enfield)scene, though some of the Perfecto style jackets range from very good to abysmal stuff made in the far east and Asia as does some of the sports stuff.
This can mean that the British Caffff racer/Rocker scene is full of Perfecto wearing, jeans over boots, rather than the British styled jacket with jeans inside boots(with or without white socks) look
Lewis leathers obviously make their jackets to their old patterns but are generally out of the average motorcyclists price range, but at least make a British style jacket. Mascot are trying to make a comeback, Eastmans Luftwaffe is a good contender for a 1960s British lookalike as is Aero's Zip sleeve Highwayman. It is a shame Aero concentrate on US design bike jackets but then again, if that is where the money is, why not.
So lets here it for the Schott Perfecto, but also the British look that was quite distinctive from the US look

 

[Monitor]

Rocketeer, absolutely true & only later did I realize I should've mentioned the British brands you've listed as examples of a popular motorcycle jacket design but what I said about the style being what it is today, stands. The Perfecto - regardless of who truly came up with the design (and I strongly doubt it was indeed Schott) - is the most recognizable and distinct style ever, so much that it's more of a statement than just a jacket. It's a still a very popular jacket with the riders who want to be instantly associated with their hobby, and also with any rocker, metalhead, punk, etc.
I mean, just in the movies, if you need any of the above, simply throw a Perfecto over the guy and he's that guy.
LL had a lovely line-up prior to The Wild One, same as with the other manufacturers, but as soon as the movie & consequently the look caught on, the asymmetrical zipper style lancer front jacket became their flagship product. To us, the LL take on the style varies a great deal from the Schott Perfecto but most people wouldn't be able to tell the difference even if you point it out.

But the point that I'm trying to prove here is that saying Schott is an inferior brand is entirely untrue.

When I bought my first Perfecto, I was constantly having to read such tendentious statements about Schott making an inferior product to (insert brand name here), without any explanation as to why would this be so, with no examples, no proof; nothing. And it made me sell a perfectly good jacket and buy another one from another brand, one that objectively wasn't in any way, shape or form better than the Schott.

And I don't want others to read that sort of nonsense and think their Schott jacket is, somehow, inferior. Because it is not.

Sure, some may prefer the beautiful hide other companies are offering, or the lovely linings, period correct hardware, etc. etc. - but - that does NOT make a better jacket! It makes a better reproduction but NOT a better jacket. This has to be made clear. Nor does any of it place Schott below the brand in question, just because the historical accuracy or patina isn't their highest priority. Riding is. They do motorcycle jackets and at that, I'm going to repeat myself, they're either as good as anyone else out there, or better.