Help Finding a Cafe Racer

[Monitor]

Schott - Looked at Schott a few times in the last 5 years or so, and even owned one about 15 years ago. Honestly, I've been spoiled by higher quality leather, and can't go back to Schott.

what

 

[ton312]

what

I believe that guy is CXL no? Schott's got a couple CXL jackets but no CR in it to my knowledge

 

[ton312]

Thanks everyone. Some thoughts:

Schott - Looked at Schott a few times in the last 5 years or so, and even owned one about 15 years ago. Honestly, I've been spoiled by higher quality leather, and can't go back to Schott.

Vanson - Funny thing, I own 2 Vanson waxed cotton jackets, but no leather. I've only seen their comp weight stuff. Does anyone have firsthand experience with the lighter weight leathers they use?

Langlitz - only seen their heavyweight stuff. I'll look into it.

Himel - Are they worth the $$? Do they have a funky fit? The Kensington looks J100-like. How big are the upper arms on their pattern? Anyone know?

Thedi - Some of their stuff looks interesting. Ballpark price range on their stuff?

I've handled the mid weight Firenze from Vanson and didn't care for it at all. The z150 is a nicer mid weight from Vanson and doesn't have the pressed grain look of the former. I haven't looked at Thedi in quite some time but a few years back when he had an Etsy shop he was just under $1k for most his stuff. From a design standpoint I think his CR jackets are the coolest thing going. That said you can't go wrong with a Vanson CR.

 

[Monitor]

I believe that guy is CXL no? Schott's got a couple CXL jackets but no CR in it to my knowledge

I think so, but what I was trying to illustrate that you can't go better than Schott. At their worst, they're as good as anyone else. At their best, they're the best.

 

[ton312]

I think so, but what I was trying to illustrate that you can't go better than Schott. At their worst, they're as good as anyone else. At their best, they're the best.

I agree, craftsmanship, customer service and styles all right there. I'd like to see them use more of the CXL hides in their line.

 

[TREEMAN]

I think so, but what I was trying to illustrate that you can't go better than Schott. At their worst, they're as good as anyone else. At their best, they're the best.

I'm glad you mentioned this Monitor. Why is it that many feel Schott is less quality than some of the other top brands? Does leather thickness alone have to do with this ? Schott claims there leather thickness is 3-3.5 oz....not good enough? I was thinking of getting a horsehide from them, but then got sidetracked looking for 4 oz horsehide from some of the other companies....the Schott in the pic you posted looks as good as any I've seen.

 

[jacketjunkie]

So... let me sum this up... you have had 37458 off-the-rack jackets from different companies and each one of them was not as perfectly shaped to your body as you would have liked it and now you are asking us which off-the-rack jacket to go for now?

Answer is simple. No matter which jacket you pick, it won't be the perfect fit because none of them was modeled for your specific body. Go bespoke. Alan at Johnsons can get you an all-custom-fit jacket in one of 50 hides available for probably half the money most of the jackets mentioned here would cost you. At Langlitz they can probably help you too, but less hides to pick from. Seriously, just mail Alan and call it a day.

 

[Monitor]

I'm glad you mentioned this Monitor. Why is it that many feel Schott is less quality than some of the other top brands? Does leather thickness alone have to do with this ? Schott claims there leather thickness is 3-3.5 oz....not good enough? I was thinking of getting a horsehide from them, but then got sidetracked looking for 4 oz horsehide from some of the other companies....the Schott in the pic you posted looks as good as any I've seen.

I never quite understood where's this coming from, either. Even ignoring the fact that you've got five or six decades old Schott's floating around looking as good as they ever had - which I'm sure should speak enough about the quality of the brand - I'm convinced they're solely responsible for keeping this whole leather jacket scene alive & on the radar as they were offering these styles everyone's obsessing over nowadays way before any of the fancy fancy repros became a thing, always doing the Perfecto, the CR, everything.

Best part? They're still doing their original CR design. Not a repro, not an inspired piece, but the real deal!

Regarding leather thickness, check out Dinerman's fantastic blog post, here: http://vintagehaberdashers.com/2013/03/03/black-chp-jacket/

If anything, even at 3oz, Schott is probably surpassing any standards of the past.

 

[nick123]

I'd go Langlitz. Quantifiably (though subjectively) better leather than Schott and a better jacket. It's a feel thing. The Langlitz is just class. But for a CR, I don't know.

Just my opinion. I'd be perfectly happy with a Schott the same, but the Langlitz is just put together in a way that exudes a quality that arouses the senses.

 

[Fanch]

I have stayed out of this one as I probably haven't a clue what would work best for you but am uncertain why "two Aero racers done up in J100 style with straight yoke, no gussets, etc., both specified in size 38, but the actual measurements nearly 2 inches different in key areas such as P2P and shoulders" would be so far apart? Theoretically both would have been made from the same pattern and fail to understand the discrepancy. I say this since the Cafe Racer pattern in size 42 with 2" added to the circumference of the waist (1" added to each side panel) produces a jacket, specifically a Sheene, that is likely the closest thing to a bespoke jacket I will ever wear!

Maybe ton312's suggestion of a Thedi CR might be a viable option unless you decide to have Johhson Leathers build you a bespoke jacket from a fit jacket sent to you. I think that pawineguy had a Thedi CR that he sold to Dan_t a few months ago that did look very appealing.

 

[cuchulain]

I like the Langlitz story a lot better than their designs, honestly they do nothing for me at all. It all looks so dated, and not in a good way. I guess the Crescent, their version of the CR is OK, but the rest of the lineup just gives me a bad 80's vibe.

 

[ton312]

Off-topic a bit but if Schott ever does a 118 in a see CXL I'm buying two!

 

[Fanch]

From looking at the Langlitz catalog, the Crescent seemed to be the only one that might be used as a casual jacket without screaming "ride" when worn, and was the only one that appealed to me. It is my understanding that Langlitz does build a jacket based one your measurements and how you want it to fit.

 

[Monitor]

I like the Langlitz story a lot better than their designs, honestly they do nothing for me at all. It all looks so dated, and not in a good way. I guess the Crescent, their version of the CR is OK, but the rest of the lineup just gives me a bad 80's vibe.

TBH I have felt the same for quite a while, now. I admit I've going with the flow on them, and there's no denying they're super top quality, but... Okay, I'd be lying if I said I didn't like their designs, but none of it is particularly inspired. The Crescent is lovely but it is basically a redo of, well, any classic mandarin collared racer; Sidewinder is a frankenjacket if I've ever seen one, and the Cascade is a Lewis Leathers Monza with a bi-swing back - company they've obviously been taking a lot of hints from. I don't know who originally came up with a sleeve pocket, but this has been a LL trademark of a sort for years.

 

[navetsea]

I like the design of chest pockets on that one, and also their position
very ideal and proportional to my eye.

 

[GregO]

So... let me sum this up... you have had 37458 off-the-rack jackets from different companies and each one of them was not as perfectly shaped to your body as you would have liked it and now you are asking us which off-the-rack jacket to go for now?

Wrong.

The Diamond Dave was custom. I just didn't like the large diameter of the arms.
The Aeros were semi custom, meaning I picked a pre set chest size, and then altered back length, sleeve length, and torso diameter. The two size 38s varied widely in measurements, despite the fact that the only measurememt I changed from one to the next was 0.25 inches in the sleeve. Made from the same pattern, probably....but I'm not the first to experience fairly wide size fluctuations from Aero.

 

[GregO]

With respect to Schott- they don't do custom sizing anymore. Back when I owned one, I wore it two sizes too big so the sleeves were long enough. I've grown a bit more discerning these days, and expect my jackets to fit both in the sleeves, and elsewhere.

 

[nick123]

The difference between a Schott and Langlitz (both cowhide) isn't such that one is SIGNIFICANTLY superior to the other. I just feel the Langlitz has a charm about it. Maybe it's the verdigris on the brass...

The Langlitz I own (from Pawineguy) is indeed cut with a little more of a "masculine" profile, if that makes sense. It is a bit roomier. Nothing like the images on their site though. Much more attractive in person.

The Schott seemed more utilitarian (which can arguably be called an attractive quality) while the Langlitz just seemed more elegant, appeared to age more elegantly, and was slightly more substantial.

 

[TREEMAN]

With respect to Schott- they don't do custom sizing anymore. Back when I owned one, I wore it two sizes too big so the sleeves were long enough. I've grown a bit more discerning these days, and expect my jackets to fit both in the sleeves, and elsewhere.

According to Gail on Schott's forum they do custom jackets.

 

[Justhandguns]

I never quite understood where's this coming from, either. Even ignoring the fact that you've got five or six decades old Schott's floating around looking as good as they ever had - which I'm sure should speak enough about the quality of the brand - I'm convinced they're solely responsible for keeping this whole leather jacket scene alive & on the radar as they were offering these styles everyone's obsessing over nowadays way before any of the fancy fancy repros became a thing, always doing the Perfecto, the CR, everything.
..........

I think one of the reasons why people regard Schotts are of less quality is because they do not make all their line-ups in the US. They have cheaper versions of their jackets made somewhere in Asia which, for certain, are worse than their US made cousins. Another fact is that Schott NYC is now more of a fashion brand than a hardcore leather jacket maker, it gives people idea that they are not serious anymore. From what I have seen, as long as Schott NYC keep their higher end production line in the US, their quality should be guaranteed.