Hat prices hurting hat comeback?

[GamaH]

Excellent points.

But, I would wager if a hat company started aggressively advertizing "fur" hats to the general public the average person would attach a negative connotation to "fur".

I would say it's a smart marketing choice on their part to avoid the fur moniker, even if it is a better quality hat and if the fur is humanely harvested.

While we know the fur felt isn't the same as a fur coat, but you just can't say "fur" these days without someone in the room tsk-tsk-ing or gasping.

In what way is fur felt different from a fur coat? Isn't the animal killed in both instances?

 

[T Jones]

Those two goofs drive me nuts. There is a third guy, too, who has mostly western stuff and he thinks every hat he has is 100 years old and worth $400 when most of his hats are less than 40 years old. He constantly misidentifies stuff.

As to other sellers, I was watching a Stetson 100 and with the leather trunk it went for $120, so, yeah, there are other sellers selling at reasonable prices.

Whenever I'm searching the "bay" and see one of their hats, I don't even bother to look at them anymore. Both said they would deal on the prices, but what they call dealing is still outrageous and not much lower than their asking prices. I've seen some hats on there that are so filthy, worn, and moth eaten that they look like they've been blasted with a shotgun and dragged through a garbage dump! Even those hats I've seen sellers try to advertise them as a Johnny Depp hat and put a $200 price on them! There are a couple, three guys, on there who usually have some real nice ones at very reasonable starting bids....But a Stetson 100 with the leather trunk that went for $120, oh yeah, that was a definitely a bargain!

 

[hatsRme]

"Now, when you say "irony hats" you mean..."

Hats which need to be, or have been ironed?

 

[The Fedorable]

"Now, when you say "irony hats" you mean..."

Hats which need to be, or have been ironed?

Hahahahaha!

 

[TheDane]

Hahahahaha!

:arated: lol :eusa_clap lol

 

[John Galt]

Interesting mix here lately. Perhaps at the risk of rekindling the argument, The Dane is correct that hat sales had been on a steep decline for decades following the Great Depression. That is a demonstrable fact. The information is easy to find if one bothers to look.

There are a variety of reasons cited by those in the business. The best I've heard are that shampoo became available, and that hat checks became too expensive. John Kennedy may have been a factor in putting the period on the sentence, but he was really a product of his generation when it came to hat wearing, rather than someone on the cutting edge. See Brad's well-written & documented article:

http://thehattedprofessor.bowershats.com/2013/11/jfks-hat-legacy.html?m=1

My second point is that hat prices should actually decrease rather than increase if they really do get largely popular again, as someone suggested. That is pretty straightforward. These items are expensive because they are labor intensive to make and there is not a huge market. If the market were larger, the costs could be spread amongst a larger base, and the per unit price would drop.


"Faint hat never won fair lady."

 

[John Galt]

One more thing, and I know some of you fellas are going to scream about this, but the recent spike in prices for many collectible golden era hats is pretty much in line with what one pays for a "quality" new fur hat. It is actually a little low, probably, even in light of the "ick" factor.

The fact of the matter is that these hats (and some more than others) are collectible items of a nostalgic era that is gone forever. My prediction is that the prices for them will generally continue to rise until they reach the proper range in comparison to similar new items made by the craftsman some of us frequent.


"Faint hat never won fair lady."

 

[fedoracentric]

Whenever I'm searching the "bay" and see one of their hats, I don't even bother to look at them anymore. Both said they would deal on the prices, but what they call dealing is still outrageous and not much lower than their asking prices. I've seen some hats on there that are so filthy, worn, and moth eaten that they look like they've been blasted with a shotgun and dragged through a garbage dump! Even those hats I've seen sellers try to advertise them as a Johnny Depp hat and put a $200 price on them! There are a couple, three guys, on there who usually have some real nice ones at very reasonable starting bids....But a Stetson 100 with the leather trunk that went for $120, oh yeah, that was a definitely a bargain!

I agree. But the nice thing about both of their auctions is that the photos they make have a particular style so you can tell right away in the base search whose auction the photos will be and you don't have to waste time clicking on them. So, I have to thank both of them for that. They save me time.

As to the Stetson 100, it was a size 7, so sortta small. Still, it was a great pice. It had the lather trunk as well as the plastic insert hat holder and an original key. Very good deal.

Now, here is the funniest, most idiotic auction I've seen for a while...

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Rare-1910s-...814?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2586ccfc3e

Why this mope thinks that a common gibus, opera top hat is worth a whopping $3,0000 (yes I said three thousand dollars) is anyone's guess.

What planet is this idiot living on when every other gibus hat is going for about $100 or so??

 

[fedoracentric]

My second point is that hat prices should actually decrease rather than increase if they really do get largely popular again, as someone suggested. That is pretty straightforward. These items are expensive because they are labor intensive to make and there is not a huge market. If the market were larger, the costs could be spread amongst a larger base, and the per unit price would drop.

This is exactly correct. Think of it in terms of big screen TVs. When they were new only very rich people could afford them at $10,000 a pop. But as they became more popular and manufacturing stepped up to fill the orders, bulk production (and to another degree technology) cut the costs to the point where they came down in price for the average Joe to afford one.

This same thing would happen if everyone started wearing fedoras again. As more and more people wanted them the costs of raw materials would come down as more would be made and the market would drive prices downward to a degree.

 

[scottyrocks]

My second point is that hat prices should actually decrease rather than increase if they really do get largely popular again, as someone suggested. That is pretty straightforward. These items are expensive because they are labor intensive to make and there is not a huge market. If the market were larger, the costs could be spread amongst a larger base, and the per unit price would drop.

This^^, with a caveat.

Handmade hats will most likely not come down in price due to the labor intensiveness, and the ability of the hat maker being able to make just so many hats in a given period of time. With limited production ability, prices will need to stay high for said handmade hat maker to operate in the black.

Machine made hats, however, can come down in price because so many more of them can be made in 'x' amount of time, as compared to handmade hats. It's the old Ford MoCo assembly line model.

 

[TheDane]

It's the old Ford MoCo assembly line model.

Not quite. If felt fedoras became more popular, the felt prices would probably go up. Where would all the extra beavers come from? There are only a limited number in the wild, and trapping them is hard work, and not something you can do with a machine. Furthermore a more intensive hunt for beavers will draw more attention to, what fedoras are made from, and wake up environmentalists. That will probably only contribute to even higher prices

 

[John Galt]

Nutria!


"Faint hat never won fair lady."

 

[TheDane]

Nutria!

You would still need rabbits to get a nice hand. Nutria on it's own is quite coarse, due to it's coarser guard hair, situated all over the pelt. Environmentalist-wise it would probably be easier with nutria, but only in the areas where nutria is an invasive pest, I guess

 

[scottyrocks]

I think that whatever animals were used for the making of hats would begin to be harvested in the way that beef and chicken are for food - that is, in controlled environments. But that would only occur if demand was there. It would have to be a quick business decision by a, or a few, visionary people - to get an enterprise like that up and running relatively quickly.

Then marketing would create a demand for the meat, pacifying the anti-fur heads.

Stranger things have happened.

 

[TheDane]

As far as I know, farmed animals have been a dream of the industry for many decades, but that the felting quality always has turned out too poor. It's also quite hard for me to imagine beavers farmed in a large scale controlled environtment. You're right, though ... strange things do happen

 

[CaramelSmoothie]

Furthermore a more intensive hunt for beavers will draw more attention to, what fedoras are made from, and wake up environmentalists.

Ole,

You are correct. When I began collecting hats, I just assumed that they were all made of wool. I was absolutely appalled and disgusted to learn that beavers were drowned to make felt hats. I know, I was dumb, but I really had no clue that animals were killed to make something as mundane as a hat. I really felt bad about it and I still do, even though I eat meat and wear leather and vintage fur. Now, was I "appalled" and "disgusted" enough to stop collecting the hats made from beavers? Not quite I think many people don't know that animals are sacrificed for hats as they would know by looking at a fur coat.

 

[dh66]

I always assumed that most of the rabbit fur used these days was a by product of the commercial meat industry. They are not particularly common on the Americam table, but I do see them dressed in the grocery from time to time, and they are fairly common in other countries. I guess Akubra would have no shortage of wild rabbit fur, though.

Sent from my SGH-T959V using Tapatalk 2

 

[TheDane]

I think many people don't know that animals are sacrificed for hats as they would know by looking at a fur coat.

Due to experiences with loooong discussions, I'm a little reluctant to use words like "rabbit" and "beaver" in the same sentence as "hat" outside certain circles

 

[fedoracentric]

Nutria on it's own is quite coarse, due to it's coarser guard hair, situated all over the pelt.

The few 100% nutria Stetsons I've seen have been stiff as a board and wear like steel. Even the moths are not overly fond of them.

 

[1961MJS]

You would still need rabbits to get a nice hand. Nutria on it's own is quite coarse, due to it's coarser guard hair, situated all over the pelt. Environmentalist-wise it would probably be easier with nutria, but only in the areas where nutria is an invasive pest, I guess

Hi

FORTUNATELY, I believe that Nutria are an invasive pest pretty much everywhere that they grow. From my limited knowledge Nutria are open season like Coyotes in many states. Some Louisiana police departments shoot them at night with infrared scopes as practice for their snipers. From what I saw on the TV show showing this, they just let the carcasses drop.

Later