German & Austrian Hutmachers

[mayserwegener]

Thanks! Superior is the highest quality Velour. It's the same color / farbe (F) 997 as my JHS Superior Crystall Velour. The light effect from this JHS metallic gray is really spectacular.

JHS Superior Crystall Velour

 

[ofcoursemyhorse]

After getting a Huckel Jota a while back its been my gold standard for comparison just because of how next level it was in terms of finish to others i've handled. This one is hands down the softest and finest finish i've had yet. They really were miracle workers back then, the one you posted above has been a long time favorite of mine.

 

[mayserwegener]

Yes definitely the gold standard. I am looking forward to seeing yours in action. I can only look at the above JHS Superior Crystal Velour. Are you sending it to BSHW for a new ribbon / bow?

JHS Brushers circa 1898

 

[moehawk]

Although this one was made in Czechoslovakia, it is an Austrian maker so I think it qualifies...

1 3/4" brim on this little greenie. Size tag is incorrect, it's a 7 3/8. Velour is nice and soft. I LOVE IT!!!

 

[moehawk]

The action shot...shows color nicely.

 

[moehawk]

A couple more pics of tags found under sweatband.

Another size tag, different size than the first...
Also, a couple of tag remains.

 

[mayserwegener]

Very interesting! It's actually a TONAK (Novy Jicin, Czechoslovakia). I am not sure about the Borsalino - USA connection. Besdor (Steven) might have some information. All hat companies were nationalized under TONAK post WWII. TONAK had Peschel trademarks at the same time as Anton Peschel Dinkelsbühl (started by the Peschel family that were expelled from Neutitschein / Novi Jicin Austria/ Czechoslovakia).

 

[moehawk]

Interesting indeed. Would you date it to the 50's to 60's then? Also, did TONAK continue to use the same logo as the Peschel family did when in Czechoslovakia?

 

[Socially Distorted]

Hey Guys, Picked up my first non UK or US hats this week in a vintage shop for an unbelievable £10 each. The Collins is a beautiful dark blue dress weight felt with a 2 1/8 inch brim and a 4 1/2 inch crown i'm gonna guess 50's on the brim width? . The Lembert, which I'm assuming dates to the 60's is 4 1/2 inch crown with a two inch bound edge brim. The felt looks light weight but is anything but!

 

[mayserwegener]

Nice finds! My guess is late 1960s maybe a bit later for the Lembert. The Collins probably later.

Here is my Lembert web page. I visited the Lembert factory back in 2011.

http://germanaustrianhats.invisionzone.com/index.php?/topic/13-kr-lembert-hutfabrik/

Collins Wien Salzburg is still in business but from what I heard not making hats. They bought some of what was left of P. & C. Habig Wien blocks / flanges and their hat maker (retired) was also from P. & C. Habig Wien.

http://germanaustrianhats.invisionzone.com/index.php?/topic/75-collins-wien-salzburg/?p=438

 

[mayserwegener]

Interesting indeed. Would you date it to the 50's to 60's then? Also, did TONAK continue to use the same logo as the Peschel family did when in Czechoslovakia?

TONAK applied for this trademark in 1966 so it's later than that. My guess is late 1960s early 1970s (could be later). I am not aware of AP using this logo up to WWII but it's possible. Same with APD post 1950. The trademark stuff is somewhat of a mystery post WWII. It seems TONAK avoided the German market which is not surprising considering what happened post WWII. My guess is late 1960s early 1970s. Here is the trademark information from my website.

http://germanaustrianhats.invisionzone.com/index.php?/topic/8-peschel-hutfabrik/page-2#entry764

 

[moehawk]

So, it sounds to me like TONAK was looking to boost sales with some name recognition. While the velour is nice, better than the Bianchi I have, but the Anton Peschel has a much nicer hand. I know TONAK makes good felt, but was this quality drop (in your opinion, of course) due to Anton having special secret techniques, or jut a sign of the times?
Pic may not help, but it looks cool!

 

[mayserwegener]

The APD is earlier so probably not a good comparison. Also I am not sure about APD felt production and finishing capacities. They were a small operation (nothing like what they left in Neutitschein / Novy Jicin). Yes TONAK quality (like everyone else) has gone down (highest was late 40s early 50s). The finest Velours were pre WWII. See JHS (became TONAK main factory post WWII) Superior Crystal Velour I posted above. In my opinion the pinnacle of felt production (color, finish, hand). Here you can see some really fantastic early (late 40s early 50s) TONAK hats.

http://germanaustrianhats.invisionzone.com/index.php?/topic/124-tonak-formely-hueckel-plant-hueckel/

You might find this interesting.

http://germanaustrianhats.invisionz...-seal-velour-late-1940s-early-1950s/?hl=tonak

 

[moehawk]

Yeah, those are some beautiful velours.

 

[ofcoursemyhorse]

Yes definitely the gold standard. I am looking forward to seeing yours in action. I can only look at the above JHS Superior Crystal Velour. Are you sending it to BSHW for a new ribbon / bow?

More than likely, I have a few in for repair already. I'm just waiting on those before I send in my next batch for a tune up.

 

[mayserwegener]

I discovered the F.J. in the above crest is Franz Josef I Emperor of Austria, King of Hungary, Croatia and Bohemia. This is one of the liner plates from my Czech Republic find.

I made this discovery from the above photo that shows the F.J. medal below the F.J. Progress Medal won by Johann Hückel´s Söhne (JHS) at the 1873 Vienna World Expo . Also the same F.J. crest in the center of the Double Eagle. I am fairly certain that the above liner stamp is for JHS.

http://www.wikiwand.com/de/Weltausstellung_1873

 

[mayserwegener]

Brüder Böhm Neutitschein Die Stamps, probably 1920s. I received another batch (42) of Die Stamps from the Czech Republic about 2 weeks ago but most are not hat company related (still amazing though). These BB Die Stamps are small so might have been used for paper labels.

 

[mayserwegener]

Johann Hückel´s Söhne (JHS) Neutitschein Die Stamps, probably early 1900s. These are also from the latest batch (42) of Die Stamps from the Czech Republic. The first one is really fantastic.

 

[Trenchfriend]

Wonderful!

 

[Denton]

Habig velour. Ribbon and sweatband replaced by Optimo. The seller believed this hat was from the 1930s.



This is the best shot I could get of the label. Most of it has been obliterated anyway.

"P.&C.H. / SPEZIAL QUAL"