Freewheelers vs. The Real McCoys vs. Vanson Cross Zip Jackets

[ton312]

You have drank too much of your own Kool-Aid if you genuinely believe that "the Vanson is more beautiful in every respect." Frankly, it isn't even close. Fit aside (which is customer dependent), the FW jacket is exponentially better looking and better quality.

Care to put your money where your mouth is? Lets select five independent judges -- people with extensive experience in the leather jacket industry, but no affiliation with Vanson or FW. We will ask all five judges to review Jake's Vanson and FW jackets, and to answer the following question: "which is the better quality jacket." No definition of quality will be provided; rather, each judge will apply his/her own definition of quality. If the majority of the judges deem the Vanson the better quality jacket, I will give you $10,000. If the majority of the judges deem the FW the better quality jacket, you will give me $5,000. I am giving you two-to-one odds. What do you say? @Monitor , I'll make the same offer to you. You guys repeatedly pound the table that Vanson is objectively the superior quality jacket. Lets see whether industry experts agree with you. I'm betting they will not and I am willing to put my money where my mouth is. You?

How utterly absurd. The majority of posters (that are every bit experts) in this thread have ALREADY AGREED the Vanson looks better. Both in fit and the hide as well. It has clearly caused you a great deal of pain to read. But let's have real talk, shall we. Your pompus responses full of arrogant legalese have left a sour taste in my mouth and frankly, for the last time. Why you feel you should be able to censor my opinions and freedom of speech on this forum is laughable and ridiculous.

As far as your silly bet is concerned, I consider myself to be someone with extensive experience (far more than you quite frankly) when it comes to leather jackets and I do not need to consult any of your so called "industry experts". The problem with you is that you simply can't see beauty if it doesn't fit into your narrow, self serving silo. So you continue to miss the point, again and again. Kudos to Jake for being able to overcome this affliction, and end up with his best looking jacket.

 

[Imuricecreamman]

Wow, guys! It's friday night. Much better to wear dancing shoes than boxing gloves.

 

[ton312]

Wow, guys! It's friday night. Much better to wear dancing shoes than boxing gloves.

No it’s midday here. And Elton John said Friday night is alright for fighting. LOL.
I’m not in it for a fight. There’s none to be had. But I’m not going to be censored or shamed for my opinions either.

 

[Imuricecreamman]

No it’s midday here. And Elton John said Friday night is all right for fighting.

Elton was chairman for Watford Football Club. I've been to a few Watford games and they are indeed a rowdy bunch :/

 

[El Marro]

@Superfluous, take it easy man. I think this is one of the times where it’s best just to agree to disagree.

 

[Will Zach]

Wow, I left an amicable thread and I returned to a bar fight. Wha happened? Better agree to disagree fellas and move on. Getting hot under the collar doesn't do anybody any good.

 

[Canuck Panda]

The OP wore high waist jeans with all three jackets. But these three jackets were meant for different jeans (waist rise).
Nothing to do with the person's actual height, everything to do with his pants height.
Imagine if he had wore mid rise with the FW, and low rise with the J24. The overall fit would look very different.
Also the sleeves on the FW and the J24 are so new they have not set in like the old Vanson, so they look comparatively longer. It has nothing to do with length but everything to do with time.
If the OP keeps these jackets for a few years the sleeves will look all about the same in a few years.
But yes, the price of one FW or RMC equals to at least 4 Vansons. This again has nothing to do with the actual jackets but more about how one chose to spend his money. If someone chose to pay 500 dollars for a Wagyu burger served on a silver platter brought to his bedside by a centerfold playmate, then let the man have his fun.

 

[think_zot]

How utterly absurd. The majority of posters (that are every bit experts) in this thread have ALREADY AGREED the Vanson looks better. Both in fit and the hide as well. It has clearly caused you a great deal of pain to read. But let's have real talk, shall we. Your pompus responses full of arrogant legalese have left a sour taste in my mouth and frankly, for the last time. Why you feel you should be able to censor my opinions and freedom of speech on this forum is laughable and ridiculous. GTFO.

As far as your silly bet is concerned, I consider myself to be someone with extensive experience (far more than you quite frankly) when it comes to leather jackets and I do not need to consult any of your so called "experts". The problem with you is that you simply can't see beauty if it doesn't fit into your narrow, self serving silo. So you continue to miss the point, again and again. Kudos to Jake for being able to overcome this affliction, and end up with his best looking jacket.

 

[willyto]

The OP wore high waist jeans with all three jackets. But these three jackets were meant for different jeans (waist rise).
Nothing to do with the person's actual height, everything to do with his pants height.
Imagine if he had wore mid rise with the FW, and low rise with the J24. The overall fit would look very different.
Also the sleeves on the FW and the J24 are so new they have not set in like the old Vanson, so they look comparatively longer. It has nothing to do with length but everything to do with time.
If the OP keeps these jackets for a few years the sleeves will look all about the same in a few years.
But yes, the price of one FW or RMC equals to at least 4 Vansons. This again has nothing to do with the actual jackets but more about how one chose to spend his money. If someone chose to pay 500 dollars for a Wagyu burger served on a silver platter brought to his bedside by a centerfold playmate, then let the man have his fun.

I don’t think trousers rise has anything to do here. You can see how the FW is longer. Because of that it sits different on @dudewuttheheck and covers his jeans pockets and more of the back. The jacket is objectively longer wether he wears low rise, mide rise or high rise jeans. I’m not saying is right or wrong but that affects fit because the jacket sits on his seat and hips or so does it look like.

I know from experience because my FW Sunset has such a huge dip front to back that it digs into my trousers. Were it shorter in the front it would fit me 100% times better.

 

[ton312]

View attachment 413155

Thanks for the Browns Beach zot! I meant to message you. Despite my imaginary bias against Japanese made goods, this jacket fits to the nuts and I love it!

 

[Mich486]

The FW and the RMC are exponentially better jackets than the Vanson in my opinion. I don’t need to handle a 1000 jackets to see that. It’s like comparing White’s boots to… i don’t know Edward Green’s. Does that mean I cannot enjoy a pair of White’s? Obviously not.

The Vanson fits dude better but that’s about it. The RMC is clearly the wrong size so not sure how that can be used as a proof that the Vanson is better.

No hate to anyone of course, it’s a light hearted discussion for what I’m concerned but saying that the Vanson is better than the other 2 jackets i find it quite baffling.

 

[ton312]

The FW and the RMC are exponentially better jackets than the Vanson in my opinion. I don’t need to handle a 1000 jackets to see that. It’s like comparing White’s boots to… i don’t know Edward Green’s. Does that mean I cannot enjoy a pair of White’s? Obviously not.

The Vanson fits dude better but that’s about it. The RMC is clearly the wrong size so not sure how that can be used as a proof that the Vanson is better.

No hate to anyone of course, it’s a light hearted discussion for what I’m concerned but saying that the Vanson is better than the other 2 jackets i find it quite baffling.

I am equally baffled by your inability to see it. Que sera, sera. You are entitled to your view as much as I am mine. But had you used any manner of colorful descriptors to illustrate your point, I would not care about that either.

 

[dannyk]

Everyone sees things differently. It’s all about how you express that opinion and allowing others to disagree.

 

[Canuck Panda]

I don’t think trousers rise has anything to do here. You can see how the FW is longer. Because of that it sits different on @dudewuttheheck and covers his jeans pockets and more of the back. The jacket is objectively longer wether he wears low rise, mide rise or high rise jeans. I’m not saying is right or wrong but that affects fit because the jacket sits on his seat and hips or so does it look like.

I know from experience because my FW Sunset has such a huge dip front to back that it digs into my trousers. Were it shorter in the front it would fit me 100% times better.

I cannot change my height. But I can change my pants.
The CHP jacket would be equivalent to OP's C2. The Aero would be equivalent to FW I think in terms of length. The RMC looks longer so I'd would go even lower rise. Just my theory.

 

[Imuricecreamman]

I cannot change my height. But I can change my pants.
The CHP jacket would be equivalent to OP's C2. The Aero would be equivalent to FW I think in terms of length. The RMC looks longer so I'd would go even lower rise. Just my theory.

View attachment 413157

The depth of your closet is crazy...... Mindnumbing infact.

 

[Superfluous]

The majority of posters (that are every bit experts) in this thread have ALREADY AGREED the Vanson looks better.

I also agreed that the Vanson looks better on Jake. However, you went further and, based on Jake's fit, you proclaimed the Vanson superior from a quality perspective. I don't see the majority of posters agreeing with your false logic that Jake's fit equates to superior quality. To the contrary, the majority of posters have been incredibly complimentary of the FW jacket.

It has clearly caused you a great deal of pain to read.

Because I strongly disagree with your premise, I am in "a great deal of pain"? Such personal disparagement has no place on this forum. I will refrain from responding in kind.

Your pompus responses full of arrogant legalese have left a sour taste in my mouth and frankly, for the last time.

I do not recall any "legal ease" in my prior posts in this thread. Are you referring to my use of the terms "non sequitur" and "ad hominem"? Neither are legal terms. Moreover, they are entirely accurate given your assertions. Using fit to argue quality is a non sequitur.

It is ironic that you are offended by my posts given that you have pejoratively labeled the brands I favor "barf worthy" and "lunch meat."

Nevertheless, if my responses offended you, I apologize. That certainly was not my intent.

Why you feel you should be able to censor my opinions and freedom of speech on this forum is laughable and ridiculous. GTFO

I have NEVER sought to censor your opinions or freedom of speech. Not once. To the contrary, I have merely disagreed with your opinions and taken exception with a couple of your inappropriate references (e.g., "barf worthy," which you subsequently conceded was inappropriate).

In contrast, you most certainly seek to censor and outright bar my opinions and freedom of speech by urging me to "GET THE F**K OUT."

I consider myself to be someone with extensive experience (far more than you quite frankly) when it comes to leather jackets and I do not need to consult any of your so called "industry experts".

You undeniably have FAR, FAR more experience than I. That said, your subjective opinions do not become objective truisms simply because you exalt them. Rather, your subjective options are just that: opinions. And, I strongly suspect that other informed industry participants disagree.

GTFO.

Lets deal with the core of your post. You have demanded that I "GET THE F**K OUT." I am disappointed both by your demand and the fact that the Moderators have allowed it to stand. Perhaps they agree that I should leave. If the Moderators allow your demand to remain, I will interpret their inaction as an endorsement of your demand and I will "GET THE F**K OUT."

 

[red devil]

That is getting a bit too heated, let's cool off a bit Let's try to turn this into a constructive conversation

There is an interesting point to be made, might be time to go back to the drawing board and consider what constitutes quality in a leather jacket.

The obvious ones are:

- Materials used (leather, hardware, etc.)
- Construction (typically been a big focus on stitching, seams and lowest number of mistakes)
- Fit?

That last one is interesting, for a bespoke maker, I would argue it is part of the package

On the other hand, for an OTR brand, I would say the quality of the pattern and how well it fits a variety of body types is to be taken into consideration.

Thoughts?

 

[Rich22]

Guys, don't get too bent out of shape about a disagreement on a forum. Maybe do what I do and block the person that annoys you? Works for me

 

[Rich22]

"Quality" is very subjective. In my mind quality is trumped by pattern and fit.

Let's take jeans, for example. Iron Heart vs Levi's. Iron Heart are phenomenal quality. Their signature fabric is different class, every little detail is wonderfully done, and I have genuinely marvelled at how well made they are. They don't, however, sell a pair of jeans that fit me as well as Levi's 541. They have no competing pattern, and on my body their better options simply don't fit right. Are the Levi's good quality? Sometimes the quality is alright, but more often than not it's a bit disappointing. Variable fabric, variable finishing, heck, variable sizing!! I'd pay for better 541's, and indeed have, when Levi's can be bothered to sell the "Premium" version of the jeans. Whilst better, the Premium is still leagues below Iron Heart in quality. But until a higher quality maker makes jeans with such a good pattern for me, it simply doesn't matter.

Similarly, however good the quality of the Japanese jackets is, it just doesn't matter when you rarely ever see them fit someone (Asian or Western) perfectly.

 

[Marc mndt]

Similarly, however good the quality of the Japanese jackets is, it just doesn't matter when you rarely ever see them fit someone (Asian or Western) perfectly.

+1

Here's a prime example :

Fountainhead Leathers

High quality stitching

Potato sack quality fit