Formal Wear Primer

[dhermann1]

White trousers

Wow! Faskinatin'. One wonders what material, stripe or no strip, and cuff or no cuff. I have a nice pair of plain off white light wool garabardine (I think that's what they are!) trousers, with cuffs. I am now imagining them with a dinner jacket. Hmmm . . .
Regarding the question of whether the trousers and jacket of a tux must be the same material, somebody: am I wrong?

 

[dhermann1]

I always seem to have a problem posting the photos....I put on my avatar for now.

You have 13 posts as of now. You need to make 2 more to be able to post pics.

 

[bradbunnin]

Black and White

I have seen a picture, in an Esquire magazine from the mid-thirties, of the black tuxedo jacket/white trousers combination. It's clearly intended for summer wear, and it has a certain charm. And utility.

 

[Cobden]

Wow! Faskinatin'. One wonders what material, stripe or no strip, and cuff or no cuff. I have a nice pair of plain off white light wool garabardine (I think that's what they are!) trousers, with cuffs. I am now imagining them with a dinner jacket. Hmmm . . .
Regarding the question of whether the trousers and jacket of a tux must be the same material, somebody: am I wrong?

My thoughts are that the British civilians in India would follow the army (and navy) more or less with regards white trousers (which some regiments wore, albeit in overall form, with temperate jackets in the 1920's), being plain, cuffless, satin stripeless and cotton.

 

[TWLyon]

You have 13 posts as of now. You need to make 2 more to be able to post pics.

Thanks. Now I just need one.

 

[Staredge]

Thanks. Now I just need one.

One what?????
'




I love this thread.....just wish I had a place to wear one!!!!! I'm buying one by the end of the year....I'll find a place to wear it.

 

[TWLyon]

One more post to post pictures - and now I need none.

 

[David V]

I have seen a picture, in an Esquire magazine from the mid-thirties, of the black tuxedo jacket/white trousers combination. It's clearly intended for summer wear, and it has a certain charm. And utility.

One of the Astaire/Rodgers films has a chorus line of men in black DJ and white pants. Now, if that was an actual look or a costume designers dream is something else.

 

[cptjeff]

You have 13 posts as of now. You need to make 2 more to be able to post pics.

No you don't. My first post here involved pictures. You need to go to a site like photobucket, upload them there, and put the link in

tags.

 

[TWLyon]

Dancing in tails

Ok, pretty sure I did, but I'll try again...

Here I am dancing with my lovely wife at the Reenactor Fest Ball. Properly fitting tails make even crappy dancers like me look elegant. Anyone who has or can acquire a tux should do so and look for an excuse to wear it. Let's bring a little class back into our all too casual world.

 

[Edw8ri]

Black dinner jacket and white pants? I have never seen such. I have never heard of it. So I went back to my grandmother's copy of Emily Post to see what she had to say. And Emily was silent on the subject. This makes me think that black dinner jackets and white trousers are more in the nature of a costume than proper evening wear.

But I did learn one interesting thing from Emily. White dinner jackets are supposed to be double breasted. The reason is that a waistcoat is not worn with a white dinner jacket because the waistcoat is hotter in the summer. But since no waistcoat, the jacket must be double breasted.

I don't own a white dinner jacket at present. When in college, I inherited an old one from my grandfather. And, it was double breasted. So if I get another, you can guess what I will be looking for.

 

[Cobden]

Black dinner jacket and white pants? I have never seen such. I have never heard of it. So I went back to my grandmother's copy of Emily Post to see what she had to say. And Emily was silent on the subject. This makes me think that black dinner jackets and white trousers are more in the nature of a costume than proper evening wear.

But I did learn one interesting thing from Emily. White dinner jackets are supposed to be double breasted. The reason is that a waistcoat is not worn with a white dinner jacket because the waistcoat is hotter in the summer. But since no waistcoat, the jacket must be double breasted.

I don't own a white dinner jacket at present. When in college, I inherited an old one from my grandfather. And, it was double breasted. So if I get another, you can guess what I will be looking for.

But on the flip side, the white trousers with black DJ was the required dress for the members of the stuffiest, old fashioned clubs, in the most old fashioned stuck in their ways cities in a country famed for being behind the times socially (when compared to the UK, let alone the US) in the mid 20's.

It is also interesting to note that during the opening years of the 20th century, the white DJ was worn with white tie accoutrements in India - one wore tails when travelling to the hosts house, upon arriving a member of the host's household staff would take you're tail coat and hand you you're white DJ (sent in advance by one of you're household)

 

[Tomasso]

Ok, pretty sure I did, but I'll try again...

Using Photobucket:click on the IMG Code until it reads 'copied', then paste directly into the thread.

 

[Tomasso]

White dinner jackets are supposed to be double breasted. The reason is that a waistcoat is not worn with a white dinner jacket because the waistcoat is hotter in the summer. But since no waistcoat, the jacket must be double breasted.

Really.......I thought that a SB DJ with cummerbund was correct as well.

 

[Cobden]

Really.......I thought that a SB DJ with cummerbund was correct as well.

Again, the same source lists cummerbunds with white dinner jackets (and in the 1930's, "shell jackets" - presumably another word for the white mess jacket) as required dress aboard ship to the British African colonies. More interestingly, these were coloured, rather then black, cummerbunds - and were colour coded for thier conveniance, with officers in the Colonial Service sporting different coloured cummerbunds depending on where they were to be based: Green for Nigeria, blue for the Gambia, red for Sierra Leone and, natually, gold for the Gold Coast (modern Ghana)

 

[boushi_mania]

Not to change the subject, but...

My morning coat came in the mail yesterday!

I haven't taken any pictures yet, but it was from this auction on eBay. Once I upload some images, I'll put them up on my thread from earlier.

Overall, I'm quite pleased with it: it fits well in the shoulders, and both the overall length and waist-seam placement are close to ideal. It's a bit big in the chest, which I expected (the coat is a 38, and I'm more of a 37), but it looks as though it won't take too much effort to get it altered down to a slimmer silhouette.

But the reason I'm posting here is the buttons: I don't really like them. They look to be plastic, and slightly faded from pure black with age. On top of that, the sleeve buttons don't actually work, contrary to the eBay description. I could live with the three buttons (rather than four) on each side if they were classy and functional, but since they're applied... I think I'll go ahead and replace them.

This site has a nice selection of buttons to choose from--I especially like this one in carved palmnut, and this cloth-covered style with the checkered weave. To my eye, the latter is classier / more formal, since it's also used on frock coats... but maybe it's overdoing it to put them on a cutaway for the same reason. I'd like to know what others more knowledgeable than I am have to say.

 

[Charlie Huang]

My morning coat came in the mail yesterday!

I haven't taken any pictures yet, but it was from this auction on eBay. Once I upload some images, I'll put them up on my thread from earlier.

Overall, I'm quite pleased with it: it fits well in the shoulders, and both the overall length and waist-seam placement are close to ideal. It's a bit big in the chest, which I expected (the coat is a 38, and I'm more of a 37), but it looks as though it won't take too much effort to get it altered down to a slimmer silhouette.

But the reason I'm posting here is the buttons: I don't really like them. They look to be plastic, and slightly faded from pure black with age. On top of that, the sleeve buttons don't actually work, contrary to the eBay description. I could live with the three buttons (rather than four) on each side if they were classy and functional, but since they're applied... I think I'll go ahead and replace them.

This site has a nice selection of buttons to choose from--I especially like this one in carved palmnut, and this cloth-covered style with the checkered weave. To my eye, the latter is classier / more formal, since it's also used on frock coats... but maybe it's overdoing it to put them on a cutaway for the same reason. I'd like to know what others more knowledgeable than I am have to say.

Altering a body coat is not the same as altering a sack coat. It is a highly skilled operation as a waist seam and a vent is involed (the coat would more or less have to be re-cut at the back). Just be aware that it might cost you a lot and that the results might not be as satisfactory. Personally, I would leave it be if it more or less fits.

The buttons should be plain black polished horn. Simple as that. Covered buttons like those you example are more suitable for frock coats. I would indeed add the fourth button on the cuff. 3 buttons are less formal.

 

[boushi_mania]

Altering a body coat is not the same as altering a sack coat. It is a highly skilled operation as a waist seam and a vent is involed (the coat would more or less have to be re-cut at the back). Just be aware that it might cost you a lot and that the results might not be as satisfactory. Personally, I would leave it be if it more or less fits.

The buttons should be plain black polished horn. Simple as that. Covered buttons like those you example are more suitable for frock coats. I would indeed add the fourth button on the cuff. 3 buttons are less formal.

Thanks for the concise explanation. I'll be on the lookout for plain black horn buttons, then.

As for the coat, I'll see what the tailor thinks when I bring it in; first thing is to acquire a waistcoat, though. I didn't pay all that much for the cutaway, so I don't mind if the cost to tailor it is on the high side. As long as the end result looks nice, of course.

 

[dnjan]

But the reason I'm posting here is the buttons: I don't really like them. They look to be plastic, and slightly faded from pure black with age.

I wonder if the buttons you have are indeed horn, and could be rejuvenated with some careful application of black dye.

 

[Charlie Huang]

Thanks for the concise explanation. I'll be on the lookout for plain black horn buttons, then.

As for the coat, I'll see what the tailor thinks when I bring it in; first thing is to acquire a waistcoat, though. I didn't pay all that much for the cutaway, so I don't mind if the cost to tailor it is on the high side. As long as the end result looks nice, of course.

A very good tailor who has altered body coats before should be able to do it. Lesser tailors won't or will do a bad job. Like I said, it is not the case of simply taking in at the seams; the bottom of the tails will have to be taken off and the whole vent will have to be reconstructed before putting the two halves back together again.