Formal Wear Primer

[Cobden]

How about something like this?

You could probably find a second hand pique one cheaper then dry cleaning a silk one (pique ones being machine washable, to boot)

 

[Orgetorix]

Here's the one I bought for my white-tie rig.

 

[MisterGrey]

I apologize, I was mistaken; the fabric is satin, and not silk.

 

[Orgetorix]

Satin is a weave. Silk is a fiber. You can have cotton satin or silk satin. You can also weave silk other ways.

 

[Tomasso]

^^^^

Same applies to velvet.

 

[MisterGrey]

Well, I've certainly got egg on my face now. Then again, so does said acquaintance for telling me there's a difference in the first place. Now we know!

(...and knowing is half the battle!)

 

[pdxvintagette]

Terminology help?

Okay fellas, what is the name of that feature on dinner jackets for the closure - two buttons attached by a long string? They can be worn closed normally or with buttons through both sides of the jacket. Thanks for your help!

Cheers,
Julie

 

[avedwards]

I plan on wearing a collapsible opera top hat with a dinner jacket and cape. Am I right in thinking that the length of the cape will balance out the height of the hat and make the faux pas of top hat and black tie more accpeptable?
I know a silk plush top hat is desirable there, but I cannot afford the £500 it would cost to have one in my size. Fur felt melusine would seem the next best option, but considering that the only times I would wear this outfit would be when with my mol (which requires me to travel) the hat must be collapsible.

Can anyone recommend where I can find a collapsible opera hat, since a google search only seems to turn up costumey ones and I want something which looks serious (as serious as a top hat and cape can be in the 21st century) and is also practical.

 

[Bugsy]

Okay fellas, what is the name of that feature on dinner jackets for the closure - two buttons attached by a long string? They can be worn closed normally or with buttons through both sides of the jacket. Thanks for your help!

Cheers,
Julie

Isn't that called a "frog"? [huh]

 

[boushi_mania]

Okay fellas, what is the name of that feature on dinner jackets for the closure - two buttons attached by a long string? They can be worn closed normally or with buttons through both sides of the jacket. Thanks for your help!

It's called a "link front", I think. It's quite common on formalwear in Japan, to the point that it's the default option for morning coats.

 

[boushi_mania]

Textured weaves -- acceptable?

So, I've been scouting around the Internet for deals on morning-dress items so as to acquire a formal rig for my wedding ceremony (see other thread). While I'm on that track, I was wondering if people could help me out with a more arcane aspect of morning coats.

Basically, my issue is this: I've seen some very nice deals on new old-stock cutaways (1970s-era) that are extremely tempting. One in particular has working sleeve buttons, a fairly high button stance, and almost my exact needs in dimensions, but the material has a subtle herringbone weave to it.

So, what's the consensus on this? Is it acceptable, and if so, is It more or less formal than plain worsted? The salesman at the nearest depatment store in Osaka contends that it's inappropriate for formalwear, but Japan also encourages black waistcoats for everything but weddings and black suits for nearly any event where a suit is worn, so... [huh]

 

[Lokar]

I plan on wearing a collapsible opera top hat with a dinner jacket and cape. Am I right in thinking that the length of the cape will balance out the height of the hat and make the faux pas of top hat and black tie more accpeptable?

I still insist that the top hat was never made incorrect for black tie (and was definitely originally acceptable). However, it _is_ more formal than a homburg. I'd say you need to formal up your black tie (i.e. white waistcoat). However, I suppose, as you won't have the hat on indoors, you could get away with it if you don't have a white waistcoat.

 

[BinkieBaumont]

"If any Lurkers from the Swan River Colony are reading "Yves Saint Salvation Army" Boutique at the bottom of Barrack street, has racks of wing collar shirts, ( Very good Quality for $8.00) bow ties, and pre tied cravats with pearl pins "

 

[Orgetorix]

So, I've been scouting around the Internet for deals on morning-dress items so as to acquire a formal rig for my wedding ceremony (see other thread). While I'm on that track, I was wondering if people could help me out with a more arcane aspect of morning coats.

Basically, my issue is this: I've seen some very nice deals on new old-stock cutaways (1970s-era) that are extremely tempting. One in particular has working sleeve buttons, a fairly high button stance, and almost my exact needs in dimensions, but the material has a subtle herringbone weave to it.

So, what's the consensus on this? Is it acceptable, and if so, is It more or less formal than plain worsted? The salesman at the nearest depatment store in Osaka contends that it's inappropriate for formalwear, but Japan also encourages black waistcoats for everything but weddings and black suits for nearly any event where a suit is worn, so... [huh]

Morning coats have been made with textured cloth for about as long as they've been made, I think. I've seen more than one from the '30s and before that had a herringbone weave. All British, not Japanese, but I think they'd still be acceptable in your context.

 

[anon`]

I still insist that the top hat was never made incorrect for black tie (and was definitely originally acceptable). However, it _is_ more formal than a homburg. I'd say you need to formal up your black tie (i.e. white waistcoat). However, I suppose, as you won't have the hat on indoors, you could get away with it if you don't have a white waistcoat.

I concur with your premise. However, the combination of a topper, tuxedo jacket and turndown collar appears, to my eye, out of proportion. Toppers seem to work fine with morning dress and a turndown, and also with a tuxedo jacket paired with an Imperial or wing collar, but not with a turndown and short tuxedo jacket. Just an observation.

On the issue of patterned fabric, I've seen this before on period American formalwear, as well. In each and every case it's been quite subtle and the sort of thing you only see on close inspection, and in every case it has looked quite not out of place. I don't see an issue with it, either, as long as it isn't some grotesque weave identifiable at distance.

 

[Platten]

Abou tuxedos:

In the 1920s it was possible to wear a single-breasted tuxedo with a tailcoat waistcoat.

It is/was a possibility to add value to a tuxedo if you don't own a tailcoat.

 

[boushi_mania]

Abou tuxedos:

In the 1920s it was possible to wear a single-breasted tuxedo with a tailcoat waistcoat.

It is/was a possibility to add value to a tuxedo if you don't own a tailcoat.

I always saw this the other way: if you already owned a tailcoat, the only accessory you needed to invest in (aside from the suit itself) was the tie. A plausible-enough supposition at the turn of the (20th) century, when the use of semi-formal eveningwear was still heavily proscribed, but what do I know. [huh]

 

[avedwards]

Abou tuxedos:

In the 1920s it was possible to wear a single-breasted tuxedo with a tailcoat waistcoat.

It is/was a possibility to add value to a tuxedo if you don't own a tailcoat.

As far as I am aware since the Edwardian times (when dinner jackets became more common) they could be worn with white waistcoats and the same shirt used for white tie. In the 1930s the white waistcoat with black tie faded out of fashion but always remained acceptable. The dinner jacket (according to films of the era) could have peaked, shawl or notched lapels, unless you don't believe in the latter being appropriate. Peaked would seem the most appropriate though since it is the most formal and therefore the best match for such a formal accessory.

 

[Edw8ri]

I kind of go against the idea that the groomsmen should be dressed uniformly. I think the idea of formal dress is that each individual dress within the limits of the style, but not exactly the same. So one might have peak lapels, one shawl, and another double breasted. I think it would be good even if a groomsman wears a modern iteration of the type, as long as it is all black and white, even white jackets if the weather and season are right.

Precisely because it will memorialized in pictures, you want your dress to be as traditional as possible, so that 30 years from now you do not look at your wedding picture and say to yourself "what a goof I was" (I have experience with this.)

I was in a wedding several years ago in which the men in the wedding party wore black tie. We all owned tuxedos, but the bride's mother insisted that we rent matching tuxedos. I thought that was silly. Not only was that an unnecessary expense I had to pay, but my tuxedo was a lot nicer than the rental tux. And no one would have ever known if we had worn our own clothes.

 

[dhermann1]

Don't wanna say vulgar, but let's say, lacking in class.