Cooper A-2 question

[DrMacabre]

Well, i guess it's a cooper then... i tried a size 40 avirex which was just too big, this cooper is also 40R, i still feel it's larger than what i would like it to be but im afraid i would not be able to move in a 38R. I might give it a try if i find a low price on ebay on a 38R someday.

do you have any advice for breaking the shoulders, they stay at a straight angle, i think it's weird.

 

[Flightengineer]

Nice jacket!

 

[Gamma68]

That's a nice-looking Cooper A-2, @DrMacabre. It appears to be very nicely broken in, particularly in the chest area. I haven't been able to get much graining on my Cooper except in the sleeves.

I like the shoulders in your photos (here and in the WJAYWT thread). The epaulettes also lie flat on your shoulders and appear to be placed further back than on mine. The epaulettes on mine are rounded a little forward, which is annoying to me.

My jacket is also a size 40. Is your Cooper one of the "orange label" jackets from the early 1990s?

 

[Flightengineer]

It is for this reason my Cooper was redused in the shoulders a year ago.
In any case, this is a good jacket, I just tried to get closer to the WW II jackets trim fit.

 

[DrMacabre]

@Gamma68 yes, it's an orange label from the 90's i just bought from ebay.

As you said @Flightengineer , I'm also more into the ww2 trim fit since I'm build like they used to be in the 40's.

 

[Flightengineer]

As you said @Flightengineer , I'm also more into the ww2 trim fit since I'm build like they used to be in the 40's.

I think in France no less talented tailors than we have and you can repeat my experiment. Jacket as a result will be looks similar to jackets of the 40-s.

 

[Gamma68]

Shoulder tailoring on a leather jacket can't be cheap. Given the relative low cost of a second-hand Cooper A-2, I wonder if that cost is justified. And how do you handle moving the epaulettes to compensate for shoulder reduction?

I think the shoulders on my size 40 Cooper could also be reduced for a more 1940's trim fit. Like you, @DrMacabre , I have a build similar to men of that period.

 

[Flightengineer]

Before - jacket suited perfectly, but the shoulders were wide, that is typical for Cooper.
The epaulettes were removed, shortened and after returned to place.
I have not paid a lot of money for this, there are good friends who know how to work with the leather. Cooper was not bought a new, inexpensive.
I did not attend at work, but I was satisfied with the result despite to my perfectionism)))

 

[DrMacabre]

Before - jacket suited perfectly, but the shoulders were wide, that is typical for Cooper.
The epaulettes were removed, shortened and after returned to place.
I have not paid a lot of money for this, there are good friends who know how to work with the leather. Cooper was not bought a new, inexpensive.
I did not attend at work, but I was satisfied with the result despite to my perfectionism)))

Wow, looks perfect to me but im pretty sure it will cost the price i pid the jacket to have it rebuild. I'll have to ask for sure.

 

[Seb Lucas]

@Gamma68 yes, it's an orange label from the 90's i just bought from ebay.

As you said @Flightengineer , I'm also more into the ww2 trim fit since I'm build like they used to be in the 40's.

Your size 40 jacket should have shoulders that are about 18.5 inches wide for a 1940's fit. I imagine those are 20 inches or wider.

 

[DrMacabre]

Your size 40 jacket should have shoulders that are about 18.5 inches wide for a 1940's fit. I imagine those are 20 inches or wider.

Yes, 20"5 if the seller measurements are correct.

 

[Flightengineer]

Your size 40 jacket should have shoulders that are about 18.5 inches wide for a 1940's fit. I imagine those are 20 inches or wider.

You're right. My Cooper (40L size) had the shoulders 21 inches (across back), now it 18 inches (45.5 cm)

 

[Gamma68]

Your size 40 jacket should have shoulders that are about 18.5 inches wide for a 1940's fit. I imagine those are 20 inches or wider.

The shoulders on my Cooper are 20" wide. I do feel 18.5"-19" would suit me better.

 

[Seb Lucas]

Yeah, so often a good fit is all in the shoulders. That 1980's look probably came via Indiana Jones - the droop off the shoulders leather jacket that someone here reminded me recently is probably still seen as the right fit by some men. It took me almost 20 years of jacket buying to understand shoulder and pit to pit measurements and the critical role they play.

 

[DrMacabre]

Yeah, so often a good fit is all in the shoulders. That 1980's look probably came via Indiana Jones - the droop off the shoulders leather jacket that someone here reminded me recently is probably still seen as the right fit by some men. It took me almost 20 years of jacket buying to understand shoulder and pit to pit measurements and the critical role they play.

Now you made me wanna modify my jacket for sure. Last month i bought this California horsehide jacket, it fits like a glove but it is so tight that stiches came off on several parts as soon as i wore it. I had it repaired since but i can only wear it with a shirt, tshirt or like here, a coverall.

 

[Deacon211]

In the end you like what you like and I guess it is true that the 40s era A-2s were proportioned differently. But I still think all three of you look great in those Coopers.

I know it's been said before, but flight jackets were (and still technically are) flight gear. True, if the jacket is too baggy it gets in the way of harnesses, restraints, etc. But, if it's too tight you can't move in it. Probably just as importantly you can't wear anything UNDER it. Even in a heated cockpit, the cold soaks through the canopy and cockpit walls and a thin leather jacket was probably not going to do it, especially in the winter.

I think it's for that reason as much as any that you get some of that oversized look in period pics (not all pics to be fair). I almost wonder if the baggy shoulders of the '80s weren't some weird reflection of that ill wartime fit look.

Having said all that, I don't like super baggy jackets either. So who am I to talk? LOL!

Anyway, you guys should do what you think looks good to you. But I think you all look great in those.

 

[Flightengineer]

Deacon, I agree. If I had to fly not in shirt, but in A2 jacket I would prefer more roomy (but not baggy), especially with regard of hands movement to be able comfort work with the armature on the upper panels in cockpit. But since for me these jackets - hobby , I prefer more tight fit for all my A2s.