Cleavage

[chanteuseCarey]

I saw a MIS-type in my post, and I am mortified!

Its been corrected/edited now, but WHEW! What I meant to say was that I'm just NOT into showing my breasts.

I'm a modest gal, and NO it was not a freudian slip... . and YES by the way I do wear a SLIP, long before I ever wore vintage garb.

I would say that I think blatantly baring ones breasts to get noticed is in a word "trashy" and well duh, "if they see it, they'll think it"- but that would start a fuss here for many reasons- so I won't say it .

I 've seen this pic too. To me its of Sophia as that she is thinking, "jeez this (seeing Jane's breasts being so displayed) is pathetic. I'm embarrassed for her and for my sex in general. What a shame that this poor woman sees herself as this being the only way she can get noticed."

 

[Lady Day]

I do apologise for such overbearing banality

There was no need, you said what you wanted, as did I. Im not taking any of this personally from anyone, Im simply trying to evoke discussion between people.

If we can remove the sensitivity of commenting on the personal testimonials and talk about the general topic as outlined in the first post, I know we could get some awesome discussion going here!

LD

 

[TheSwingingBee]

Ok, I have to post on this subject. I have really large breasts and a super small frame (though I'm overweight) so the top of my breasts is only about 2 and a half inches from my collar bone and my breasts sit very close together. No matter what I wear my breasts are very present. I've found that at work I need to wear a camisole of some sort under most modern shirts just so that my bra doesn't show and so that I don't have an excess of cleavage hanging out. That being said, when I go out a lot of time the girls come out to play. I have no problem with men looking at me as a sexual being as I am a very sexual being and I look that way whether I'm wearing jeans and a t-shirt or a dress that's cut super low. I think more than anything it's the way that the woman dressing that way feels about it. I don't judge a woman because of her amount of cleavage nor do I judge them on the amount of leg they have showing, my 14 year old niece is a whole separate story.

I think that the difference between the golden era and the present is that women have the right to be sexual or professional, modest or "slutty" and it's up to them. We have finally come to a place in society where we don't have to fit into men's views of what is right for a woman, but we can also choose to take on those roles. I think a lot of it has to do with the fact that though society has come a long way we still sexualize women and so we see women who dress a bit more provocatively as not being professional. As a professional woman it's difficult to find that line between fashion and outdated ideas on what is acceptable for work. I agree that you shouldn't be wearing the tops that are cut to your bellybutton at work, but sometimes there is going to be a little cleavage.

That's just my take on it, take it as you will. I think we, as a society, need to embrace people's distinct choices in self expression more willingly.

 

[Smuterella]

Ok, I have to post on this subject. I have really large breasts and a super small frame (though I'm overweight) so the top of my breasts is only about 2 and a half inches from my collar bone and my breasts sit very close together. No matter what I wear my breasts are very present. I've found that at work I need to wear a camisole of some sort under most modern shirts just so that my bra doesn't show and so that I don't have an excess of cleavage hanging out. That being said, when I go out a lot of time the girls come out to play. I have no problem with men looking at me as a sexual being as I am a very sexual being and I look that way whether I'm wearing jeans and a t-shirt or a dress that's cut super low. I think more than anything it's the way that the woman dressing that way feels about it. I don't judge a woman because of her amount of cleavage nor do I judge them on the amount of leg they have showing, my 14 year old niece is a whole separate story.

I think that the difference between the golden era and the present is that women have the right to be sexual or professional, modest or "slutty" and it's up to them. We have finally come to a place in society where we don't have to fit into men's views of what is right for a woman, but we can also choose to take on those roles. I think a lot of it has to do with the fact that though society has come a long way we still sexualize women and so we see women who dress a bit more provocatively as not being professional. As a professional woman it's difficult to find that line between fashion and outdated ideas on what is acceptable for work. I agree that you shouldn't be wearing the tops that are cut to your bellybutton at work, but sometimes there is going to be a little cleavage.

That's just my take on it, take it as you will. I think we, as a society, need to embrace people's distinct choices in self expression more willingly.

*round of applause*

 

[Miss_Bella_Hell]

I am of two minds on this subject.

I'm sure at this point you all know that I have very large boobs, though not as large as some of you ladies! Also, I am a law student and have to go on many interviews. But, I am also active in the rockabilly/roots music scene and go out dressed up.

For work, no cleavage. By cleavage, I mean boobs pressed together. Seeing a little at the top of a scoop neck shirt isn't great, but it's forgivable. Throw a sweater or a suit jacket over it. In order to be taken seriously, women in professional settings have to try harder and make conscious decisions. Men are going to objectify you no matter what you wear, but I'd rather not distract them or give the other women at the office someone to gossip about.

For a night out, I reserve the right to wear something plunging. Most men manage not to stare.

Also, a note about women hating other women. Please be aware of your own tendency to do this. If a girl who is prettier than you (or not, but women usually are threatened by those they perceive as better looking than they are) is dressed provocatively, please don't call her a slut. If a girl who is prettier than you is being quiet and not talking, please don't call her a bitch. She's probably cool, and you don't know what you're talking about. We've all been on both sides of this and some of the behavior is inevitable, but please be conscious of it.

And I agree with Smuterella about the victim blaming. If it was inevitable, that is in itself abhorrent.

 

[roselily]

I'm a small frame/big chest girl myself, so I often have to come up with creative solutions to make modern clothes modest enough for work. I usually sew snaps between the buttons of all button-down shirts/shirtdresses to prevent gap, and I wear tube tops under alot of V-necks and wrap dresses (I find them less bulky than camisoles). Sometimes I'll do a sports bra in lieu of a cami, too.

 

[Lady Day]

We have finally come to a place in society where we don't have to fit into men's views of what is right for a woman, but we can also choose to take on those roles.

I dont find that true at all. Women in society have come to be regarded on par intellectually in most respects with male counter parts, yes, but women are still using the male template of what is considered 'successful' (granted I am using the successful term in a very specific way). Often it is a dominant overly sexualized female version of a 'cad' type of man.

As a professional woman it's difficult to find that line between fashion and outdated ideas on what is acceptable for work.

Exactly. Not just work, but choices as well. The hiprocarcy of that is the one architype women often choose to use (housewife, mom, etc) is often considered weak over choosing a carrier.

So instead of starting over in this new discovery of what women are and can be in this new world, we are stuck using the traditional male template instead of investing the time, and energy, and self discovery of investing in this new era and finding what we want.

But I digress.

LD

 

[AllaboutEve]

I 've seen this pic too. To me its of Sophia as that she is thinking, "jeez this (seeing Jane's breasts being so displayed) is pathetic. I'm embarrassed for her and for my sex in general. What a shame that this poor woman sees herself as this being the only way she can get noticed."

That's a bit unkind.

 

[TheSwingingBee]

I wanted to mention something else. I work in an office that is predominately women and I am the youngest by about 15 years. I think there are more double standards than just the male-female ones. There are quite a few well endowed women in this office and if they show a little cleavage it's not big deal, but if I show the same amount I'm reprimanded. I think we have to look at those double standards also, I'm not saying that I come to work in breast barring tops, but due to the way that I'm proportioned a little line of cleavage may show. It's horrible that we have so many double standards, and that they are generally accepted.

 

[HadleyH]

Thanks for the mammaries.... oops, the memories Jane!

Sorry ladies for being a bit off topic here but look.... i found another photo of that memorable dinner lol. Me thinks Sofia is a little obsessed by Jane's decotage, but not in a bad way, not in a malevolent, catty, or judgamental way .... rather in an appreciative and admiring way... saying to herself -" That's the sort of dress i will be wearing next time"-

Sofia! Stop that! [bad] lol

 

[Paisley]

It looks like the photographer climbed on a chair to get that shot. Not really standard operating procedure for happy snaps.

 

[LizzieMaine]

I dont find that true at all. Women in society have come to be regarded on par intellectually in most respects with male counter parts, yes, but women are still using the male template of what is considered 'successful' (granted I am using the successful term in a very specific way). Often it is a dominant overly sexualized female version of a 'cad' type of man.

Have you read "Female Chauvinist Pigs: Women and the Rise of Raunch Culture," by Ariel Levy? She's a cultural historian with a lot to say about exactly this point.

 

[HadleyH]

It looks like the photographer climbed on a chair to get that shot. Not really standard operating procedure for happy snaps.

lol lol Oh dear! may be you are right there , but ... it seems like a very happy snap to me!

 

[Miss_Bella_Hell]

Sorry ladies for being a bit off topic here but look.... i found another photo of that memorable dinner lol. Me thinks Sofia is a little obsessed by Jane's decotage, but not in a bad way, not in a malevolent, catty, or judgamental way .... rather in an appreciative and admiring way... saying to herself -" That's the sort of dress i will be wearing next time"-

Sofia! Stop that! [bad] lol

Actually, Sofia is on record saying she hates those pictures, and that Jane really should have worn something more suitable that night.

 

[Lady Day]

Have you read "Female Chauvinist Pigs: Women and the Rise of Raunch Culture," by Ariel Levy? She's a cultural historian with a lot to say about exactly this point.

Im gonna have to check that book out.
Thanks!

LD

 

[Viola]

It's funny to me how differently we all see those pics: I personally think Jayne looks way better than Sofia. [huh]

 

[HadleyH]

Actually, Sofia is on record saying she hates those pictures, and that Jane really should have worn something more suitable that night.

Ohhhhh did Sofia say that? Well there you go! [huh]
Because ... well ...Sofia of all people talking about suitable cleavages, the mind boggles lol ....anyway.... c'est la vie, isn't it?

 

[Smuterella]

It's funny to me how differently we all see those pics: I personally think Jayne looks way better than Sofia. [huh]

I agree, she looks luminous

 

[Miss Golightly]

It's funny to me how differently we all see those pics: I personally think Jayne looks way better than Sofia. [huh]

I have to disagree on that one - I think Jayne is showing waaaaaay too much there - you can practically see her kneecaps.

I don't think that women liking or not liking cleavage on display has anything to do with what men think particularly in this day and age - for a lot of women it's the time and place aspect of it.

I went to my brother's wedding and there was a woman at my table and it looked like she had caught herself on the straps trying to get into her dress - you could practically see her whole breasts - it looked quite vulgar. Wear it to a club/jazzy cocktail lounge if you wish but to a wedding?! Come on!

There is a dress code that should be adhered to when going to certain functions - look at the fuss in the press about some of the ensembles worn to the races during the week.....

 

[cherry lips]

I don't mind taking a peek at another woman's bust. Then again I've had a faiblesse for the 1800th century since I was a teen...