Bring back dating?

[carebear]

Direct hit by the fellow from Seward's Folly! It is a fundamental problem that while our perceptions are the only tool we have to understand our reality, those perceptions are flawed and easily manipulated via skewed or inaccurate data input.

Sorry, I OD'ed on philosophy stuff during my misspent early-Phase 1 college days.

Logic is the only way to go when weighty matters are on the line.

 

[reetpleat]

Logic is the only way to go when weighty matters are on the line.

I agree. But generally speaking, most people are too caught up in their own biases and emotional issues to be able to see the facts clearly and think rationally based on those facts. Yet they convince themselves that they are thinking logically none the less.

I certainly am not perfect. But I like to think that realizing this fact is my first step in moving beyond it.

 

[Elaina]

Like any other choices one can make, the impact may affect everyone in a different manner.

For example: One niece of mine "hooks up" has 3 children by 3 different men, and her whole attitude is "Oh well, another check from someone" (I'm not going to argue the problems with this.) Even when she doesn't get pregnant, her attitude is "Oh well." I have a nephew that did it once, was so wracked with guilt, he married the girl, to his detriment. I have a third niece that hooks up, and if asked will tell you it's not a good idea, but everyone does it.

Frankly, I can see all sides to it, but in the end, what 2 consenting adults do with and to their body is none of anyone else business. Issues or not, does it matter in the end? If these same people were in a steady relationship and wanted to be swingers, be involved in the S&M community, or have a (seemingly) weird fetish then the argument of "they have self esteem issues" always seems to come up.

As to dating, I was raised that a)women did not call men on the telephone. b)The person asking the other on a date arrives on time, picks them up and pays. I've asked my share of men out, and without exception I was prepared to pay every time (whether I have or not is something else entirely). Even today, when I make a date with my husband that I instigate, I always have the money to pay for it myself. (I don't but he's a chauvinist pig.)

 

[JB]

It seems alot of guys who rebel against certain modern attitudes do it as if they are trying not to be the brutish cads their compatriots are.

Heck, not at all. It's just who I am and how I was brought up. I have no problem with other people living their lives as they wish, and applaud them for doing so. Just because I choose to do things differently doesn't make them wrong.

My main drive for saying "bring back dating" is that I'm genuinely useless at the 'not-dating' side of life - it's just not something I'm good at. A bit like golf - I can do it, but I'm a long way from being happy with the way I do it!
lol
JB

 

[Matt Deckard]

Lots of interesting talk. That's why I love the Lounge. I'd love to see politics return to the O Bar some day.

I remember dating. I remember taking out that girl your heart was set on and getting to know who she was and why she was. I haven't run into that girl in a long time. Alot of girls who look at me and take interest though where the feelings are entirely mutual. Rather than treat them with disinterest I fall into a trap where I treat them well... sometimes too well and it only pulls in their hearts more. As with where this thread started, I agree with the writer in saying women surrender their hearts very easily when it comes to relationships. Courtship and taking time may be the best bet for them. I've romanced my way into many hearts and know it's not a struggle. Keeping their hearts at bay is the struggle unless your heart is ready to surrender.
I can't surrender my heart so I sometimes end up hurting others.

Anyway... yeah, bring back dating!

 

[herringbonekid]

Maybe you just assume they have low self esteem because they do that.

no i would never assume anyone to have low self esteem unless it was glaringly obvious. usually i'm SURPRISED to find out about the low self esteem of seemingly sexually confident people. the people i'm talking about told me of their self esteem problems.

i could just as easily accuse you of personal bias for refusing to believe the fact that my afformentioned friends have low self esteem, and that it's not just my bias talking. we could go round in circles like that indefinately.

 

[reetpleat]

Like any other choices one can make, the impact may affect everyone in a different manner.

For example: One niece of mine "hooks up" has 3 children by 3 different men, and her whole attitude is "Oh well, another check from someone" (I'm not going to argue the problems with this.) Even when she doesn't get pregnant, her attitude is "Oh well." I have a nephew that did it once, was so wracked with guilt, he married the girl, to his detriment. I have a third niece that hooks up, and if asked will tell you it's not a good idea, but everyone does it.

Frankly, I can see all sides to it, but in the end, what 2 consenting adults do with and to their body is none of anyone else business. Issues or not, does it matter in the end? If these same people were in a steady relationship and wanted to be swingers, be involved in the S&M community, or have a (seemingly) weird fetish then the argument of "they have self esteem issues" always seems to come up.

As to dating, I was raised that a)women did not call men on the telephone. b)The person asking the other on a date arrives on time, picks them up and pays. I've asked my share of men out, and without exception I was prepared to pay every time (whether I have or not is something else entirely). Even today, when I make a date with my husband that I instigate, I always have the money to pay for it myself. (I don't but he's a chauvinist pig.)

I think your sister having babies is only marginally related to the idea of hooking up. Firstly, she could just as easily date a guy for three years and have a baby, then do it again. Her problem is getting pregnant and having babies. Very often related to self esteem issues.

 

[reetpleat]

Lots of interesting talk. That's why I loe the Lounge. I'd love to see politics return to the O Bar some day.

I remember dating. I remember taking out that girl your heart was set on and getting to know who she was and why she was. I haven't run into that girl in a long time. Alot of girls who look at me and take interest though where the feelings are entirely mutual. Rather than treat them with disinterest I fall into a trap where I treat them well... sometimes too well and it only pulls in their hearts more. As with where this thread started, I agree with the writer in saying women surrender their hearts very easily when it comes to relationships. Courtship and taking time may be the best bet for them. I've romanced my way into many hearts and know it's not a struggle. Keeping their hearts at bay is the struggle unless your heart is ready to surrender.
I can't surrender my heart so I sometimes end up hurting others.

Anyway... yeah, bring back dating!

I agree and can relate. My problem is I tend to take too much responsibility for the woman, often staying in a relationship when I should get out for fear of hurting them. But I ned to recognize that they are their own responsibility and I am mine. Ofcourse this assumes treating others with respect and care.

But that is the very problem with dating. It creates a lot of attachment. I may prefer to keep things lighter until I get to know her and decide if I want to continue.

That said, i think that guys get as attached, often with the added reason that smoe guys can';t get much female attention and get pretty hung up on it.

I have gone through a lot of growth and now am of tha attitude that I am done impressing girls. I know my self worth and what I have to offer. I will let them worry about what they think of me. I am worried about what I think if them.

 

[carebear]

I think your sister having babies is only marginally related to the idea of hooking up.

Oh, I'd say the baby has a pretty direct relation to the hooking up.

 

[reetpleat]

no i would never assume anyone to have low self esteem unless it was glaringly obvious. usually i'm SURPRISED to find out about the low self esteem of seemingly sexually confident people. the people i'm talking about told me of their self esteem problems.

i could just as easily accuse you of personal bias for refusing to believe the fact that my afformentioned friends have low self esteem, and that it's not just my bias talking. we could go round in circles like that indefinately.

Fair enough.

 

[Novella]

As with where this thread started, I agree with the writer in saying women surrender their hearts very easily when it comes to relationships. Courtship and taking time may be the best bet for them.

I know they're based in truth and experience and can be necessary for the point of argument, but still, sometimes generalizations make me cringe. Maybe I'm just the exception to the rule, but my heart is so anti-surrender it might as well be frozen in a block of ice.

 

[reetpleat]

Oh, I'd say the baby has a pretty direct relation to the hooking up.

Well, on one level, of course.

Babies are pretty closely related to sex so I was once told.

 

[herringbonekid]

... I am worried about what I think of them.

reetpleat, we have much more in common than you might at first think.

 

[reetpleat]

reetpleat, we have much more in common than you might at first think.

I can imagine that. I think we are both coming from a place of self respect and respect for others as well.

 

[celtic]

i've always thought it strange that equality between the sexes is often requested, revered, and reviled by the same people.

some women wish to be given gifts(on a first date?!?), have doors opened for them, have their dinner paid for them, yet fail to see this as 'unequal' treatment.

if i were to ask a male friend out to play pool or to grab a bite of dinner, i wouldn't go out of my way to give them a gift, open their door, or pay for their dinner. i see them as an equal. why should i see a woman in a different light? i should be looking to them as an equal, RIGHT?

women are now equals in the sexual arena (well, not really, but it's getting closer). if they wish to have sex with a person, they do. they shouldn't be thought of as amoral sluts. of course they ARE looked at that way(and i would say that it's other WOMEN who view them more as sluts than men...but that's IMHO) but i think it's getting less and less.

so now women should give up this newfound freedom and become shy, demure, prudish unequal beings instead of going out and satiating their desires and fufulling their needs as men are apt to do????

sure, let's go back to wooing women with gifts, money, and acting like spineless dorks with blueballs. all the while they accept the gifts and dinner from us and then give up the goods to the bad boy greasy-haired musician without a job who treats them crap.

great idea.


(btw, this is (mostly) tongue-in-cheek devil's advocate as i pride myself of being a complete gentleman and have been a sappy romantic for most of my life...)

 

[herringbonekid]

.....instead of going out and satiating their desires and fufulling their needs as men are apt to do????

again i have to ask this question: who are the mythic women these promiscuous men of the past were sleeping with ?
ONLY men slept around before remember, not women, so presumably these available women would spring to life from the covers of lurid 1950s pulp fiction novels for the benefit of men, before disappearing back into their fictional netherworld.

 

[celtic]

again i have to ask this question: who are the mythic women these promiscuous men of the past were sleeping with ?
ONLY men slept around before remember, not women, so presumably these available women would spring to life from the covers of lurid 1950s pulp fiction novels for the benefit of men, before disappearing back into their fictional netherworld.

well, obviously they were whores and sluts.

oh, and also naiive young girls who believed it when guys told them that they loved them after meeting them an hour ago.

those girls.

 

[herringbonekid]

....then give up the goods to the bad boy greasy-haired musician without a job who treats them crap.

you've been doing your research.

 

[patrick1987]

well, obviously they were whores and sluts.

oh, and also naiive young girls who believed it when guys told them that they loved them after meeting them an hour ago.

those girls.

And also the punchline to a kind of joke: Widows.
As to the naive girls (why young, though?), I guess they were the ones the Breach of Promise or whatever it was called was for.

 

[Senator Jack]

Oh grow up, people.