Belstaff or Aero?

[wdw]

You won't get that sort of gossip when you buy Belstaff off the rack in a department store

 

[Sloan1874]

Damn straight! Looking forward to getting even more from Will when go down there.

 

[Graemsay]

Ask Will if he's got his old Highwayman back off Ironheart yet. It's had twenty or thirty years of wear, and it looks epic. Unfortunately you then realise just how long it takes to break in the FQHH!

If the tartan appeals, let me know. I think that it's one of the oldest known weaves, but its history isn't entirely clear. The other that I was considering is Sutherland of Duffus.

Also check out the sales jeans. There's some quite exotic brands (Flathead, Eight G, Big Rob) going cheap. Only small sizes left, but I don't think that'll be a problem for you.

 

[Sloan1874]

Argh, more options! There are some lovely weaves on show. Damnit, I may be some time... Will said he would bring his Highwayman in to let me have a look at it - most obliging of him.
Interested in the jeans thing - hell, I may as well be hung for a sheep as a lamb. I can see why the Japanese jeans thing goes hand-in-hand with bespoke leather, they're nuts for the classic 40s/50s look.

 

[Edward]

Excellent answers! Really useful to know about the pockets - had never occurred to me about the stretching thing - and I rather like the button cuffs. A nice understated tartan, my 'family' cloth is really lifeless - years of family picnics has given me an aversion to it - so I think I'm going to go on purely aesthetic grounds. Having read around a bit more about what is possible, I'm hoping that they can keep the whole thing reasonably fitted, as I'm keen to avoid a blouson-y look. I tried on a Belstaff Cougar a week or two ago and even the small was a bit bell-like!

That won't be a problem with Aero. If you want a neat fit, I'd avoid the Highwayman, but most of the rest of their short jackets have a good close fit. When comes the time for my J106, I am hoping that Lochcarron do the Presley tartan.

Coupla things. I got snaps on the sleeves to manage them in the cold with gloves on. Glad I did. But buttons look nicer. The tartan I got I love. It matches the look perfectly. However, if I get a cafe racer. I'm going to get a crazy tartan, or the black & white checkers. Something crazy. What the h3ll, it's on the inside, and nobody ever sees it lol

Yeah, depends on what you need from the fasteners, really. Studs are good if you open it a lot; I don't open and close mine at all, so it's less of an issues for me. FWIW, my Bootlegger has leather-lined cuffs, my Thirties Halfbelt cuffs are lined with the same material as the rest of the jacket. The latter came as standard from Aero's sale page. The Bootlegger I ordered button cuffs, but I didn't specify leather lined (I wasn't aware of the difference until much later). The leather lined are very stiff to get the buttons on and off; unsurprisingly, the ones with the single layer are much easier. Both are FQHH (double lined goat would be much easier, I expect). In theory, I'd have said that the leather-lined would be easier to keep clean, though I've not had any noticeable problem with grubbiness on the non-leather lined cuffs.

I noticed your press studs, that's a really nice detail, kinda art deco. And I agree with you on eye-slashing tartan. At the moment I'm torn between these two:

http://www.lochcarron.com/reiver/bruce_of_kinnaird_ancient.html and http://www.lochcarron.com/reiver/macrae_of_conchra_ancient.html

They'll both sit well with cordorvan but make, er, a statement. Like you say, it's on the inside, so who sees it?

Both look great. I like a good 'statement' lining in a leather jacket.

P Diddy phoned him not that long ago and ordered a shearling neck barnstormer. Will pointed out that it might not be suitable for the Californian climate, but P just said 'It's all about the look' and wanted it made.

He can wear it inside in LA. For the air conditioning.

 

[ButteMT61]

Mine are all leather (cuffs). Much preferred - by me. Not hard at all. I could ride a motorcycle with it. I just might

 

[Sloan1874]

I had quick look on another forum, and the Japanese specification Will mentioned to me sounds just the ticket. I'm wondering if tightening up, and raising the point where the sleeve meets the jacket may take away the need for the bi-wing (I'm guessing that's the term for the kind of articulated section at the back) that appears in the more standard model, which is a bit looser underneath (I suppose that would accommodate thicker jumpers etc). Simpler is always better when it comes to these things.
Will surprised me by saying that he preferred the plain storm cuff on a LHB, as it he felt it gave a clean, pleasing line. I also got the very definite impression that the £50 ($80) charge on the leather strip was set specifically high to discourage people from taking it up in the first place! It also has the added disadvantage that it effectively prevents any subsequent repairs being done on the lining (Which reminds me, I must get the holes in my RAF coat pockets repaired! Crombie may make a mean great coat, but they really skimp on stuff like fastening buttons on firmly and decent pocket linings)
I'm overwhelmed by the choice on the Lochcarron website, so I think I'm just going to have to wait to get up there and make choice then - though I'm with you on the 'statement' lining, if people are blinking when you take your jacket off, then it's not the right lining.
I like to think that P Diddy gets into his Roller, turns up the air con, then puts on his jacket, looks in the rear view mirror and says to himself "Crisp!"
I should thank you for all your help and input on this 'project', and I hope you're enjoying the correspondence as much as I am. It's such an absorbing subject, each decision comes with its own subtleties and complexities. I know for sure that I will never buy another leather jacket from a high street shop again!

 

[trapp]

Love that P Diddy story. Wonder if he ever did a factory tour?

 

[trapp]

I also got the very definite impression that the £50 ($80) charge on the leather strip was set specifically high to discourage people from taking it up in the first place! It also has the added disadvantage that it effectively prevents any subsequent repairs being done on the lining.

Interesting. I've been considering the leather strip on an order I'm putting through. Would a corduroy strip prevent repairs in the same way, or would that be easier to work around?

 

[Grayland]

. I also got the very definite impression that the £50 ($80) charge on the leather strip was set specifically high to discourage people from taking it up in the first place! It also has the added disadvantage that it effectively prevents any subsequent repairs being done on the lining

Maybe I'm missing the obvious, but why would a leather strip at the bottom prevent repairs to the lining?

 

[ButteMT61]

Linings can droop over time, and hang below the bottom hem of the jacket. This is to fend off any such shenanigans!

 

[Sloan1874]

Butte explained what the strip's for, but I'm afraid I can't explain why the strip makes repairs difficult-to-impossible. I can only say that Will told me that though some people wanted it, the feature was an unnecessary. I will ask him about this when I'm up at the factory next Friday and report back. Personally, I think cord is a perfectly resilient cloth, and given each jacket comes with a lifetime guarantee, if that wears out, you can always get it replaced. On a completely separate note, I was reading an old article about Will and Aero, written back in the 1990s, and it says that he uses one of his old jackets as a blanket to lie on when he's working under his car! *faints with shock*

 

[Edward]

Mine are all leather (cuffs). Much preferred - by me. Not hard at all. I could ride a motorcycle with it. I just might

I don't find them in any way harder to wear - but undoubtedly the button is stiffer to unfasten and refasten - I'd say the stud is a good move if you do that with any regularity (I don't).

Maybe I'm missing the obvious, but why would a leather strip at the bottom prevent repairs to the lining?

I wouldn't say it was impossible, but certainly it would make it more complicated. In order to remove the lining for replacement of it all or a panel (other than in the sleeves, I suppose), the leather strip at the bottom would have to be removed first.

 

[Davy Crockett]

When I got my last jacket ( I went to the factory to be measured) I asked about a leather hem and Will told me that it was not needed certainly not on the longer jackets, and it also cost an extra £90 and made replacement linings much more expensive to fit (double the price if I remember correctly), I must say that I can understand where he is coming from, I have not noticed any appreciable wear to the bottom of the inside of my jacket however if you were to use a tight fitting jacket for riding there could possibly be some rubbing and wear, if you are going to the factory I would listen to what Will advises! he does know his own product butter than any of us on this forum!

D

 

[Sloan1874]

Davy, did you find that going to the factory meant that you nailed the jacket you wanted first time? And I have to say, having spoken to Will, you'd take him on his word, he really does know his stuff. Would anyone be interested in some of the articles I've dug up on Aero? They're pretty historic, going back to 1994 - 2001, but I can post them here if you're keen. Don't want to kill the thread, which has been brilliant so far!

 

[ButteMT61]

When I got my last jacket ( I went to the factory to be measured) I asked about a leather hem and Will told me that it was not needed certainly not on the longer jackets, and it also cost an extra £90 and made replacement linings much more expensive to fit (double the price if I remember correctly), I must say that I can understand where he is coming from, I have not noticed any appreciable wear to the bottom of the inside of my jacket however if you were to use a tight fitting jacket for riding there could possibly be some rubbing and wear, if you are going to the factory I would listen to what Will advises! he does know his own product butter than any of us on this forum!D

Because nobody here wears any jacket enough to wear it out! There have been pics of jackets worn in that area before. But I don't think it's a big deal either way. Shorter jackets would benefit more I'd think.

 

[trapp]

... however if you were to use a tight fitting jacket for riding there could possibly be some rubbing and wear...
D

Either way, we're just talking about undesirable wear to the lining, correct? I'm personally not terribly worried about the lining, since it can be repaired/replaced every few years if needed. Correct me if others have a different experience, but barring some kind of accident, I can't imagine the fqhh shell (with or without the protective strip) taking any kind of damage at the hem. I've worn the same two short, tight jackets (both vintage brooks cafes) made from tough but thin steerhide for years and never damaged the shell at the hem. The linings of course got trashed.

 

[ButteMT61]

That's what the strip is for - the lining. The FQHH won't get worn out before we're all dead. Like the horse.

 

[HoosierDaddy]

In my view..I agree with Will. Most of this stuff is really..unneccessary..BUT..desirable to some..because ..you can! Many/most jacket makers offer no or little customization. With Aero's custom offerings customers can almost become jacket re-designers!..and even if they have no real clue of the final outcome. They can adjust measurements to what they think will work better....re-do much of the original design..then if it doesn't really work...accept a loss and move it along for the next personalized experiment with the next jacket. Where some are satisfied just adding an inside pocket or two...choosing a lining suitable for their climate...nice hide...and most importantly researching a truely good fitting jacket..it becomes so tempting to go into re-creation overdrive. If you really really think about it...it can become quite humorous to follow all the new configurations and reasons why!
HD

 

[Don Tomaso]

That's how I see it as well. I just sent my jacket to Aero for changes, besides the silly stuff like leather-lining at the hem I had also some more important issues that need to be addressed. Nothing wrong with the jacket, though, still loving it.
I agree Will is a master of trades when it comes to leather-jackets and when he says this is not needed - the hem - he'll be right. But I have my own taste, I've seen it here in the Lounge and think the jackets look much neater. That's the reason why I let it be done.