Back Bow Hat

[Dinerman]

I've got two back bows, both resistols.
one's a fedora, one's a porkpie.
see this thread for more.
http://thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?t=12514

 

[Fletch]

So I'm thinking 50s pork pie generally, Paris sometimes, and...Coleman Hawkins. No more need be said. One of the more elegant men (and musicians) of his era.

 

[WideBrimm]

I've got one hat with a back bow. It's a Hopkins. A stingy brim.

 

[jamespowers]

I was just checking out the new hats acquired by Douglas (in another thread), and one of the photos of his newly-acquired Mallory reminded me of something I've wondered about before. This photo (which I've borrowed -- thanks, Douglas!) shows that there is a ribbon interlaced with the sweatband, culminating in a bow at the back of the hat:

I have seen this before in older Stetsons, as well, and have always been curious about whether or not it ever served a functional purpose. In other words, could one adjust the sizing of the sweatband by tightening or relaxing the interlaced ribbon? Was this a way to make minor adjustments to the sizing of the hat? Was it only ever used on particular kinds of hats -- for example, on western style (including Open Road-style) hats, versus dress hats?

At some point, did this system lose favor and disappear, leaving the bow at the back of the sweatband to serve a purely decorative purpose? (There really seems to be no functional purpose to the bow, otherwise). And, does anyone know if the interlaced ribbon phenomenon is particular to a particular period -- for example, can it be used to date particular hats?

Inquiring minds want to know!

As Art mentioned, the bow at the back of the hat is a leftover from when they had the above sizing treatment. The picture is from a bowler.

Regards,

J

 

[jimmy the lid]

Wow, JP -- great photo! Also interesting that the system was being used vis-a-vis a bowler (as opposed to a western style). I wonder how prevalent this kind of approach was...?

 

[jamespowers]

Wow, JP -- great photo! Also interesting that the system was being used vis-a-vis a bowler (as opposed to a western style). I wonder how prevalent this kind of approach was...?

Well, again, as Art said, it was par for the course for a time in the mid to late 1800s. The one size fits all thing. You have to remember that having a specific right and left shoe is also something that is really not that old in the scheme of things.

Regards,

J

 

[Bud-n-Texas]

Hatco still uses this on their higher end western hats but it's strictly decorative.

An example of the sweat you refer to in my Black Gold Resistol.

 

[Topper]

Well it's not technically for the sweatband.

Art is partially correct by adjusting the sweatband, but moreso it is for adjusting the saftey lining support in the hat.

Coke/ Derby/ Bowler whatever you wish to call them and Toppers were all used for Riding, inside these has , one had to have not just a hard shell, but a support for the head.

The "Bows" were used to tie the ends of the lace or string that was interlocked around the head lining ( which is attached to the leather sweat) to create a cup to hold and support the head in.

The requirement for this was in olden day safety. If you had a fall from one's horse, and hit the outer hard shell, unless you had a separate support lining you head would slip through and hit the ground as well - the bow and support prevented the head from sliding through and hence safety factor.

Imagine a modern day Builder's Plastic safety helmet - with plastic adjustable frame inside - this is basically the same pricipal. - Though I don't recommend going down to local builders yard and telling them they are missing the bows to go in the back of their helmets lol

You will still see many old bowlers and toppers with this still in. But as not were all used for riding , so majority do not have them. A "Hunting pad" is a modern day term for a hat still using lace tied lining with bow.

As to modern day bows - it is now just a "decoration" that looks nice, and a reflection of days gone past when the countryside ruled ! :eusa_clap

Pip-Pip

Doug

p.s. Skull & cross bones had nothing to do with it - unless you didn't have a tied lining , and would then be like to crush your skull and bones in a fall!

 

[Phil]

It's there to confuse and bwilder people.

 

[FedoraFan112390]

Hey

When would a hat with a back bow (say, a Stetson Royal Deluxe with Back Bow) date from?

 

[handlebar bart]

Like this?

I'm curious too

 

[FedoraFan112390]

Like this?

I'm curious too

Yeah, exactly like that =]

 

[David Conwill]

Unfortunately, I haven't got my scanner here, but I have a book of pictures of dry lakes racing in the 1930s and 1940s. In one of the shots the photog was standing in the back of a dump truck with Otto Crocker and his timing equipment. One man, possibly Crocker himself, is wearing a back-bow fedora. I think that picture was taken in 1938.

-Dave

 

[Mr. 'H']

Here was mine (I sold it):

[a Stetson]

 

[Viper Man]

Here's a few of mine...

I'd guess the first is from the early 50s and the second from the mid to late
50s but I don't know for sure [huh]

Royal Stetson

Stetson 15 3X

 

[thunderw21]

Some hats had 'em back in the 1930s but became more popular in the U.S. during 1950s. I have a blue Royal Stetson from the 1950s with a back bow.

 

[MattJH]

My Maclachlan has it, but I don't know how to date it:

 

[thunderw21]

My Maclachlan has it, but I don't know how to date it:

Boy, that looks like a tall crown.

 

[MattJH]

Boy, that looks like a tall crown.

The crown is 5 1/2 inches tall. You can read more and see more photographs here. It has just recently become my favorite hat, barely edging out my Herbert Johnson made for Brooks Brothers. I just wish I knew what era it was from.

 

[Viper Man]

Cool hat, Dumbjaw. I really dig that liner!