Anyone know this hatter?

[scotrace]

Sorry if have missed it. Can't connect this fellow with a lounger I've "met."

http://www.shopniagara.net/custom_hatter/

 

[Matt Deckard]

Gary White "The Custom Hatter" Buffalo NY.

I had a hat made by him and really really was not impressed.

 

[fedoralover]

Matt, not to put you on the spot, but I guess I'm going to anyway. Could you be more specific? Others were not impressed either, but a few have given him an "okay" so it seems he may be inconsistent in his work. But I was curious if it was the materials, felt quality etc. or the workmanship or both.

regards fedoralover

 

[scotrace]

Walks the Walk

Web site isn't slick, but the photographs made me think he might be doing better stuff. Looks like he has invested in the equipment, etc. Hard to know the quality of the goods without asking. Thanks for the insight.

 

[Matt Deckard]

Matt, not to put you on the spot, but I guess I'm going to anyway. Could you be more specific? Others were not impressed either, but a few have given him an "okay" so it seems he may be inconsistent in his work. But I was curious if it was the materials, felt quality etc. or the workmanship or both.

regards fedoralover

The leather band was very much like card board and dried out after sweat hit the band and left. The felt was stiff as a board when I recieved the hat. The felt had a hole in the crown after only a few months worth of wear and the hat shrunk very quickly. The liner was falling out when I recieved the hat.

I felt like I was duped when I bought the hat since I was spoiled by vintage at the time. In my opinion, modern Stetson dress felt is better, and so are their sweatbands.

The hat was covered in powder to even the color of the felt and when hit by rain the powder stained my clothes an left the hat slotchy with obvious light and dark spots.

 

[fedoralover]

Wow, thanks for the insight, that's good to know if anyone had future plans about getting a custom hat.

fedoralover

 

[scotrace]

Hard to imagine much worse

Short of 'it came with a gremlin that peed in my ear with every wearing.'

 

[dopey]

Matt:
Did you address any of those issues with him directly at the time. It is hard to see how he wouldn’t immediately respond to something like a liner falling out.
Top customer service would deal with the other issues as well, but I can see how many will take the easy, lazy and unscrupulous approach and give you the back of the hand once you have worn the hat in the rain.

 

[Matt Deckard]

I didn't talk to him about the liner, and their were too many problems to be repaired. I'm done with that hatter.

If your felt hat can't be worn in the rain it's just an expensive felt bag.

Felt head coverings were made to protect your head from the elements and with vintage hats that meant all elements and not just the sun. So far I am still a big fan of Optimo for their modern felt quality.

 

[Pat in Buffalo]

I Completely Disagree

I had completely the opposite experience with Gary White. I bought a beautiful charcoal gray custom fedora from Gary and was happy with every part of the buying and wearing experience. The workmanship is superb and if there's a nicer man than Gary White, I don't know him.

The felt is gorgeous and wearing incredibly well. I wear it every day there's not a wind advisory from October through April inBuffalo, NY and it has stood up just fine to the rain and snow.

I can't believe that if there was a problem with the hat, Gary wouldn't have replaced it free of charge.

 

[Bebop]

I have heard good things about Gary but I believe that custom hatters are consistantly inconsistant in the quality of their workmanship. That is part of what makes the hat custom. If you don't complain about the hat to the hatter, it is difficult to put him down in a public forum without his being able to have the opportunity to fix the problems or at least let everyone know why they existed.

 

[Mulceber]

I believe that custom hatters are consistantly inconsistant in the quality of their workmanship. That is part of what makes the hat custom.

Isn't that being a little unfair to custom hatters? Fedora and Art are both custom hatters, and I have heard (and in one case experienced) nothing but rave reviews of their work. I have only heard one legitimate complaint about Fedora's work, and that was before he started making hats. -Mulceber

 

[Bebop]

Isn't that being a little unfair to custom hatters? Fedora and Art are both custom hatters, and I have heard (and in one case experienced) nothing but rave reviews of their work. I have only heard one legitimate complaint about Fedora's work, and that was before he started making hats. -Mulceber

What does "a complaint about Fedora's work before he started making hats" mean? Was the complaint about something other than hats? Just because you hear only good things about custom hatters does not mean that there are not customers out here that have been disappointed with a hatters work and have not said anything because they realize one mistake does not make a "bad hatter". The art of making anything by hand is and should be somewhat inconsistant. Otherwise we would just buy machine made hats and be done with it. That does not mean that it is bad art. I believe that if you do not have anything nice to say, don't ruin it for others. People find out on their own. Good experiences speak for themselves. Bad experiences are not always worth mentioning.

 

[John in Covina]

The leather band was very much like card board and dried out after sweat hit the band and left. The felt was stiff as a board when I recieved the hat. The felt had a hole in the crown after only a few months worth of wear and the hat shrunk very quickly. The liner was falling out when I recieved the hat. The hat was covered in powder to even the color of the felt and when hit by rain the powder stained my clothes an left the hat slotchy with obvious light and dark spots.

*******
Time frame for this debacle?
When did you order & receive this hat?
Plus the length of time you wore it for the shortcomings to become apparent?

 

[Mulceber]

Before Fedora started making hats he reblocked Akubras, PB's, etc. There was one complaint he did on the job he did on one of those jobs. Sorry if that wasn't clear.
I think this is a case of miscommunication. When you say hatters are inconsistant, it implies that they do a bad job a fairly large percent of the time. If he does a bad job once or twice out of a hundred, that's not really what I'd call inconsistant. -Mulceber

 

[Mike in Seattle]

I believe that if you do not have anything nice to say, don't ruin it for others. People find out on their own. Good experiences speak for themselves. Bad experiences are not always worth mentioning.

First, I'll start off by saying I know absolutely nothing about any of the vendors mentioned and have no experience with any of them. I do think there are times & situations where saying nothing because you don't have anything nice to say is a valid stand to take. It's bad to publicly trash someone's work when it's more a matter of something open to debate or personal taste (i.e. "It was advertised that the color was cream and the hat I got was more like bone..."). It's worse if someone's going overboard with an ax to grind.

But I also feel that having a dreadful experience with a vendor and letting other "people find out on their own" when you could forewarn them is also bad form or worse. At least they can make their own decision or bring the other person's experience to the vendors attention for some sort of explanation. It seems somewhat mean-spirited to me to sit back with an attitude along the lines of "I got screwed, so let them get screwed too."

I feel the experiences listed in this thread are being fairly presented. I don't feel anyone's being spiteful or vindictive. I value Matt's opinions and experience from the numerous other posts I've seen him make in the rather short time I've been visiting Fedora Lounge. I will say had it been me, I probably would have addressed the situations with the vendor. But I've also been in circumstances where I thought "water under the bridge" and not worth dealing with at a point down the line where problems became apparently. Had I spent good money on a hat with the problems mentioned, I would have contacted the seller, given them the opportunity to make good on the merchandise. If I'd spent $15 for it used on Ebay six months ago, maybe I'd forget about it. Had I spent $75 on it brand new last month, I'd pursue it.

But as Matt explains it, maybe it was such a complete and utter fiasco that it was just easier to write it off and walk away. It really sounds, upon rereading the messages, some time passed between the purchases and problems manifesting themselves. He received the hat and wasn't happy with the headband plus it was too stiff, but thought he could live with it. Some time passes and a hole appears. Some more time passes and it rains, stains some clothing and dries to be blotchy and stained, and that's the nail in the coffin. In that case, "Too many problems on one item from the vendor - never again!" might've been my attitude as well.

 

[John in Covina]

?

*******Time frame for this debacle? When did you order & receive this hat? Plus the length of time you wore it for the shortcomings to become apparent?

**********
I am thinking that if it was say several years ago, maybe he's had a chance to improve his craft and perhaps upgraded his raw materials. Plus if you don't tell him, how's he supposed to know?[huh]

It's like going to a restaurant. Many restaurants aren't their best when they first open, things can be rocky at the start. Also, everyone including chefs can have a bad night. :eusa_doh:

if possible I try to reserve final judgement after a second try.

Make it a double!

 

[Bebop]

Before Fedora started making hats he reblocked Akubras, PB's, etc. There was one complaint he did on the job he did on one of those jobs. Sorry if that wasn't clear.
I think this is a case of miscommunication. When you say hatters are inconsistant, it implies that they do a bad job a fairly large percent of the time. If he does a bad job once or twice out of a hundred, that's not really what I'd call inconsistant. -Mulceber

Maybe if it was once or twice out of a hundred, inconsistant would not be the proper word to use. You are right. To me inconsistant does not mean a bad job a fairly large part of the time. It means you are not quite sure when "bad" will rear it's head. A tip of the hat to the hatters that do a bad job once or twice out of a hundred. I do know that it makes a big difference if you are one of those "once or twice out of a hundred" and by asking around you end up finding out that there are more than just one or two out of a hundred that just don't like rocking any boats by putting anyone down.

 

[Bebop]

**********
I am thinking that if it was say several years ago, maybe he's had a chance to improve his craft and perhaps upgraded his raw materials. Plus if you don't tell him, how's he supposed to know?[huh]

It's like going to a restaurant. Many restaurants aren't their best when they first open, things can be rocky at the start. Also, everyone including chefs can have a bad night. :eusa_doh:

if possible I try to reserve final judgement after a second try.

Make it a double!

Excellent! :eusa_clap Comparing it to a restaurant and a chef having a bad day is right on. You would not call the chef inconsistant and you don't want to tell everyone not to eat there without giving the chef at least a second chance but you sure hope he has a good day the day you order your food. Do you take a chance and go to this restaurant with the chef that has a bad day once in a while or do you go to Sizzler or Red Lobster where there is tons of consistancy in the food because it is mass produced? McDonalds has a very consistant quality of food. Even if you don't like it, it is consistant.

 

[John in Covina]

Excellent! :eusa_clap Comparing it to a restaurant and a chef having a bad day is right on. You would not call the chef inconsistant and you don't want to tell everyone not to eat there without giving the chef at least a second chance but you sure hope he has a good day the day you order your food. Do you take a chance and go to this restaurant with the chef that has a bad day once in a while or do you go to Sizzler or Red Lobster where there is tons of consistancy in the food because it is mass produced? McDonalds has a very consistant quality of food. Even if you don't like it, it is consistant.

***************
Businesses (mostly) need repeat business and as such don't knowingly foist poor quailty on you if they want repeat business. Now if there is a business that gets new customers daily and don't need repeat business, could conceivebly for a time make poor products and have poor customer service, but evetually word of mouth or internet postings would cut their new business so the sales would drop and evetually become unsustainable. Except with say Third world companies, once the company gets a bad reputation , they simply change their address, company name and the appearance of the product. Most businesses don't conduct themselves like this. Although, there are few companies that do not giving into some temptation of shinanagins and subterfuged.

The mettle of a company may not be apparent by the production of a problem, but becomes apparent by how they handle such problems.