Anyone know this hatter?

[Mulceber]

To me inconsistant does not mean a bad job a fairly large part of the time. It means you are not quite sure when "bad" will rear it's head.

True, and I agree that Gary White is inconsistant, I just think that applying that label to all custom hatters when that group include Fedora and Art isn't really fair to them. -Mulceber

 

[Bebop]

First, I'll start off by saying I know absolutely nothing about any of the vendors mentioned and have no experience with any of them. I do think there are times & situations where saying nothing because you don't have anything nice to say is a valid stand to take. It's bad to publicly trash someone's work when it's more a matter of something open to debate or personal taste (i.e. "It was advertised that the color was cream and the hat I got was more like bone..."). It's worse if someone's going overboard with an ax to grind.

But I also feel that having a dreadful experience with a vendor and letting other "people find out on their own" when you could forewarn them is also bad form or worse. At least they can make their own decision or bring the other person's experience to the vendors attention for some sort of explanation. It seems somewhat mean-spirited to me to sit back with an attitude along the lines of "I got screwed, so let them get screwed too."

I feel the experiences listed in this thread are being fairly presented. I don't feel anyone's being spiteful or vindictive. I value Matt's opinions and experience from the numerous other posts I've seen him make in the rather short time I've been visiting Fedora Lounge. I will say had it been me, I probably would have addressed the situations with the vendor. But I've also been in circumstances where I thought "water under the bridge" and not worth dealing with at a point down the line where problems became apparently. Had I spent good money on a hat with the problems mentioned, I would have contacted the seller, given them the opportunity to make good on the merchandise. If I'd spent $15 for it used on Ebay six months ago, maybe I'd forget about it. Had I spent $75 on it brand new last month, I'd pursue it.

But as Matt explains it, maybe it was such a complete and utter fiasco that it was just easier to write it off and walk away. It really sounds, upon rereading the messages, some time passed between the purchases and problems manifesting themselves. He received the hat and wasn't happy with the headband plus it was too stiff, but thought he could live with it. Some time passes and a hole appears. Some more time passes and it rains, stains some clothing and dries to be blotchy and stained, and that's the nail in the coffin. In that case, "Too many problems on one item from the vendor - never again!" might've been my attitude as well.

So, would you publicly trash someones work if you had not made them aware that there was a problem and given them the chance to fix the problem? If you would, that is what I would call "mean spirited and vindictive".

Not wanting to complain about a problem that you deemed "water under the bridge" is read as mean spirited and along the lines of, "I got screwed, let them get screwed"? [huh] Sounds twisted to me. Maybe I am not making myself clear. I surely do not want anyone to get screwed and if I felt I "got screwed" I would yell about it to everyone. I would make sure everyone on this forum knew who I was talking about if I felt I had been "screwed"...but you can't feel screwed if you never complained to the hatter. He might have made me a new hat or refunded money or given me good reasons for the problems I found. If you feel screwed and don't complain, you kind of screwed yourself.

 

[John in Covina]

You can't feel screwed if you never complained to the hatter. He might have made me a new hat or refunded money or given me good reasons for the problems I found. If you feel screwed and don't complain, you kind of screwed yourself.

**************
There are some people that are not comfortable with conflict amd opt out quickly. They are in need of an advocate on their part.

Makes me think of people that hate dentists and won't go until the problems are big, that fact is if you'd have gone sooner it would be the less of a problem easier to deal with and less expensive too.

 

[Bebop]

True, and I agree that Gary White is inconsistant, I just think that applying that label to all custom hatters when that group include Fedora and Art isn't really fair to them. -Mulceber

I know that Fedora and Art are hatters that are idolized and defended by people no matter what and I certainly did not mean to offend your hat heros. They are fine hatters that deserve the good reputation they have. :eusa_clap There are thousands of custom hats out there that prove how great they can be. (If anyone wonders why not everyone wants to complain about a hatter, the reasons are laid out in Mulceber's posts. Not worth the rath).

 

[Fedora]

Before Fedora started making hats he reblocked Akubras, PB's, etc.

lol Well, I do not recall that one, but back when I was learning the hatmaking deal, I did all of the reblocks and refurbs.........free, no charge, no fee. I guess most folks got what they paid for. Seriously, I did do those free, and everyone knew at that time that I was just in the learning stages. I am still gratified that so many trusted me with their hats!! I figure I reblocked 60 to 70 hats back in those days, and it would not surprise me that the early ones may not have been up to snuff. But, that was a learning experience.

Back to GW. I too bought a hat from him, around 10 years ago. He was using crummy Yugoslavian felt at the time, along with the luering powder. Not my cup of tea. He also forgot to permanently attach the leather to the hat. It had only the temporary stitching to hold it in place.The sweat fell out. But, this was my first venture into the hat deal, as I had to learn how to sew that sweat back in. He had just gotten over the flu, so this may have had something to do with it. I never tried to get the hat replaced, I gave it away. Cost me 450.00 bucks too. But, Gary prompted me to make my own hats, and therefore save the big bucks. So, I owe him.......kinda, sorta. Fedora

 

[Fedora]

[Before Fedora started making hats he reblocked Akubras, PB's, etc. There was one complaint he did on the job he did on one of those jobs. /QUOTE]


Guilty as charged!!! Although, I do not remember the incident. But, please remember, that this was when I was doing all of those refurbs and reblocks free, no money involved. I guess I must have done 50 or so hats, perhaps more. I was learning the craft, and I am still amazed at the number of folks who trusted me with their hats. Although, I can recall a couple that would send an old beater, and then once they saw I could actually make the hat look better, they would send me the good ones!!!LOL But, I can honestly say, that each and every one of these trusting people, got their money's worth.

Back on topic. I too have bought a hat from Mr. White. Around 8 or 9 years ago. Cost me 450.00 and the sweatband fell out a week later. Gary had just got back to work from a bout of influenza, and apparently had forgotten to put the permanent stitches. The temporary stitches would not hold the leather in the hat. I never called him, or tried to get him to make it right. I guess I should thank him, because I sewed that leather back in, and that was the start of my learning the craft. I gave the hat away shortly thereafter. I think Michaelson still has the hat. I have worked on the hat once or twice since that time, and discovered later on, that the felt was fairly low quality stuff. Yugoslavian felt.(this is not to say they do not make some good felt) Once the war broke out over there, he changed suppliers, and I have no clue what sort of felt he is using now. But, Gary is a nice fellow, very affable. And, I think that he actually makes his hats, unlike some hatters who only do the blocking. I think he makes the hat, from start to finish. I like that. Now, not that it really matters, but many custom hats are actually made by hourly employed girls, once the body is blocked and the brim is cut. So, what you basically see is their work, and not the actual hatter himself. The neatly seated, and belled sweat, the stitched in liner, the ribbon and bow work, the brim binding.......all done by a seamstress of sorts. Just like the old Stetson factories were run. The men made the felt, did the blockwork, and the girls put it together. Fedora

 

[Pilgrim]

My take-away is this...

Why take a chance on someone with even ONE report like Matt's, when Art and other hatters with a known reputation and a vested interest in keeping forum members happy are around??

No prejudice against Gary, but the answer seems an easy conclusion to me.