Any furniture experts on board?

[David Conwill]

I finally had the presence of mind to take a picture of my desk (please excuse the mess), and was wondering if anyone could tell me something about it. I bought it for $75 at a moving sale when I moved out of the college dorms and into a house. The seller refinishes antique furniture for a living and was thinning her stock of future projects. She believed the desk was from the 1920s. It's quarter sawn oak and was made by Stowe/Davis of Grand Rapids, MI (now a division of Steelcase). I'll get a complementary chair (in my dreams it's something from Shaw-Walker) someday when I can afford one.

-Dave

 

[dakotanorth]

Not an expert, but....

Here's a few things I have learned:
Refinishing a piece of furniture tends to lower the value- if you think about it, the finish (danish oil, lacquer, what-have-you) is part of the piece! Stripping it off removes some of the "Essence" of the item. In short, you now have old wood with new polyurethane.

Check the drawers- if they have a dovetail joints, good. The case/frame, check for screws or dowels. 1920's used contemporary methods such as these, but not the "Quick n Cheap" of today (look at Big Lots for examples).

A good book for reference is "Furniture of the Depression Era"- it may not quite cover your desk, but it will help you include/exclude it. Nice starting point, probably check it out at the library.

Again, I didn't really answer any questions, but I at least helped you figure out what to look for. Things like leg shape is often inconclusive; certain styles were popular, but never absolute.
Lastly, it's a nice desk! Big, solid, sturdy, the woodgrain sounds great!

 

[AmateisGal]

Is that a kitty asleep next to the monitor?

 

[Miss Brill]

That is great! What a wonderful buy! :eusa_clap

 

[Decodence]

Nice desk. INteresting bumbo, never seen one like that.

 

[David Conwill]

Consolidated Reply

Thanks for the replies.

On the topic of refinishing - I've watched enough Antiques Roadshow to know that it's a value killer for antique furniture, unfortunately my desk is pretty far gone. Someone used it as a work bench so there are lots of stains, scratches and chunks. Plus the varnish has all dried up and turned to flakes. I kinda worry about Callie eating the flakes of varnish when she gets older. I don't think varnishes were ever lead based (I believe that's just a paint thing) but I hardly think it's good for her either. The desk photographs a lot better than it looks in person. It's like a nice, solid old Buick with a coat of surface rust: If you repaint it, it's no longer original, but it looks like a real hoopty parked in the lot of your law office.

Construction - The drawers are all dovetailed and the basic construction is dowels. I see no evidence of nails or screws. I'm assuming this means 1920s or earlier. I was kinda hoping to nail down the style. The desk just feels too ornate for the '20s, but I suppose there are lots of desks in production now that don't really feel 21st Century, either.

Sleeping kitty - Yes, that's Freezer. He's four months old (the same age as our daughter) and a real hell raiser. He's cute, though, and can be very cuddly. We found him in the parking lot about two weeks ago. His ears were bright red from frostbite. He's just taken to laying in front of the monitor. That's a much better habit than what he was doing. He would sit in front of the screen and bat at the cursor as if it were a fly on a window.

Bumbo - Actually, that's an off-brand "Bumbo" called a bebe POD. Callie hates it, so it just sits there. We're in the process of trading for a real Bumbo so that we can attach a tray to hold her toys. The real Bumbos were recalled and they're impossible to find in stores. The recall wasn't because they were unsafe, but because the seats didn't include a warning not to leave your child unattended in them on high surfaces. The modern consumer is really, really stupid apparently.

-Dave

 

[AmateisGal]

Sleeping kitty - Yes, that's Freezer. He's four months old (the same age as our daughter) and a real hell raiser. He's cute, though, and can be very cuddly. We found him in the parking lot about two weeks ago. His ears were bright red from frostbite. He's just taken to laying in front of the monitor. That's a much better habit than what he was doing. He would sit in front of the screen and bat at the cursor as if it were a fly on a window.

That is a perfect name for him.

 

[dakotanorth]

Follow-up on details

Thanks for the replies.
On the topic of refinishing - I've watched enough Antiques Roadshow to know that it's a value killer for antique furniture, unfortunately my desk is pretty far gone. Someone used it as a work bench so there are lots of stains, scratches and chunks. Plus the varnish has all dried up and turned to flakes. I kinda worry about Callie eating the flakes of varnish when she gets older. I don't think varnishes were ever lead based (I believe that's just a paint thing) but I hardly think it's good for her either. The desk photographs a lot better than it looks in person. It's like a nice, solid old Buick with a coat of surface rust: If you repaint it, it's no longer original, but it looks like a real hoopty parked in the lot of your law office.

Construction - The drawers are all dovetailed and the basic construction is dowels. I see no evidence of nails or screws. I'm assuming this means 1920s or earlier. I was kinda hoping to nail down the style. The desk just feels too ornate for the '20s, but I suppose there are lots of desks in production now that don't really feel 21st Century, either.
-Dave

Varnish, Danish Oil, Tung Oil didn't have lead, correct- lead was used as the actual "Stuff" that stays on the wall and contains the pigment. Now we use Titanium Oxide (or Dioxide??) for the flake/powder in paint. Rambling!
Don't be surprised, a good deal of stuff from the 20's had reeding, fluting,ornate details etc. Once the Industrial Revolution kicked in, these processes were easier to do, hence, more common. Actually the legs on your desk look very 1920's.
Refinishing does come down to one simple point; if the piece is practically ruined, as in "Oh my god I don't want THAT thing in my house" then obviously restoring it makes it usable again. Bottom line, it should still serves its intended function!
Something to consider- if it's only the top that's ruined, why not juss refinish the top? You can physically strip it (sandpaper, steel wool, cabinet scraper) then refinish it. Yes, it will look a bit different than the rest, but A. you can mix stains a little to help "Age" your new stain, B. the top gets the most use so it will age fast, and C. the top is a flat horizontal surface- in fact, it's the only one. The light NEVER hits this the same as the other surfaces, so it will always look a bit "Different" than everything else.
Try a small test patch on the raw wood; stain it, seal it, compare it. If it sucks, then you only have to strip off a 2in patch. If you're clever, you could even airbrush darker stain over your base color to give it the appearance of aging. (In scale models this is "panel shading" and "weathering".
Thoughts, ideas, comments, research- these will give you the answer you need!

 

[Story]

No pics handy to post for inspiration, but refinishing would be a good summer project. There's several brands of paint/varnish stripper in a can that my friends and I have had good luck with, which can be found at your local Lowe's /Home Despot.

As for a matching chair, haunt your local Craigslist. Too bad you're not local, I could hook you up with an office chair or period-matching supplemental furniture.

 

[Miss Neecerie]

My suggestion before you make a huge decision like a total refinish...is to try Howards Restore-a-finish on it and see if it improves it enough to not go to all the hassle.

You might be surpised

 

[dakotanorth]

Stripping

No pics handy to post for inspiration, but refinishing would be a good summer project. There's several brands of paint/varnish stripper in a can that my friends and I have had good luck with, which can be found at your local Lowe's /Home Despot.

As for a matching chair, haunt your local Craigslist. Too bad you're not local, I could hook you up with an office chair or period-matching supplemental furniture.

This is true, there are some excellent stripping chemicals on the market. I still use Zip-Strip which probably comes from the H-bomb and DDT era!!
However, it can be hard for you to control how much this stuff runs. If you get it right up against the edge, it can easily run over and strip the side- oops, now you have to refinish the edge detailing.
I would still recommend sanding off the finish and stain- if this thing is scratched you'd have to sand anyways. DON'T use a circular sander, belt or "elbow grease". Go easy, it's always safer to use a finer sandpaper than coarse. Plus, the chemicals are ungodly and terrible to clean up.

 

[Bill Taylor]

Before you start stripping or sanding, I think you should follow Miss Neecerie's advice and try Howards or some other furniture restorer. Sometimes, or often, that takes the final finish and crud off and brings it back to life. After that, you could varnish it with a good varnish. It probably had a shellac finish and not varnish to begin with. Most furniture of that period did. The flakes are probably from the shellac. After cleaning it up, you could also shellac it instead of varnishing. but that is not for the faint hearted. You can get shellac flakes and instructions from any good furniture refinishing supplier.

We have collected, bought, sold and probably stole old and antique furniture(especially 18th and early 19th century) for years, and mostly have had good luck using the restorative process rather than stripping and refinishing. Well, the grand piano lid didn't turn out so well at first, but that's another story. And a long one.

Also, old furniture shouldn't look bran new. The nicks and cracks of living are part of the charm. The desk looks like a 20s piece, expecially the legs. But it could just as well be early 30s. Sometimes, especially for office furniture, those designs didn't change so often. Also, I think the desk was more of a manager's or executive desk, rather than a clerical or office one. As one can see in old office photos, even manager desks were often pushed up against the wall rather than in the middle of the office.

And nope, I didn't mis-spell "bran new". Lots of folks say "brand new, but I understand that isn't right. Word comes from the 18th (or earlier) century. Chinese export porcelain was packed in wooden barrels filled with bran to protect it from breakage. When one bought a barrel of china and other wares, if it was still packed, it was "bran new".

Bill

 

[Chas]

Refinish only as a last resort. Sleep on it.

That being said, it's gorgeousity as it is.

 

[David Conwill]

Update: I got a matching oak chair at a Grand Rapids antique dealer. It's about as ragged as the desk, but they're a great match. It's stamped "Grand Rapids School Board" on the bottom. I had to replace the springs (one was missing and I couldn't find an exact match) and I'm waiting on some replacement casters I won on eBay, but my wife sewed me up a nice houndstooth seat cushion and I love it.

-Dave

 

[ShooShooBaby]

instead of starting a whole new thread, i thought i'd add my furniture dilemma here. ok, it's not even a dilemma!

i bought a waterfall vanity off craigslist the other day for $60! amazingly it didn't sell in the garage sale. i actually saw the listing after the sale and emailed to ask if the vanity was still available and it was!

anyway. it is in incredible shape considering it sat in an abandoned house for the past 15 years. however, it's really, really dirty. i will not be refinishing it so i want to be careful about what i use to clean it. what is my best plan of action? should i go straight for the Howard's? or should i be cleaning it with something else first?

here's a picture (although you can't see the inlaid wood parts!):

thanks for your input!

 

[mtechthang]

ShooShooBaby

My suggestion before you make a huge decision like a total refinish...is to try Howards Restore-a-finish on it and see if it improves it enough to not go to all the hassle.

:eusa_clap :eusa_clap :eusa_clap

Miss Neecerie has your answer. There are actually a number of these "restore-a-finish" products out there. But do go to the local hardware store and share your "problem" with them before taking any action (take pictures with you!)!! These "cleaners" run the gamut from truly gentle to stuff like the old "Formby's" that Sears had an exclusive on for a while (Dude, you ARE old!) which actually completely softens the varnish/shellac and takes most of it off- that's refinishing and will ruin any collecting potential for your piece. What is worse, if you aren't both good and patient with the process it'll wind up looking bad as well!

If it is just old, but not antique, then you just have to decide whether the "patina" on it is more valuable to you aesthetically than having something that looks new. As stated above, and every episode of Antiques Roadshow, old does not mean antique so it may be ok to refinish. But if it was valuable to begin with or is a rare piece of quality (the criteria, among others, for antique) then be very careful with it!! Again, your best bet on how to deal with this is a knowledgeable hardware employee or area specialist in antiques. Good luck.

 

[ShooShooBaby]

thanks

i'm not really worried about ruining the value of it or anything... i'm glad it made it out of 15 years of abandoned-house-ness alive! it faired a lot better than the walls and ceilings of the house...

i really just want to get the dirt off an polish it. i have a poor track record for keeping vanity surfaces neat and clean, so refinishing would probably be a waste of time.

i'm about to call my hardware store about the restor-a-finish products.

:eusa_clap :eusa_clap :eusa_clap

Miss Neecerie has your answer. There are actually a number of these "restore-a-finish" products out there. But do go to the local hardware store and share your "problem" with them before taking any action (take pictures with you!)!! These "cleaners" run the gamut from truly gentle to stuff like the old "Formby's" that Sears had an exclusive on for a while (Dude, you ARE old!) which actually completely softens the varnish/shellac and takes most of it off- that's refinishing and will ruin any collecting potential for your piece. What is worse, if you aren't both good and patient with the process it'll wind up looking bad as well!

If it is just old, but not antique, then you just have to decide whether the "patina" on it is more valuable to you aesthetically than having something that looks new. As stated above, and every episode of Antiques Roadshow, old does not mean antique so it may be ok to refinish. But if it was valuable to begin with or is a rare piece of quality (the criteria, among others, for antique) then be very careful with it!! Again, your best bet on how to deal with this is a knowledgeable hardware employee or area specialist in antiques. Good luck.

 

[ShooShooBaby]

hmm... i am still confused on whether or not i should clean the vanity before the howards, or do i use the howards for cleaning? there's a good amount of dust and stuff caked onto the surface. and what should i clean it with?

 

[Miss Neecerie]

If it helps....I used a -lightly- damp rag to get any loose dust off before I used the Restor-a-finish.

if there are any areas where you can just tell its like something spilled on it....yes, clean those spots with a gentle cleaner on a rag...other then that just try the Howards on it.

 

[mtechthang]

Hope this is helpful-

hmm... i am still confused on whether or not i should clean the vanity before the howards, or do i use the howards for cleaning? there's a good amount of dust and stuff caked onto the surface. and what should i clean it with?

Here is their web-site. It doesn't say anything about pre-cleaning- I suspect a light wiping with a damp cloth or non-wax dusting product would do fine.
http://www.howardproducts.com/restora.htm