ALL REPRO R.A.F. Irvin type jackets

[fleet16b]

Just goy an email from Rob Brace at ELC.
My B of B Irvin was shipped on Oct 7th.
After hearing many horror stories about wait times at ELC , I must say that I am very happy considering I placed he order Sept 24th.
Rob thinks I should receive the jacket sometime next week.
I will post pics once it arrives . I hope it fits well

 

[Spitfire]

Now you know, how it is, to be like a small boy - the day before christmas lol

 

[greeny]

Does anyone know whether it is possible to specify a lighter coloured fleece on the Eastman ´42 model? Or does it always come with the caramel coloured fleece? I've tried emailing them but I haven't had any response.

 

[fleet16b]

Does anyone know whether it is possible to specify a lighter coloured fleece on the Eastman ´42 model? Or does it always come with the caramel coloured fleece? I've tried emailing them but I haven't had any response.

Having just dealt with them, they will do some odd sizes but as for finishes longer belts fleece colour etc, you get what you get.
ELC is pretty inflexible when it comes to customizing their jackets.

 

[fleet16b]

Well I got home tonight and my Irvin was waiting for me.
To recap: ordered an ELC 1940 B of B Irvin size 44 on Sept 24th and it arrived Oct 13th - 20 days to my door.
I certainly can't complain about wait time.
The jacket fits well but will take some time to get use to.
My WPG Irvin is much thinner and easier to move in but also floppier.
My Links original size six is about the same as the ELC size 44 but due to age and wear on the wool , seems thinner and roomier.
All together the ELC Irvin is the one I have been waiting for since childhood.
Here are some pics of at less than I hour old.
Let me know what you guys think.

 

[Spitfire]

:eusa_clap :eusa_clap :eusa_clap
Congrats - it's a beauty and it fits you perfectly.

Is that a smile we see at that last photo?

 

[PADDY]

Mona Lisa smile

Beautiful..!! congrats :eusa_clap

 

[jamespibworth@n]

Superb jacket and the fit is as it should be.

Like the fleece colour. I think I now prefer yours to my later 42 pattern. Can’t buy another Irvin can I? No I must resist, maybe not look at the fedora lounge until the temptation passes!!

James

 

[fleet16b]

Thanks everyone
Yes there is a hint of satisfaction on my face threatening to burst forth in the one pic
I really like the jacket, very sturdy construction and comparing it to my links , it seems like an excellent repro Irvin.I have tried it on with both my flight suit and with my 1936 Sidcot and it feels just fine with either one.
The matte finish is not what I am use too either but the camera makes it seem more matte than it actually is.
I'll do the "Hawkeye thing" and try to take a few pics of me in it outside in natural light. May also put on my two different Sidcots also so that some of you guys can see what some authentic ones look like.

At the moment the jacket is stiff and a little bulky but I think with time and wear it will loosen up. My ELC 1401 was also a little stiff the first year.
The only things I would change are maybe the time worn finish and I would prefer the waist belt be longer like originals. Both these are minor issues that I can easily live with
I would also love to know how ELC gives the hide it's time worn finish. It almost has the appearance and feel of having been very very lightly sandblasted. The feel of the finish takes a little getting use to also but again I thinks wear and tear will soften and loosen the jacket.
All told , I would recommend this jacket. Wonderfull looking, great grains in the leather, good wool colour and ofcourse that nice new sheepskin / leather smell.
We had temps hovering on 0 deg this a.m. with frost on the cars.
Gave the Irvin a test run to work using no heat etc and I was comfortably warm.I am going to like this jacket
Looking back , it's been a long road to this jacket. My very first jacket was custom made for me when I was 13 years old and was based on an old aviation leathercraft picture. This is my 6th jacket and looks like my last if I don't wear it out .

Thanks to everyone for all the comments. it's been a real education

Cam

 

[boyorastroboy]

Cam,
You've told us that the WPG is "floppier", do you have any additional sizing observations to share? Sleeve length in comparison, overall length, etc? I imagine there are a few of us WPG owners looking to upgrade that would find the information useful.
Thanks!

 

[fleet16b]

Cam,
You've told us that the WPG is "floppier", do you have any additional sizing observations to share? Sleeve length in comparison, overall length, etc? I imagine there are a few of us WPG owners looking to upgrade that would find the information useful.
Thanks!

What I mean is that the WPG hide and wool is thinner, therefore the jacket sags on the body whereas the ELC is thicker and sturdier.
The measurements of the WPG Irvin are not an issue.

 

[boyorastroboy]

What I mean is that the WPG hide and wool is thinner, therefore the jacket sags on the body whereas the ELC is thicker and sturdier.
The measurements of the WPG Irvin are not an issue.

Thanks, Cam. I wasn't so much wondering about issues (though the sturdiness/thickness observation is interesting to consider) as the suitability of the WPG as a guide in selecting the proper size of ELC jacket. I believe you have a 44 of each, correct? Would you consider them to be pretty similar in general size-wise?

 

[fleet16b]

Thanks, Cam. I wasn't so much wondering about issues (though the sturdiness/thickness observation is interesting to consider) as the suitability of the WPG as a guide in selecting the proper size of ELC jacket. I believe you have a 44 of each, correct? Would you consider them to be pretty similar in general size-wise?

Both my WPG and ELC Irvins are size 44 however I would consider the WPG as a size 46-48 when comparing.
Don't get me wrong, I still feel the WPG Irvin is a good jacket especially if one has a budget.It's only drawback IMHO is the main zipper.
Mine is starting to fray a little and at times makes the zip hard to get started.
Some WPG owners have had new zips installed. Apparently not to expensive. I would go so far as to say that all WPG Irvins will need the zips replaced within a year of constant use.( I wore mine for only 1 winter approx 4 months)
I now have the WPG , the ELC and an original Links Irvin, so I am going to let the WPG Irvin go.
It was originally $350 so I am going to ask $250. This should help the buyer if he decides to replace the zipper. I have offered it here and on the VLJ Forum and will soon put it on Ebay.

 

[Smithy]

That really looks great Cam and pleased to see that she's finally turned up.

My ELC 1940 was the same in terms of "bulkiness" feel for the first half dozen wears but once you work some creases into the arms you'll find they break in very, very quickly.

One difference I note with yours and mine is that the fleece on mine seems to be more densely packed but that could be the flash doing funny things in the photo.

Once again good job, I'm sure you'll love yours as much as I do mine!

 

[Windsock]

I joined the club- for a minute...

Over at VLJ we have been playing musical ELC Irvins. I picked this size 48 1940 model from another member and it's now moving on to another who has just sold his '42 pattern to another VLJ'er!

I confess i bought it out of curiosity, having heard so much about them I just had to compare with the real thing. Unfortunately for me it'll never be a practical option- at least not a 48- maybe could be tempted again with a 46- who knows.

Mine's exactly the same as Cams. I love it, and it may be heresy to some but personally I feel they are using fleeces that are too thick and I dont think the arm patten is consistent with the proportions of the rest of the jacket or of originals. Still, it is a thing of beauty and I don't mind the broken finish either.

For thoise interested to compare, the dimensions are;
pit to pit 26"
Shoulder to cuff 26.5"
Back length 26"
Zipper length to bottom of hem 23"
Shoulder width 21"
I did measure it last week but it's packed now so can't verify, but the bicep circumference is about a full 2" longer than any of my 4 comparably sized originals.

 

[H.Johnson]

Andrew,

I agree - I think that the sheepskin that ELC uses has considerably longer fleece than any of the pre-war examples I have examined - the closer-cropped fleece is surely one of the distinguishing characteristics of the early pattern(s)?

What I don't understand is that some years ago on a visit to ELC they showed me a prototype of their early pattern jacket and as I remember it had the shorter (more authentic?) fleece - much more realistic. Maybe they are responding to customer feedback - some people seem to to value the bulky 'teddy bear' look...

I agree with your observations about the arm pattern. I suspect they've based their patterns on a modern arm. The arms of the earliest Irvin I ever owned would only just fit me over a shirt and I weigh 145 pounds and have 12inch biceps!

I guess ELC is in business to sell jackets, not to produce perfect replicas. Sorry if our heresy offends anyone...

Over at VLJ
Mine's exactly the same as Cams. I love it, and it may be heresy to some but personally I feel they are using fleeces that are too thick and I dont think the arm patten is consistent with the proportions of the rest of the jacket or of originals. Still, it is a thing of beauty and I don't mind the broken finish either.

I did measure it last week but it's packed now so can't verify, but the bicep circumference is about a full 2" longer than any of my 4 comparably sized originals.

 

[BellyTank]

I think a lot of folks subscribe to the "bullet-proof mentality";
the thicker and heavier the hide and the more luxurious the shearling,
or sheepskin, the more "authentic" the garment is perceived to be.

This mis-information is seemingly propagated by the vendors of such items of "authentic" historical apparel. The shortcomings in knowledge, available materials and hardware and second hand, faulty information, are twisted into the "yarns" they spin into their marketing propaganda.
It is believed by many, that these vendors are the last word on what is and is not correct and authentic but we have seen, and many serious collectors and enthusiasts know, that they are not.

There are a couple of exceptions, though.


B
T

 

[greeny]

And isn't the Aero supposed to be an even heavier jacket with a longer fleece than the Eastman?? Now the Eastman is also too bulky?
Just when I think I know what I want...![huh]

 

[PADDY]

From the mid 90's.

Mine is from the mid 90's. Fleece is short and not bulky at all.

 

[greeny]

That's a very nice jacket!

I really like the look of the Eastman BofB - but the price is just a little high for me. I've been speaking to Amanda at Aero and she 's told me she can make me their pre-war jacket with a squared rather than a rounded collar. This is very tempting - but I'm concerned about the bulkiness. I read a comparison on another thread that said the Eastman was noticeably lighter than the Aero. I'm worried I'll look too inflated!