Aero USN Type M422a vs 38-1711-P Type A-2

[Peacoat]

So I am still agonizing over this. Which is not unusual for me. Took me forever to pull the trigger on my aero halfbelt. I have decided to get the M422a with some modifications.

The big decision: I am not sure about the mouton collar. I'm leaning towards not having it.

I'm thinking it may be too warm. That is my main decision now.

The mouton collar isn't "too warm." When in the down position, you probably won't even know it's there. But it is nice when you need to put it up to block that N.J. wind and give a bit more warmth to the back of the neck. As it is the M-422, I would go with the mouton collar.

 

[bretron]

I say if you dont want the mutton collar, don't get a m422 or g1. Stick with an a2. If you're worried about cut, go with a new repro made to order. Modifying the body length is one thing, but getting rid of the focus piece of a jacket (namely the mutton collar) is another!

It's like ordering a bacon cheeseburger only to take the bacon off!!

 

[Jeff M]

Yeah, I'd do the sateen in the sleeves too. It's hard to get some shirts/sweaters through the sleeves with drill. But oddly, not with my A-2's. Not sure why.

FWIW, I have an Aero Half Belt with sateen in the sleeves.
I would not do that again.
Because the sateen is relatively fragile, Aero double lines the sleeves, sateen over the cotten drill.
The excess of material in the sleeves causes it to bunch up in places...down in the forearm primarily....causing uncomfortable pressure points that I am always fighting with to "pull out"...which I am unable to do because of the limited room in the sleeves to get my hands down.
The bunching can get pretty uncomfortable..especially if resting my arm on something.
Amanda "warned" me when I ordered the jacket that the sleeves would be double lined. I didn't realize what problems this would cause.
In addition, the sateen seems to be less "breathable" than the plain cotten drill. Heats up quicker...doesn't dissipate my body heat as well.
I have very very sensitive skin.
Though not as "silky smooth" when putting a jacket on, the cotten drill lining is not at all uncomfortable..and overall, I MUCH prefer it to sateen in the sleeves.

one of these days I will ship my Half belt back to Aero to take out the sateen. I am anticipating, what with shipping both ways, this will come to a couple of hundred dollars. That's fine with me. I hate the sateen lined sleeves that much.

 

[ButteMT61]

OK, good to know Jeff! It's not awful, just a bit of work if the shirt is thicker and of a similar material. I have my heavier Carhartt shirts that I love and they are a bit tough to don/doff. I guess we're all looking for perfection, which we know doesn't exist. lol

 

[Jeff M]

I say if you dont want the mutton collar, don't get a m422 or g1. Stick with an a2. If you're worried about cut, go with a new repro made to order. Modifying the body length is one thing, but getting rid of the focus piece of a jacket (namely the mutton collar) is another!

It's like ordering a bacon cheeseburger only to take the bacon off!!

I'll disagree here.
The M422a design is MUCH different than an A2 design.
It's not just "bacon", but different condiments, bun, side dish.
When I ordered my M422a, I was looking for a quality custom made leather jacket based on the "half belt" bi-swing, patch pocket, basic WWII military design.
I have A2's. Love them...but...I was looking jacket that was more comfortable to wear. More arm hole room...range of motion friendly.


I tend to prefer plain leather collars on "military style" leather jackets. I heat up quickly, and the mouton just exacerbates that issue.
I am not into wearing "100% Authentic Reproduction" (a bit of an oxymoron, isn't it? ) military jackets.
I do like the "classic fit" and some of the design characteristics of those garments..but..it's a jacket. I don't care if somebody thinks "gee, that's not really accurate". By the same token, I'm not one to put up with roasting uncomfortably just for "fashion's sake".
If your main concern is to buy a jacket that is stylish and comfortable for you to wear, get what fills your need.
Bacon or no bacon.

 

[ButteMT61]

I got my Aero 50's HBD with a removable fur collar. Best of both worlds. It was wonderful in Europe this past November/December with the winds and rain, and I can wear it now without it and enjoy the jacket longer into spring.
Might want to look at this post as well.

Scott

 

[bretron]

I'll disagree here.
The M422a design is MUCH different than an A2 design.
It's not just "bacon", but different condiments, bun, side dish.
When I ordered my M422a, I was looking for a quality custom made leather jacket based on the "half belt" bi-swing, patch pocket, basic WWII military design.
I have A2's. Love them...but...I was looking jacket that was more comfortable to wear. More arm hole room...range of motion friendly.


I tend to prefer plain leather collars on "military style" leather jackets. I heat up quickly, and the mouton just exacerbates that issue.
I am not into wearing "100% Authentic Reproduction" (a bit of an oxymoron, isn't it? ) military jackets.
I do like the "classic fit" and some of the design characteristics of those garments..but..it's a jacket. I don't care if somebody thinks "gee, that's not really accurate". By the same token, I'm not one to put up with roasting uncomfortably just for "fashion's sake".
If your main concern is to buy a jacket that is stylish and comfortable for you to wear, get what fills your need.
Bacon or no bacon.

You own a modified a-2 with a mutton collar? me, I'll take extra bacon, with maybe an extra side of bacon

 

[Jeff M]

You own a modified a-2 with a mutton collar? ...

Nope.
An Aero M422a sans mouton collar.
Think of it as an AN-J-3 ;

http://www.gibson-barnes.com/AN-J-3+USAAF_USN/id/18/cat_id/18/prod_id/452/

"The AN-J-3 was a good-looking flight jacket, but the Air Force bought only a few. A Navy version, called the AN-J-3a, was almost identical to the M-422 and was issued to Naval aviators for years. After buying a few thousand AN-J-3s, the Air Force abandoned leather flight clothing completely, switching to new fabrics such as nylon and polyester.
The Airforce AN-J-3 combined the features of the A-2 and the M-422. All AN-J-3s had the M-422's action back, underarm gussets, rib-rack knit waistband, and button pockets as well as the A-2's collar without the snaps or hook-and-eye. Some had the A-2 epaulets and storm flap while others had the M-422's storm flap, inside chart pocket, and pencil slot under the left pocket flap."

 

[regius]

Types of thread to use on A2 jackets

I am considering tailoring my seal brown AERO A2, cut down a size or two. The local new york Chris French tailor shop is very good, they have european trained worker working for them for at least 30 years. But the hard part that comes with dealing with such exeprienced people is they have the pride and esteem to defend.

I want to know why original A2 use cotton thread, aren't cottons not durable, compared with polyester or nylon? The tailors used polyester blend for my previous leather jacket, but if AERO used cotton, I have to ask them to use cotton no matter what they sa about cotton thread for leather jacket. (they say cotton for leather jacket is no good).

 

[Dr H]

It's unlikely that Aero would have used cotton unless specifically asked to do so, preferring a modern thread made from a synthetic polymer blend.
Original A-2s were stitched using cotton, but that was the norm for mass produced (cheap) garments in the 40s. The colour fastness, tensile strength and longevity of cotton are all surpassed by more recent fibres.
If you're maintaing accuracy in an original, go the extra mile to source the right colour of cotton (which show signs of fading), but in a modern jacket stick with modem materials that are matched for strength. Mixing new thread with old will put more stress on the older seams too given the difference in mechanical strength of old and new threads.