Aero RAF Comfort Sweater

[Sloan1874]

Something to go with one's Irvin perhaps? Damn necessary in this weather!

http://www.aeroleatherclothing.com/product-detail.php?id=2553

 

[Dr H]

Very nice, but £210? Eeek...

Incidentally Sloan, what's the story with the Fairisle sweaters? Until last year, there were some great, authentic looking designs on the site (tried to pick one up in my size), but over the last year they've taken a dive to my eye - there are some odd colour choices and strange patterns. Bring back the original knitters, I say... :/

 

[Don Tomaso]

Looks a bit too handknitted to me, in particular for that price. Who did it, Prince Charles??

 

[Sloan1874]

I'm no lover of Fairisle tank tops, to be honest (I just look daft in them) so I haven't noticed any change . Mind you, some of the Harris tweed combinations I was looking at in Walker-Slater a few weeks back could burn your retinas but people were buying them by the armful, so it's horses for courses. As you say, they're not a casual purchase, but I think anyone looking for the complete RAF pilot look, they're just the ticket. Personally, I prefer the blue to the white.

 

[Dr H]

I am a follower of the Fairisle, trust me they've gone downhill

 

[John Lever]

Very nice, but £210? Eeek...

Incidentally Sloan, what's the story with the Fairisle sweaters? Until last year, there were some great, authentic looking designs on the site (tried to pick one up in my size), but over the last year they've taken a dive to my eye - there are some odd colour choices and strange patterns. Bring back the original knitters, I say... :/

Have seen the price of hand knits in the shops ?

 

[Plumbline]

I thought the std. off white RAF sweater was steep at £87.50 ...... thwe devil is in the detail but MAN that's an expensive jumper You can pick up some REALLY nice cashmere for that sort of wedge .... and my surplus one cost me £8 in the 80's from a stock sale in Shortstown ( should have bought a pile of them )

 

[Grayland]

I just got an RAF Airman Sweater from ELC a few weeks ago. I bought the ecru version. Very nice and necessary in this weather.

 

[Fanch]

79 degrees F in Dallas TX right now. Hear you guys in the NE USA are freezing this week. :smow:

Lovely Aero RAF Comfort Sweater that I could wear maybe 1-2 days per year.

 

[Smithy]

Just to be pedantic, these jumpers were actually originally RN, and were available in natural wool colour and a dark navy. The RAF early in the War issued the wool "frock" jumper which was a tremendously long thing although the RN "submarine" jumper of this length was also available for issue to aircrew.

It also wasn't unusual to see a wide variety of private purchase or family knitted jumpers used by RAF aircrew, especially later in the war. Probably one of the most famous was that used by Marius Eriksen, a Norwegian flying Spits in 332 Sqn who wore a jumper knitted by his mother in a modified traditional Norwegian pattern which has now become the most common and famous Norwegian jumper, the "Mariusgenser".

 

[jlanderson]

Craig, THANKS for that mention of Walker Slater ... some of those tweeds and those reasonable prices have me drooling!

 

[Big J]

Just to be pedantic, these jumpers were actually originally RN, and were available in natural wool colour and a dark navy. The RAF early in the War issued the wool "frock" jumper which was a tremendously long thing although the RN "submarine" jumper of this length was also available for issue to aircrew.

It also wasn't unusual to see a wide variety of private purchase or family knitted jumpers used by RAF aircrew, especially later in the war. Probably one of the most famous was that used by Marius Eriksen, a Norwegian flying Spits in 332 Sqn who wore a jumper knitted by his mother in a modified traditional Norwegian pattern which has now become the most common and famous Norwegian jumper, the "Mariusgenser".

I'm sure that there's a thread on this somewhere.
White sweaters were issued to RN submariners. The RAF were issued dark (navy) blue sweaters for flying. Everyone thinks the RAF wore white ones because Robert Shaw's character wore one.

 

[Smithy]

I'm sure that there's a thread on this somewhere.
White sweaters were issued to RN submariners. The RAF were issued dark (navy) blue sweaters for flying. Everyone thinks the RAF wore white ones because Robert Shaw's character wore one.

Both natural and navy "submarine" jumpers were issued in the RN. Although I haven't seen it absolutely confirmed it appears that the natural was more often issued to officers in the RN whilst the navy version to non-commissioned ratings.

Actually the idea of the RAF wearing the natural ones in the public mind was conceived long before Shaw in the BoB film. It was mostly born out of the RAF's first ace of the War, NZer Cobber Kain who wore one and being a huge star of the day in 1939/early 1940 was photographed extensively wearing one.

 

[Sloan1874]

Craig, THANKS for that mention of Walker Slater ... some of those tweeds and those reasonable prices have me drooling!

Their stuff is excellent quality. I had a cashmere-wool chalk stripe suit from them which lasted me a good 10 years of weekly wear before the trousers gave in - jacket is still perfect, though - and the tweed is really top notch.
As regards the jumpers, my understanding is that they are based on the ones given to PoW than ones issued to servicemen, hence the colours. I'm told they're seriously heavy items btw, something that's probably not visible from the pics, which should appeal to the 'bullet-proof' demands of Outerwear regulars...

 

[Deacon211]

Not very realistic I know, but really love my Orvis RAF Sweater.

Soft, warm, and doesn't look like something I'd be arrested for vagrancy in! J/K....I appreciate Aero's attempt to recreate the home spun style.




Deacon

 

[havocpaul]

These are specifically repros of the ones knitted by the public for the Comforts Committee, they also show the small book that was published with the knitting patterns, my mother followed the patterns and sent a heavy wool sweater to my father when he was in the RAF. They were also meant to be sent via the Red Cross to prisoners of war. Therefore quite different to the issued aircrew sweaters and submariner sweaters. Of course RAF aircrew did often wear their own choice of knitwear when flying, a wide variety can be seen especially with Bomber Command. It is interesting how post-war war films have influenced our beliefs of what was worn, all those POW's wearing tennis jumpers, tank tops etc, then again, I would recommend anyone to read the excellent book "To the Victor The Spoils" and particularly the chapter on uniform of the British troops after D-Day..top hats, dressing gowns and much more! I would love to get one of these Aeros, they have done a superb job and like the originals, a labour of love.

 

[Stand By]

I must say, I think the sweater looks really fantastic! It looks like a great partner to any Irvin and because the neater knit and ecru colour type is what everyone (Joe Public) thinks of (thanks to the Battle of Britain film), I think the rougher knit and RAF blue helps break up that look - the one that can draw uninvited and unimaginative comments from certain insufferable sheeple.

As for the price, yes, I balked when I first saw it … but then again, I was riding home from work and thinking about it - and I know the price of wool has rocketed in recent years and a wool shop owner told me a few years ago that one couldn't possibly buy the wool to make an RAF sweater for $100 (50 quid) - and that was 5 years ago.
So let's assume that it costs 75 pounds just to buy the wool (I'm guessing here).
Then you have to find a very witty knitter - and let's say it takes 15 hours of solid knitting to make the sweater. And at just 5 pounds an hour - that's another 75 pounds. So you're at 150 quid. Then Aero has a cut of course - so it's easily done to arrive at that price. And that's assuming a humble work rate of 5 pounds an hour (even assuming it can be done in that time!).
So the price isn't so bad when you break it down in real terms and time.
And if you look after it, it'll last decades and I think that's a good return on value for money in the very long run.

 

[Edward]

Actually the idea of the RAF wearing the natural ones in the public mind was conceived long before Shaw in the BoB film. It was mostly born out of the RAF's first ace of the War, NZer Cobber Kain who wore one and being a huge star of the day in 1939/early 1940 was photographed extensively wearing one.

I rather suspect the later adoption of the jumpers by the British Rocker fraternity, and associated mythology, also helped the notion of the cream/white one as "the RAF jumper".... About ten years ago, I bought one for my dad from the ACE, in Navy (he prefered darker colours for out on the bike). Back then it was about £50; hard enough to find one for £75 now. I think ELC are over £100? Anyhow, the Ace stopped selling the darker ones some time back; seems that the original rocker look which is fashionable to revive now is very specific, and if it's a sweater, it has to be the cream.... (it's interesting comparing contemporary revival event photos with photos of original rockers back in the day!).

These are specifically repros of the ones knitted by the public for the Comforts Committee, they also show the small book that was published with the knitting patterns, my mother followed the patterns and sent a heavy wool sweater to my father when he was in the RAF. They were also meant to be sent via the Red Cross to prisoners of war. Therefore quite different to the issued aircrew sweaters and submariner sweaters. Of course RAF aircrew did often wear their own choice of knitwear when flying, a wide variety can be seen especially with Bomber Command. It is interesting how post-war war films have influenced our beliefs of what was worn, all those POW's wearing tennis jumpers, tank tops etc, then again, I would recommend anyone to read the excellent book "To the Victor The Spoils" and particularly the chapter on uniform of the British troops after D-Day..top hats, dressing gowns and much more! I would love to get one of these Aeros, they have done a superb job and like the originals, a labour of love.

Useful background, thanks.... Yes, it's amazing how the details of those films so often overtakes the notion of what is "correct", against the reality... A more recent example would be the "WW2" RAF greatcoat worn by Jack Harkness in Doctor Who / Torchwood, which is in reality a 1950s model and differs in certain key respects.

I must say, I think the sweater looks really fantastic! It looks like a great partner to any Irvin and because the neater knit and ecru colour type is what everyone (Joe Public) thinks of (thanks to the Battle of Britain film), I think the rougher knit and RAF blue helps break up that look - the one that can draw uninvited and unimaginative comments from certain insufferable sheeple.

As for the price, yes, I balked when I first saw it … but then again, I was riding home from work and thinking about it - and I know the price of wool has rocketed in recent years and a wool shop owner told me a few years ago that one couldn't possibly buy the wool to make an RAF sweater for $100 (50 quid) - and that was 5 years ago.
So let's assume that it costs 75 pounds just to buy the wool (I'm guessing here).
Then you have to find a very witty knitter - and let's say it takes 15 hours of solid knitting to make the sweater. And at just 5 pounds an hour - that's another 75 pounds. So you're at 150 quid. Then Aero has a cut of course - so it's easily done to arrive at that price. And that's assuming a humble work rate of 5 pounds an hour (even assuming it can be done in that time!).
So the price isn't so bad when you break it down in real terms and time.
And if you look after it, it'll last decades and I think that's a good return on value for money in the very long run.

That was my conclusion too. I'm not sure I'd buy one myself (certainly not until I'm absolutely certain all the "£$%ing carpet beetles and ^&*(ing moths are gone from my %^&*ing house..... :lol: ), however, price-wise, once you take those costings, especially labour-hours into account, it's not extortionate for what it is. Especially not when you compare it to the price of machine-knit, wool blend items that are made in a sweatshop somewhere them sold for that or more off the back of a designer label.... Probably the sweater equivalent of comparing a nice, mass-market jacket like a Schott to the very top of the range, M2M Aero/ELC / w.h.y..... or, indeed, a mid-price OTR suit to a fully hand-sewn bespoke one, in a sense. There's a level of man-hours gone into making something like that that will boost the price. I do love the colour, though.

As to the Fairisles, well.... I rather like the ones they have currently, myself, though it's certainly fair to say that I don't think all of them would have as wide an appeal as perhaps some more conservative styles. The labour that goes into those makes the prices charged more than well worth it.

 

[Plumbline]

or you can buy a submariner sweatwe / RAF sweater from Aero for @ £85 .. or one from Eastman for @£95 ... or a Navy Surplus one from Ebay for @£30 .. or have one custom knitted for £100 to the original pattern ( if you know a prolific knitter) .. or get your Auntie Lizzie to knit one for you for the cost of the wool (£20) and a bunch of flowers ( DAMHIKTIJKOK)

 

[Davy Crockett]

or there is souwestchunkies who would make one to your measurements for so little you wouldn't believe it!

D