A Panama Hat worthy of FDR

[Marc Chevalier]

... I have two other vintage optimo crowned hats and they are routinely judged by women to be unattractive.

haha I hate to say it, but despite my secret inner desire for an Optimo style panama, it does give off a very "old man" vibe.

I hope you're both wrong!

 

[Marc Chevalier]

http://i547.photobucket.com/albums/hh450/andycat60/P1040440_edited-1.jpg

(and that dude kinda' looks like me too. spooky.)

Be proud that you look like Alberto Santos Dumont, the Brazilian aviation genius.

.

 

[cookie]

Poor Alberto Santos Dumont. He committed suicide, you know.

.

Yeah but how many (Arcentales-wearing) people get an airport named after them?

 

[Tomasso]

The Optimo does look good on Marc.

 

[Marc Chevalier]

The Optimo does look good on Marc.

Whew! (And thanks!)

.

 

[Tomasso]

Whew!

.

Like you even care!

 

[HungaryTom]

Gene,
I know you appreciate the contributions – Casa Arcentales must be a Guayaquil tradesmark or so. They mark the weaver’s and/or hat finishers initials with pencil. Strange, on Hungarian handmade shoes the cobbler writes his first name with ink in the inside of the shoe – you read Laci, Béla, Albi etc. Most probably same as with these Montecristi hats.
The Espinal are a weaving clan from Píle -it is not uncommon in artisan villages to have established families doing the trade for centuries.
The fact that your hat has definitely 2400+ wpsi (same end result on the other side of the globe) and has 11 vueltas – testifies that the vueltas aren’t a true indicator of the fineness.
I link here some photos of the FDR e-bayed Optimo - Casa Arcentales too- That hat scored finally 2K in the state as it was.
http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb98/HungaryTom/FDRPanamaLifesize01.jpg
http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb98/HungaryTom/FDRPanamaLifesize02.jpg
http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb98/HungaryTom/FDRPanamaLifesize03.jpg
http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb98/HungaryTom/FDRPanamaLifesize05.jpg

The certificate of authenticity:

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb98/HungaryTom/FDRPanamaLifesize04.jpg
That real-life presidential hat has similar 2000+ weavecount and also „only” 15 or so vueltas – still these are hats are clearly way above today’s level.
Maybe someone directly dealing with the weavers could tell whether it is a technological necessity to have the vueltas with a certain frequency or not, in other words there is no direct correlation between vueltas and the weavecount.
For example the bottom Montecristi in my avatar has 15 vueltas/1600+ wpsi the second 19 vueltas/1400+ wpsi, the top one Optimo has 13/1000+wpsi.
Gene, I would do as Graham tells, reblock this hat but not sell this thing of beauty. Even if hard times come - rather get rid off few vintage factory felt hats that were produced by the thosuands in that particular color and size and model by the specific brand. This was not. Wear it and enjoy it - you are that collector yourself!


Tom

Marc - looking good.

 

[Macheath]

haha I hate to say it, but despite my secret inner desire for an Optimo style panama, it does give off a very "old man" vibe.

Ehhh, I thought that ever elusive "old man vibe" is PRECISELY what a sizable majority of Loungers are looking for to begin with, no? [huh] lol

Besides, I think HPG's too hip to have to worry about such things. I say go for the Optimo block if you like it.

 

[HarpPlayerGene]

Gene,
Wear it and enjoy it - you are that collector yourself!


Tom

Excellent information, figures and photos. Just the kind of added details I was hoping to get from posting this at TFL. I am very grateful that you shared this with me.

Those breaks on the FDR hat are waaaaayyy worse than the few 1/8" weak spots mine has. Still, I'm surprised the FDR hat didn't sell for more.

Having it finished for me is still the original, favored plan. Unless something dramatically good (some improbable super high offer) or bad (hat unravels during blocking) develops in Chicago, that's what'll happen.

I can generate money - but to be the custodian of something like this is a far more difficult thing to arrange.

 

[HarpPlayerGene]

"Old man" hat. That's funny.

No, Marc, old man, you don't look like an old man in yours.

As compared to a C-crown the optimos do have a more prim and proper style about them though, don't they. They aren't my absolute favorite hat shape but they've always appealed to me in a British-Colonial-Expeditionary-White-Mischief sort of way.

 

[jimmy the lid]

They aren't my absolute favorite hat shape but they've always appealed to me in a British-Colonial-Expeditionary-White-Mischief sort of way.

lol lol lol

Gene -- perhaps the ultimate blocking style you choose has something to do with your intended use of the hat. For example, if, given its rarity, it is something you would rarely wear, then perhaps preserving the Optimo block is something that would make sense -- very organic to the hat, and in keeping with its tradition. (I happen to think that it's a very cool look, as well -- but that's a subjective call).

But, that being said, let's suppose you actually intend to wear the hat a fair bit. In that case, you need to feel comfortable in your own lid skin, so to speak. If it doesn't feel right to you, you won't feel good wearing it. And there ain't nothin' wrong with a teardrop. It's a great look on a panama. If going with a different kind of blocking makes it more likely that you will enjoy wearing it and it will therefore see the light of day more often, then that's the way to go!

Just some thoughts...

Cheers,
JtL

 

[BellyTank]

Optimo Style

Is the proper style for a nice Panama.
I bet you don't have any felt hats in an Optimo block.

Dare.


B
T

 

[mineral]

Having it finished for me is still the original, favored plan. Unless something dramatically good (some improbable super high offer) or bad (hat unravels during blocking) develops in Chicago, that's what'll happen.

I can generate money - but to be the custodian of something like this is a far more difficult thing to arrange.

Congratulations on the hat!

It might be presumptuous for me to say so, but I don't think you should consider selling the hat (to someone who can take good care of it) until your time is up or unless you really need the money. The hat is probably one of the finest man-made object most people can ever hope to own, and you might not be able to find something of such a technical quality in another 10-20 years. You might come to really regret it.

I would say you should make it thoroughly yours. I don't think you should make it an optimo, since, as you stated, the cracks would be less visible but more importantly you don't feel comfortable/don't look good in it. I do not believe that "an optimo is the traditional way a panama hat should look" constitutes a good reason to make it an optimo if the style pleases you less.

 

[Lefty]

Is the proper style for a nice Panama.
I bet you don't have any felt hats in an Optimo block.
Dare.

truth - there are at least two of them on the Lounge.

Hey Gene, your great discovery is annoying my wife - I talk about it too much.

 

[Michaelshane]

Speaking of classic styles.....

[/IMG]



My wife is sick of hearing about it too....

 

[HarpPlayerGene]

Oh, the 'sick wife' bit is just killing me, guys! lol lol lol That is tooooo funny.

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Thanks again for the votes on blocking style. I'm not deciding until Graham has it in his possession and I can talk pros and cons with him. I am not personally uncomfortable in the optimo style and it may go that way, but the C-Crown may be best in order to use up some of that brim into a higher crown which then gets molded back down into that shape.

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This will certainly only be a special occasion hat, and I'd be comfy wearing either optimo or teardrop. The thing I wouldn't be comfortable with is too wide of a brim.

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OH, and I just read Feltfan's request for shots of me in a optimo creased straw. Here are the two that I own, and wear no matter what anyone thinks.

Harvard Club:

Supernatural:

 

[HarpPlayerGene]

Comparing the proportions of the Arcentales raw body to my other straws, it's quite reasonable to assume it could be blocked very similarly to one of these. I'll be furnishing the two photos below to Graham and we'll discuss. I'd be pleased either way.

Barbisio:

Supernatural:

 

[feltfan]

Just my opinion...

Thanks for the shots, HPG.

My impression is that the optimo block looks a bit more
formal. It's just not as flexible a style as the classic
"dented" fedora. As I mentioned earlier, the optimo
form also looks "of an era" and inherently a bit more dated
than the more familiar fedora. To me, as a vintage fan, it's
a great look. But I can understand why it might not work for
someone who isn't as enthused by that old fashioned look.

If I'm to be honest, I have a couple of optimo block panamas
but I rarely wear them. So one question you might ask yourself
is, 'when would I wear this fine hat?'. If the answer is that you
want an every day hat, I'd go with the dented fedora. If this
is going to be a special, dress panama which you might wear
with a linen jacket or seersucker suit or something comparable,
go with the optimo block.

I wonder what others think of of HPG looks with the optimo
block? I wonder what you'd look like with a hat with the
optimo block and a nice jacket.

And HPG, remember, this is the kind of problem you want to have!

PS: where is AlanC when you need him?

 

[jimmy the lid]

Supernatural:

Gene -- I think this Supernatural looks super on you. No kidding -- that's a great look. I will say, though, that what helps to make it an overall great look is the width of the brim in proportion to the Optimo block. There's just a nice sense of balance there. In contrast, while the Harvard Club lid is certainly nice, it has a narrower brim and doesn't achieve that same sense of balance, IMHO. If the new lid came out looking like the Supernatural, I think that would be a great result, Optimo block-wise.

Cheers,
JtL

 

[carouselvic]

I've been away a few days. Great hat Gene. That hat would look great no matter how it was blocked.