A Panama Hat worthy of FDR

[jimmy the lid]

I just had a Brent Black customer solicit me to put up photos of one of Simon Espinal's hats. Not sure what the guy paid and I politely declined. I think he's mad at me now...here was my answer:

> Sorry, when Brent stole my contracts with Simon's
> kids out from under me, I stopped thinking of him as human. No offense to you, but I have no desire to help a
> cretin like that.

What in the world does this have to do with this thread? Enough already!!!

 

[jimmy the lid]

Got an unsolicited email from someone who wants me to post photos on this thread.

Who cares? As I said, it has nothing to do with this thread. I hate this kind of post from you cluttering up discussions of panama hats. Please stop.

 

[Panamabob]

If you haven't noticed, I'm trying to help. Geez, I hate this place anymore.

 

[Lefty]

If you haven't noticed, I'm trying to help. Geez, I hate this place anymore.

Lefty, again, adding greatly to the conversation.

 

[Panamabob]

Lefty, don't you have to shave or something!

 

[Brad Bowers]

Relevance to the thread

His family probably had something to do with this hat.

In other words, the hat we are currently talking about was, probably, woven by a member of the Espinal family. I take it that they are master weavers from a long time back?

Brad

 

[Colby Jack]

That hat is a thing of beauty. Is Sharpetoys still around to put his two cents in?

 

[HarpPlayerGene]

Simmer down, boys. If you folks begin slugging it out and as a result start to shy away from this thread, I'M the loser for it.

Bob, so you're not the smoothest talker I ever met but that doesn't matter to me. I look to you for information about an amazing art form, and you know your stuff. Good 'nuf for me.

I intended from the beginning to draw attention to the name; ARCENTALES. It is stamped into the hat and a "C.A. ARCENTALES" is referenced in the article as the weaver of the FDR hat. I've also read references to a 'Casa de Arcentales" or something similar to that as a source of finely woven Panama hats.

The hats Marc and Sharptoys have share this provenance and seem to date to around the early '20s.

So, would it be fair to deduce that C.A. Arcentales was the weaver and that he probably made this hat in the '20s? If so, what Id like to know is more about him and his operation. If that includes a connection to Simon's family, that is cool and it would make sense judging by the level of expertise.

 

[handlebar bart]

Wow Gene!!!!!!! Congrats. Not sure I could think of anyone more suited to wear that once its blocked. I'm tickled silly for you:eusa_clap

 

[HarpPlayerGene]

Gene,

I counted some 50 in the vertical direction (along the ruler) where the weave is straightforward and around the same in the horizontal counting the zig-zag way.

I don't know how much is it still flexi or already pergamon like...

Tom

On the weave, I got 47 x 52. If I'm doin' the math properly, that's over 2400 weaves per square inch.

On the condition of the straw, I emphasize that it is not brittle. It is flexible. Very supple. Floppy. Bendy. Rollable and unrollable. The reason it has small cracks is the result of someone clumsily collapsing it for rolling. Could have been the seller. Imagine that as fine as the weave is when seen flat compared to a usual, nice Panama hat, this hat is also that much thinner in a cross-section. Therefore, naturally, while surprisingly strong, it isn't designed for abuse. People who do not know, see these things and think they are linen fabric. The person who kinked the hat on one side of the crown didn't know any better than to improperly handle it and stress it beyond it's flexible limits. They had no reason to think 'cloth' which feels this flexible would crack. You know there is a method to inverting one side of the crown into the other and rolling a straw hat so as not to cause this kind of damage. If that method had been used the hat would be mint. It isn't that it is brittle.

I appreciate the input very much - don't get me wrong. I am emphasizing the flexible, supple nature of the straw in this hat because previous posts where I have stated same have been followed by several posts pondering how brittle the straw is that it should have cracked. Just to be clear...

 

[Michaelshane]

"Wow Gene!!!!!!! Congrats. Not sure I could think of anyone more suited to wear that once its blocked. I'm tickled silly for you"
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I could think of someone I'd rather see wearing it......

 

[HarpPlayerGene]

"Wow Gene!!!!!!! Congrats. Not sure I could think of anyone more suited to wear that once its blocked. I'm tickled silly for you"
__________________
I could think of someone I'd rather see wearing it......

:eusa_clap lol

 

[handlebar bart]

"Wow Gene!!!!!!! Congrats. Not sure I could think of anyone more suited to wear that once its blocked. I'm tickled silly for you"
__________________
I could think of someone I'd rather see wearing it......

lol lol I knew it was comin'lol lol

 

[Neil]

Again: I find all of this interesting. Gene's hat (really interesting), others' comments on Gene's hat (mildly interesting), PB's assertion that the Espinal family was involved with Gene's hat (pretty interesting), PB's assertion that Panama hat vendors screw each other over in Ecuador (fairly interesting). Let's let people talk. There's all sorts of bandwidth.

 

[jimmy the lid]

PB's assertion that Panama hat vendors screw each other over in Ecuador (fairly interesting).

No -- it's utterly boring. Not to mention redundant. If PB has an axe to grind, let him do it on his own bandwidth...

But, out of respect to Gene -- this should be about his fabulous lid, which is exactly the point I was making to PB to begin with...

 

[Michaelshane]

On a lighter note...
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Which leads me to my other dilemma: For a hat of this pedigree I, on the one hand, think the classic optimo style is apporpriate. On the other hand I have two other vintage optimo crowned hats and they are routinely judged by women to be unattractive.

[/IMG] Couldn't help myself...[huh] lol

 

[jpbales]

haha I hate to say it, but despite my secret inner desire for an Optimo style panama, it does give off a very "old man" vibe. There's just too many other cooler styles to choose from

On a lighter note...
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Which leads me to my other dilemma: For a hat of this pedigree I, on the one hand, think the classic optimo style is apporpriate. On the other hand I have two other vintage optimo crowned hats and they are routinely judged by women to be unattractive.

[/IMG] Couldn't help myself...[huh] lol

 

[feltfan]

I won't just... aw, okay, I will- that's a great find!
Glad it's in good hands.

HPG, why not post a picture of yourself wearing
an optimo blocked panama and let us see what
all the women are talking about? I happen to know
you have a few such pictures in your photo account.

I am very partial to the optimo block for the very reason
that it looks old fashioned and just a touch awkward.
Like people from that day appear to us today in pictures.

 

[Chinaski]

After reading through this thread, I'm torn between seeing you wearing that probably once-in-a-lifetime panama and doing what you want with it, and the advice of keeping it pure for a collector for possible sale. I'm sure you will weigh Graham's feedback heavily.

A question for the group: What would a collector want? Would he want the hat as is, unblocked, or something else? What could be done to the hat that would be value added?

 

[HarpPlayerGene]

On a lighter note...
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[/IMG] Couldn't help myself...[huh] lol

lol

THAT'S what this Arcentales hat looks like if I put it on now!

(and that dude kinda' looks like me too. spooky.)