A couple of fashion pet peeves...

[Fading Fast]

...Again, dress, groom, act anyway you want - its your prerogative. But it's also my prerogative to not take you seriously.

This ⇧ is missed by many people today, IMHO.

There are two rights at work here and they are not mutually exclusive. You have the right - legally and even morally - to dress the way you want and everyone else has the right to judge you (hopefully, only in part) by how you dress. I'll stand arm in arm with anyone to defend your freedom to dress as you wish, but that doesn't mean others don't have a right to form opinions about you that you might not like based on how you dress.

Freedom cuts both ways. You have the freedom to do what you want - say, dress how you like - but others have the freedom to form their opinions about you based on how you dress.

 

[shadowrider]

As we say over here in my peninsula:

L'abito non fa il monaco

 

[Frunobulax]

As we say over here in my peninsula:

L'abito non fa il monaco

That's great. I'd never heard that before.

 

[crawlinkingsnake]

Curious, what shoes do you recommend wearing with a blue suit?

blue suede shoes!

 

[MondoFW]

blue suede shoes!

Who are you taking me for, some kind of hound dog?

 

[deadlyhandsome]

You asked about pet peeves. While I know it's "high fashion" right now, I cringe every time I see someone wearing brown shoes with a blue or grey suit. Never mind that suits these days look like they've shrunk two sizes before being worn.

I'll go along with the too small overly tight suits anyway. I like well-tailored clothing, but the tight look is not for me. You don't come across as an adult working in an adult job.

As for the brown shoes...I think that is not a trend but a real shift in style. The only reason it looks wrong was because we were told it was wrong and for so long we didn't see it on well-dressed men. Once you get past your conditioning I think most find that the colors compliment each other quite well. The shoe aspect feels outdated and arbitrary; like the no brown in town or tweeds being relegated to county attire only. I'm not one to chase fads, but I'm on board with the brown shoes with gray and navy trousers/suits. Sorry.

 

[deadlyhandsome]

It's interesting how the stubble look has come back again after last being fashionable in the eighties. One of the big dating websites in the UK a whiled back had a series of ads about how people prepared for their dates; one was an unshaven guy saying "I shave three days before a date in order to have the perfect amount of stubble." I only don't shave when I forget.... I missed about three days when Herself was in hospital just after Christmas and thought I looked like an animal when I caught myself in the mirror. Certainly if I don't shaved my head for three days it simply doesn't feel clean.

You should always look neat and well-groomed. The stubble look just appears unkempt to me. Maybe I'm too old or not cool enough? Nah.

 

[deadlyhandsome]

This ⇧ is missed by many people today, IMHO.

There are two rights at work here and they are not mutually exclusive. You have the right - legally and even morally - to dress the way you want and everyone else has the right to judge you (hopefully, only in part) by how you dress. I'll stand arm in arm with anyone to defend your freedom to dress as you wish, but that doesn't mean others don't have a right to form opinions about you that you might not like based on how you dress.

Freedom cuts both ways. You have the freedom to do what you want - say, dress how you like - but others have the freedom to form their opinions about you based on how you dress.

Yep. When I decided to change jobs and move up in my post college days I cut my hair that was long; several years worth of length. I did it because I wanted to give the right impression. Like it or not, people make snap judgments about you and long hair, tattoos, piercings, etc. might hold you back. You can rail against this or you can accept that right or wrong it is the way if the world and play the game and get the rewards. Some call it selling out, I call it growing up.

 

[deadlyhandsome]

blue suede shoes!

+1

 

[ChazfromCali]

1) Shorts in the winter. It was 20 degrees yesterday and I saw no less than three guys out in shorts. I don't care how much of a mountain man you are, you look silly. Put on some long pants.
2) This untucked shirt thing. Don't get me wrong, I wear mine untucked at times, but a shirt tail hanging out from under a sweater or vest just looks sloppy and dumb. Tuck it in.

Anyone else?

Shorts in winter. Are you perhaps in Oregon? That's "a thing" here. I almost rolled down my window a few days ago at a red light and shouted at a 20-something guy to "put on some pants." I suppressed the urge.

 

[deadlyhandsome]

Well said

It seems that we coddle young adults anymore and don't make them conform to society's standards. I won't let my HR department hire people with visible tattoos because some customers don't want to do business with people who are all inked up. I'm in the business of making money, not changing opinions. I have no problem playing to such prejudices. Those matters are choices and they do speak something about the individual. What I never do is play to prejudices regarding who people just are. Your innate qualities and differences are not negotiable. Hiwecer, your decision to put 50 piercings in your eyebrow is a decision and it will cost you.

 

[deadlyhandsome]

Personally, I have issues with someone who is 60 dressing the same as someone who is 20. Dignity and decorum are passé. I despise the worship of youth and the aspiration of avoiding aging. It's going to happen, but it with some grace.

 

[Fading Fast]

Yep. When I decided to change jobs and move up in my post college days I cut my hair that was long; several years worth of length. I did it because I wanted to give the right impression. Like it or not, people make snap judgments about you and long hair, tattoos, piercings, etc. might hold you back. You can rail against this or you can accept that right or wrong it is the way if the world and play the game and get the rewards. Some call it selling out, I call it growing up.

Another variation on the theme is that hiring people is hard as you have limited information yet it is a very important decision for both the company and the individual. For selfish reason, no one wants to hire a person who won't work out for the company's needs and nobody of good will wants to hire a person - and disrupt their lives - if the company isn't a good fit for that person. Hence, one tries to take everything into account.

For example, even though I'm in finance, I have friends in tech who tell me they would shy away from hiring someone who showed up to interview in a suit and tie as their "culture" is more laid back and informal. It's not that they are being prejudice against suits, but are trying to find a good fit for both the company and person. On Wall Street, the "norm" is to interview in a suit and tie, so hiring managers there shy away from hiring people who show up in jeans and an open collared shirt - an outfit that would fit in perfectly for my friend who works in tech.

So as an individual interviewing, you have a decision to make - how many signals do you want to send to a company that you will be a fit? If you are unwilling to wear a suit as "that's not you -" then you will probably have a hard time finding a job in many finance companies. Is that wrong - maybe in some cosmic / academic sense - but in the not-perfect real world, hiring mangers and interviewees are just trying to find the best fit for all based on limited and incomplete information of which attire is one piece of that information.

 

[Edward]

For example, even though I'm in finance, I have friends in tech who tell me they would shy away from hiring someone who showed up to interview in a suit and tie as their "culture" is more laid back and informal. It's not that they are being prejudice against suits, but are trying to find a good fit for both the company and person. On Wall Street, the "norm" is to interview in a suit and tie, so hiring managers there shy away from hiring people who show up in jeans and an open collared shirt - an outfit that would fit in perfectly for my friend who works in tech.

It's amazing how many people don't take the time and effort to find out what the norm or expectation is in any given environment before they interview.

The tech industry is interesting, though, in that it has such a Sixties counter-culture attitude even now to norms. My brother is a programmer; in a previous company for which he worked, a new guy turned up in s collar and tie for the full first week he worked there after being hired, and was openly laughed at until he buckled to peer pressure and turned up in a t-shirt and jeans. It's amazing how powerful and persistent peer norms can be in so many workplaces.

 

[OldStrummer]

I took a new tech job in 2001. The first day on the job I wore a navy suit, white shirt, red tie. I got some strange looks. The second day on the job I wore a camel hair sport coat, shirt and tie. The president of the company saw me (it was a small company) and told me that if I came to work the next day wearing a tie, he was going to cut it off.

 

[Edward]

I took a new tech job in 2001. The first day on the job I wore a navy suit, white shirt, red tie. I got some strange looks. The second day on the job I wore a camel hair sport coat, shirt and tie. The president of the company saw me (it was a small company) and told me that if I came to work the next day wearing a tie, he was going to cut it off.

Yes, the old "I'm not going to dress how THE MAN wants!" seems to be strong in that industry. The amusing thing is that for all they consider themselves rebellious, the guy in the tie is way more so by now than they'll ever be.

 

[deadlyhandsome]

Another variation on the theme is that hiring people is hard as you have limited information yet it is a very important decision for both the company and the individual. For selfish reason, no one wants to hire a person who won't work out for the company's needs and nobody of good will wants to hire a person - and disrupt their lives - if the company isn't a good fit for that person. Hence, one tries to take everything into account.

For example, even though I'm in finance, I have friends in tech who tell me they would shy away from hiring someone who showed up to interview in a suit and tie as their "culture" is more laid back and informal. It's not that they are being prejudice against suits, but are trying to find a good fit for both the company and person. On Wall Street, the "norm" is to interview in a suit and tie, so hiring managers there shy away from hiring people who show up in jeans and an open collared shirt - an outfit that would fit in perfectly for my friend who works in tech.

So as an individual interviewing, you have a decision to make - how many signals do you want to send to a company that you will be a fit? If you are unwilling to wear a suit as "that's not you -" then you will probably have a hard time finding a job in many finance companies. Is that wrong - maybe in some cosmic / academic sense - but in the not-perfect real world, hiring mangers and interviewees are just trying to find the best fit for all based on limited and incomplete information of which attire is one piece of that information.

All I'll add is that for jobs where suits are not the norm it is nice to dress just a little better than what the current employees are wearing when you apply/interview. If hiring for sales were the employees mostly wear polo shirts and jeans then an applicant wearing chinos and a bottom down oxford shirt makes just the right statement. Wearing a suit, or even a tie, to such an interview isn't a good idea. Also best not to dress better than the boss.

 

[MondoFW]

All I'll add is that for jobs where suits are not the norm it is nice to dress just a little better than what the current employees are wearing when you apply/interview. If hiring for sales were the employees mostly wear polo shirts and jeans then an applicant wearing chinos and a bottom down oxford shirt makes just the right statement. Wearing a suit, or even a tie, to such an interview isn't a good idea. Also best not to dress better than the boss.

I'll have to remember this. I've spoken to family friends that are in the tech industry, and they've all said that business attire is a very ostracized practice, and that employees usually just show up in t-shirt and jeans. What's with giving the guy who puts in a little more effort crap?

 

[Canadian]

I work in a place where most staff do not wear ties or dress up at all. My co-worker, two feet away (we share an office) wears a tie on a regular basis, but with jeans. Today he's wearing jeans, a white OCBD and a black V-neck sweater.

Around here, most people who work in the warehouse wear sweatpants or jeans and a tee or polo shirt. We have men who come in, put on a shirt and take it off at the end of their shift.

People here who work in the office, in sales or administration, as mentioned do not wear ties. However, for a special day (eg a big customer comes in) a suit or necktie is not at all odd. I started this job over fifteen years ago and was wearing white coveralls with a bow tie. I used to get asked, "Are you delivering milk at a wedding?". When my job title changed, I started wearing a coat and tie and eventually an overcoat too.

Tech? My little brother owns a tech firm and he never wears a tie, unless going out for dinner or drinks. He didn't wear anything but a waistcoat and tie to his own wedding. I had offered to buy him a dinner jacket as a gift for the wedding, and he told me he could dress himself. I suspect when you own your own company, you set the rules and that tends to expand into what you do with your off hours.

C.

 

[shadowrider]

I few years ago I went to the bank where I recently got an account at and they sent me to speak with one of their employees . He was wearing a big loose dark green polo shirt (didn't see the bottoms as he was sitting down) with the buttons all undone and looked like he just got done mowing his lawn.
Regardless of what we spoke about (which I don't even remember), I distinctly recall that his shaggy attire alone did not leave me a good impression on the bank at all.