1943 vs. 1776

[AmateisGal]

While reading the September 1943 edition of Ladies Home Journal last night, there was an advertisement with the following quote from South Carolina statesman James F. Byrnes:

"We ought to conduct ourselves so that future generations will speak of the men and women of 1943 as we speak of the men and women of 1776."

Now I don't know anything about Byrnes politics so I'm not factoring that in, but rather looking at the generation as a whole: did they succeed in this? Do we think of them in the same terms as we do the men and women of 1776?

 

[LizzieMaine]

I think it's too early still -- many of us here are the daughters and sons, or grandchildren, of the generation of 1943, and it's very difficult for us to step away from the actual people we knew and consider them as Historical Figures -- there's a tendency to both build them up, because we loved them, or to ruthlessly tear them down because we're so much more "advanced" than they were, depending on our own personal points of view.

I don't think a truly "historical" perspective will be possible until not only that generation has died off, but also all of us who overlapped with them. That's, what, another hundred years down the line -- look how long it took to view the Civil War generation in any kind of perspective, and one could argue we still haven't reached that point with them.

 

[dhermann1]

Interesting quote. Jimmy Byrnes was in the House and the Senate, was appointed to the Supreme Court by FDR, and later served as Secretary of State, under Truman. The quote definitely echoes Churchill's famous words
"Let us therefore brace ourselves to our duties, and so bear ourselves, that if the British Empire and its Commonwealth last for a thousand years, men will still say, This was their finest hour."
The comparison with 1776 is a difficult one to make. I think the country in 1943 was a great deal more unanimous in its feelings about the war then raging, than during the Revolution. There was probably never a majority for independence during the whole conflict. But those who were for independence, certainly comported themselves heroically.

 

[Undertow]

That is an interesting quote. I wonder if we at the Lounge apply this sort of notion to ourselves? I think so, to some degree.

 

[Edward]

"Let us therefore brace ourselves to our duties, and so bear ourselves, that if the British Empire and its Commonwealth last for a thousand years, men will still say, This was their finest hour."

Interesting that he put the "thousand years" term on it... I wonder was this a deliberate reference to Hitler's speeches about the "Thousand Year Reich"? At this distance it seems ironic that the British Empire didn't last much more than a few years after the War.

 

[Dewhurst]

Do we think of them in the same terms as we do the men and women of 1776?

At this point in time, I certainly do not. I don't know what others think, but the folks of 1943 probably do not have that mythological sheen that the folks of 1776 seem to possess (whether deserved or not). As pointed out by others, we probably do not have enough space within time from them.

It is also possible that future generations never will think of them as similar. Often times, it is interesting how bridges are elongated with time, rather than shortened, through inquiry.

 

[AmateisGal]

I think we have already mythologized the WW2 generation by attaching the "Great Generation" description to them. And, I think they've earned this moniker to some degree.

However, I also agree that not enough time has passed for us to adequately answer this question. But I'm enjoying the responses so far.

 

[Feraud]

I think it's too early still -- many of us here are the daughters and sons, or grandchildren, of the generation of 1943, and it's very difficult for us to step away from the actual people we knew and consider them as Historical Figures -- there's a tendency to both build them up, because we loved them, or to ruthlessly tear them down because we're so much more "advanced" than they were, depending on our own personal points of view.

I don't think a truly "historical" perspective will be possible until not only that generation has died off, but also all of us who overlapped with them. That's, what, another hundred years down the line -- look how long it took to view the Civil War generation in any kind of perspective, and one could argue we still haven't reached that point with them.

Agree. The writer who appreciates the era will excuse the faults while the one who doesn't will see nothing but. It take an exceptional degree of objective research and writing skill to produce a balanced historical perspective to be judged within the morals of the particular time period. Well written history is a tough job.

 

[Richard Warren]

This could be taken a lot of ways. A call to greatness? A call to revolutionary violence? Or just overblown rhetoric?

 

[AmateisGal]

I see it as a call to greatness.

 

[vintage68]

I believe that yes, they did answer the call. They stood up and did what was required of them at the time it was required, whether it was going off to fight a war overseas or on the home front by supporting the war.

 

[LizzieMaine]

From the people I've known and grew up around, there was much less of the "Great Crusade" stuff among the common people than you heard from the generals and statesmen. The Joe Punchclocks and the Sally Dishrags of 1943 didn't view the war as much as a righteous crusade as they did a dirty, rotten filthy job that had to be done. And they did it. The Great Crusade stuff came later.

I think that's how they'd want to be remembered -- a generation who did its duty and finished the job they had to do.

 

[Story]

The further we get from 1776, the more inclined certain ignorants are inclined to demonize that generation.

 

[Tiller]

I don't think so. I have a lot of respect for the Greatest Generation, and I don't think they get the credit they deserve most times (especially in light of the baby boomers idealizing their youth), but I don't see them at the same level of 1776's generation.

Plenty of things alter how we see the founders (sorry for those of you not blessed to be born in America , jk of course you know I like you all ), for starters they made sure that history was told from their perspective. Everything that they wrote, and saved they knew that future generations would be reading. The stories from the Revolutionary Age are just unbelievable at times (the ride of Caesar Rodney for example) for seconds. Finally, they created a governmental system that grew to become the strongest on Earth for a time.

It's a good goal, to try to live up to the giants of the past, but I don't think any Generation has really lived up to the 1776 generation in America at least. I don't see my generation doing much better then their parent's or grandparents either though lol.

 

[Dewhurst]

From the people I've known and grew up around, there was much less of the "Great Crusade" stuff among the common people than you heard from the generals and statesmen.

This should be kept in the front of our minds.

AmateisGal, speaking of the Ladies Home Journal. I just read Roald Dahl's short story Only This from the September 1944 issue of the LHJ. Only a year removed.

 

[Chas]

It's a good goal, to try to live up to the giants of the past, but I don't think any Generation has really lived up to the 1776 generation in America at least. I don't see my generation doing much better then their parent's or grandparents either though lol.

I disagree. What about the generation of 1860? They put as much on the line as any generation; maybe more, perhaps. Being asked to fight and kill fellow Americans. Yikes...

I think that every generation had and has its heroes, goldbrickers and ne'er-do-wells.

Remember, the 1920's crowd were pretty decadent, then had a cold dose of "1929" thrown in their faces and were forced to cope. If you want to talk about character building events, I can't think of a better one.

Call me one crazy optimist, but there's nothing written in stone that says this generation can't rise to it if asked. Their task could be around the corner.

 

[Richard Warren]

Winning WWII involved individual sacrifice and courage of a sort I cannot really fully even comprehend.

But then all wars do. As an historical event, the greatness of the feat is not so clear, at least from an American perspective.