You know you are getting old when:

[2jakes]

Bob...
You got a minute?

There’s two tunes played in this 1928 toon by Max & Dave Fleischer.
Koko’s Earth Control.
Originally released as silent.

Two songs were added later. The first is “Dancing Shadows”
by Paul Whiteman.

The second tune begins at 3:14 point. Sounds like a twin
piano team Arden and Ohman, but I do not know for sure.

With your vast knowledge of music, can you
help?
Thanks.

 

[scottyrocks]

You know you're getting old when all those pop groups that your parents didn't care for can be found in the easy listening section of the record store. . .

You know you're getting old when you remember record stores.

 

[Trenchfriend]

When you remember Compact Discs.

 

[BlueTrain]

When you remember when vinyl wasn't vinyl and was played at 78 rpm.

 

[scottyrocks]

A couple of my old record players had a 16 rpm speed. Did anyone here have any records made for that speed? I didn't.

 

[BlueTrain]

Neither did I. But I knew a couple of people who had an old Victrola with a small collection of records. I remember one recording in particular: Tiptoe through the tulips. It wasn't the Tiny Tim version, either.

One of the critical points of technology for the old Victrola, and which was still true decades later, was the needle. For some reason both of those Victrola's had dozens of needles in little hollowed out places in the cabinet. I always thought that vinyl records were relatively delicate even when I was still buying them not that long ago. They wouldn't break (not easily, anyway) but could become scratched and cause the record to skip. But they weren't bad.

I don't know how old the Victrola's were (they were in cabinets) but they were old. I've never seen a cylinder-type record player.

 

[vitanola]

Bob...
You got a minute?

There’s two tunes played in this 1928 toon by Max & Dave Fleischer.
Koko’s Earth Control.
Originally released as silent.

Two songs were added later. The first is “Dancing Shadows”
by Paul Whiteman.

The second tune begins at 3:14 point. Sounds like a twin
piano team Arden and Ohman, but I do not know for sure.

With your vast knowledge of music, can you
help?
Thanks.

I have been trying to fig

Bob...
You got a minute?

There’s two tunes played in this 1928 toon by Max & Dave Fleischer.
Koko’s Earth Control.
Originally released as silent.

Two songs were added later. The first is “Dancing Shadows”
by Paul Whiteman.

The second tune begins at 3:14 point. Sounds like a twin
piano team Arden and Ohman, but I do not know for sure.

With your vast knowledge of music, can you
help?
Thanks.

I have been trying to determine the identity of that recording for thirty-five years, now.

 

[vitanola]

A couple of my old record players had a 16 rpm speed. Did anyone here have any records made for that speed? I didn't.

16 2/3 RPM records were initially designed in the 1930's as a "Talking Book" format for this blind, In the 1950's, Seeburg manufactured 10" diameter large center hole records for it's automatic background music system. In the late 1950's a 7" version was sold commercially for use in automobile record players as part of the Chrysler Corporation's "Highway Hi-Fi" system.

 

[vitanola]

Neither did I. But I knew a couple of people who had an old Victrola with a small collection of records. I remember one recording in particular: Tiptoe through the tulips. It wasn't the Tiny Tim version, either.

One of the critical points of technology for the old Victrola, and which was still true decades later, was the needle. For some reason both of those Victrola's had dozens of needles in little hollowed out places in the cabinet. I always thought that vinyl records were relatively delicate even when I was still buying them not that long ago. They wouldn't break (not easily, anyway) but could become scratched and cause the record to skip. But they weren't bad.

I don't know how old the Victrola's were (they were in cabinets) but they were old. I've never seen a cylinder-type record player.

The steel needles were intended to be replaced after every disc, for theY were worn by the abrasive in the records. It was considered better that the needle wear, rather than the record. Cylinder phonographs (along with the Edison and Paths disc machines) used permanent styli made of sapphire or diamond, and so there were no needles to change with these formats.

 

[BlueTrain]

That's interesting. I never would have guess it. The two and only Victrola's that I remember seeing were probably no longer used. One was owned by my stepmother and I know that I was the only one who ever tinkered with it.

I remember seeing an old TV mystery, probably from sometime in the 1950s, or at least set in the 1950s, that involved a curious jukebox system. In that particular system, there was no jukebox per se but instead, just a speaker in the establishment that subscribed to the system. There was a live DJ somewhere else in town that would play a given recording when it was requested by someone at the place with the speaker, presumably for money (don't remember many details). It may have been an Ellery Queen mystery TV show. Anyway, if there was such a system, it didn't last.

 

[LizzieMaine]

Those were basically "cable radio" systems where the system was a speaker and amplifier unit with no actual radio receiver circuitry, connected to a central broadcast point by high quality telephone wires. The "Muzak" service operated originally with this type of system before switching in the 1950s to a wireless FM subcarrier system.

Wired radio never really caught on as a home service in the US, but it was very popular in the Soviet Union, where the vastness of the territory made localized broadcasting impractical. The speaker boxes had a two-prong plug on the back that fitted into sockets installed right alongside the house wiring, so that the user could unplug the speaker from one room and carry it to any room they wanted, and by the 1960s multiple channels of programming were offered, selectable by the push of a button. Wired radio of this type remains common in Russia right up to the present day.

As for cylinder records, the Edison company kept that technology available right up to the bitter end -- you could still get Blue Amberol cylinders, dubbed from selected disc record releases, right up until Edison closed down its recording division in 1929. And the basic system remained available to business users as the Ediphone dictating machine into the 1950s.

 

[Fading Fast]

⇧ I'm a bit confused (always, but a bit more right now). The system that BlueTrain mentioned sounds as if you could request a specific song anytime you wanted - which would be, I guess, the wired radio world equivalent of "on-demand." But what Lizzie seems to be talking about is "regular" radio signal / programing delivered to the "radio" box by a cable like cable TV (no through the air signal).

Are there / were there two separate systems as I just described? If so, the "BlueTrain" one sounds quite complicated and interactive for the time.

 

[LizzieMaine]

The "programmed" type was a variation of the "relayed" type -- it used the same technology, just a different type of programming. These types of hosted cable-radio jukebox arrangements were a very brief fad in major cities just after the war, but they didn't last long exactly because they were so cumbersome, and perhaps also because they horned in on the mob's control of the traditional jukebox business. But they did make enough of an impression to become the focus of a storyline in "Dick Tracy" around 1946 or 1947, in which the system was being used as a clandestine communications relay by a crime ring.

 

[2jakes]

16 2/3 RPM records were initially designed in the 1930's as a "Talking Book" format for this blind, In the 1950's, Seeburg manufactured 10" diameter large center hole records for it's automatic background music system. In the late 1950's a 7" version was sold commercially for use in automobile record players as part of the Chrysler Corporation's "Highway Hi-Fi" system.

"Highway Hi-Fi" system, now that rings
a bell when I visited my grandfolks in
the '50s.

 

[Fading Fast]

The "programmed" type was a variation of the "relayed" type -- it used the same technology, just a different type of programming. These types of hosted cable-radio jukebox arrangements were a very brief fad in major cities just after the war, but they didn't last long exactly because they were so cumbersome, and perhaps also because they horned in on the mob's control of the traditional jukebox business. But they did make enough of an impression to become the focus of a storyline in "Dick Tracy" around 1946 or 1947, in which the system was being used as a clandestine communications relay by a crime ring.

Thank you and now for a follow up question. It really made more sense to wire the USSR for radio than use some sort of combination of broadcast relay / trunk lines / etc. that then delivered the "last mile" over the air? This is a honest statement: I assume the USSR didn't want to waste resources and definitely wanted a way to deliver its message nationally, so I'd bet it made the right choice for the facts and circumstances it faced. I am just amazed that wiring that huge country and bringing that wire to each apartment / house made sense.

 

[LizzieMaine]

I suspect the real savings came on the resource end -- it was easier and simpler and more efficient to manufacture a plug-in speaker-amplifier unit than to focus the resources available on building a similar number of radio receivers. The concept was to ensure that every citizen had at least a base-level access to news, entertainment, and cultural programming -- regular radios were available for purchase, some of them of very high quality, but on a much more limited scale than in the West. But when the wired-radio system is factored in a greater percentage of Soviet citizens in the 1930s had access to radio programming than was the case even in the US, where in parts of the Deep South less than half of homes had radios even as late as 1940.

 

[Fading Fast]

I suspect the real savings came on the resource end -- it was easier and simpler and more efficient to manufacture a plug-in speaker-amplifier unit than to focus the resources available on building a similar number of radio receivers. The concept was to ensure that every citizen had at least a base-level access to news, entertainment, and cultural programming -- regular radios were available for purchase, some of them of very high quality, but on a much more limited scale than in the West. But when the wired-radio system is factored in a greater percentage of Soviet citizens in the 1930s had access to radio programming than was the case even in the US, where in parts of the Deep South less than half of homes had radios even as late as 1940.

Neat - thank you.

 

[Trenchfriend]

I'm watching lovely "Alien" at the moment, on my 51" CRT-TV from 2000, played from my 2005s Philips DVP520 DVD-Player, on my TV-roll-fronted cabinet from 2001.

Oh Lord...

 

[BlueTrain]

I think I found what I was referring to, although I'm still not sure what TV show I saw it in. I think it was called a telephone operator jukebox. I even saw a picture of one, lovingly restored. The basic idea was that the machine, which was still called a jukebox, was connected to a central station that perhaps had a many as fifty jukeboxes on it's circuit. The reason to be was that a larger selection could be offered, and possibly give the customer a chance to speak to a young woman, always a draw. The earlier jukeboxes had only a limited selection but the number of selections available on a regular box increased with newer models. I have no idea how the little details were worked out, such as, did the central record player station (to coin a term) have fifty turntables? But the advertising said the selections were unlimited--but it also said what to do if the line were busy. So I guess they were being realistic.

The Silver Diner restaurants in the Washington, D.C., area have the regular jukeboxes but I don't recall seeing them anywhere else in (my) living memory. Those are somewhat larger diners and if you actually play a number, it might be several selections before your own selection gets played. The machines themselves (not so much the counter "terminals") are as impressive as ever.

I also discovered that the name "Rock-Ola" was a man's last name: David C. Rockola. During the war they made carbines for the army.

 

[EngProf]

I think I found what I was referring to, although I'm still not sure what TV show I saw it in. I think it was called a telephone operator jukebox. I even saw a picture of one, lovingly restored. The basic idea was that the machine, which was still called a jukebox, was connected to a central station that perhaps had a many as fifty jukeboxes on it's circuit. The reason to be was that a larger selection could be offered, and possibly give the customer a chance to speak to a young woman, always a draw. The earlier jukeboxes had only a limited selection but the number of selections available on a regular box increased with newer models. I have no idea how the little details were worked out, such as, did the central record player station (to coin a term) have fifty turntables? But the advertising said the selections were unlimited--but it also said what to do if the line were busy. So I guess they were being realistic.

The Silver Diner restaurants in the Washington, D.C., area have the regular jukeboxes but I don't recall seeing them anywhere else in (my) living memory. Those are somewhat larger diners and if you actually play a number, it might be several selections before your own selection gets played. The machines themselves (not so much the counter "terminals") are as impressive as ever.

I also discovered that the name "Rock-Ola" was a man's last name: David C. Rockola. During the war they made carbines for the army.

I saw that show, also, and I think it was a movie (shown on TV), not a regular TV show in the mode of "Dragnet" or "The Untouchables".
The problem is that I can't remember the name of the movie or who was in it.
I believe the plot involved the Mob and criminality involving jukeboxes, as LizzieM mentioned. Maybe it was "Dick Tracy", but my very vague memories indicate that it was a higher-budget production than the DT series.