wiring mens hat brims

[EstherWeis]

I agree Esther. It's good to be well versed in the traditional ways of hatmaking and millinery but also important to be flexible and develop your own methods. That's what makes us all different in our craft. Then each hat you make has your own signature

Could not agree more!

 

[Rogera]

Agree - the only men's hats I've ever seen with wire in the brim are the $10 straws (well paper really) they sell to the tourists in the Stockyards.

And cheap woolie outbacks.

 

[LuvMyMan]

I like to wire my brims.
Is it because I'm a trained woman's hatter...

I have seen one too many wonky brims and I get a lot of questions to wire them just so that they keep their shape.
Especially commercial made ones.

I personally like the way it looks, and it really gives nice support and strength.

Most of my customers ask for them as well...

The lovely hat that Esther made for my Husband is super nice and has her "brim treatment" with what ever wire or special stitching she does. The brim stays nice and flat in the front, as how my Husband loves to wear all his Fedora hats, without having to iron it all the time or add a bunch of sticky stiffener spray. You would not notice by looking that the hat anything out of the ordinary about the brim, other than it has a "crisp" nice look to it, so I for one think it works fantastic and wish all the Fedora hats we have here, would have the same brim edge trim and treatment on them that Esther has done on our hat from her. The only other fedora here that stays as nice and flat is a custom made fedora from a beaver felt that would normally be used for a thick western hat and is stiff as plywood, but has a fantastic smooth and soft finish on the surface.

So that is my review on this topic. We have had maybe 300 hats or more come and go in the past six or seven years. Almost all nice near new or new level never worn Vintage and then a few custom made from hatters. Everything from Borso's to Stetsons, to Lees, Champs, Resistols, Dunlap, Churchill, Akubra, American Hat Co, Tumwater, Black Sheep, Esther , Knox, Mallory, and a few off the wall vintage I cannot even recall, some real rare birds....I fully think if anyone has had an Esther made hat with the way she does her brims, will like it immediately if you like your brim to stay shaped the way you want it to stay. It does not feel like some coat hanger wire or anything so drastic either. Just a nice brim. That is our two cents on it.

 

[TheDane]

The brim stays nice and flat in the front, as how my Husband loves to wear all his Fedora hats, without having to iron it all the time or add a bunch of sticky stiffener spray.

Maybe this is the reason why we don't agree on the subject

I like a flanged snap brim - not a flat one. I would never iron a brim without a flange underneath it. If by some reason necessary, i will flange the brim after ironing it flat. Furthermore it's very rare my brims need a round on the flange. I haven't had the need for stiffening any of my felt brims either.

Preferences are different, and I prefer soft felt hats with as little stiffener as possible and with curved, flanged brims.

I don't like wired brims - I have no use for them

 

[Joao Encarnado]

I like flat stiff brims. No wire needed.

 

[Frunobulax]

I guess with a wired hat brim, you could increase your reception.

I'll get Lem and Phil on designing a "smart hat" that's wi-fi capable.

 

[DJH]

WiFi enabled hats that connect to the Internet of Things could bring hat wearing back into the mainstream.
Probably Deckard's new project, now he's not at Hatco - I wonder if I'll be able to upgrade mine to the new spec?

 

[RJR]

WiFi enabled hats that connect to the Internet of Things could bring hat wearing back into the mainstream.
Probably Deckard's new project, now he's not at Hatco - I wonder if I'll be able to upgrade mine to the new spec?

 

[Frunobulax]

WiFi enabled hats that connect to the Internet of Things could bring hat wearing back into the mainstream.
Probably Deckard's new project, now he's not at Hatco - I wonder if I'll be able to upgrade mine to the new spec?

Of course not! You gotta buy a whole new hat.
And a monthly service plan
And hat apps
Then your hat crashes every time they upgrade the software

 

[mayserwegener]

I have seen wire used with old Stiff Felt and Silk Top Hat brims. Also have come across some Mayser Parabuntal Straws with wire reinforced brim edges.

 

[jimmytbk]

thanks heaps everyone you guys rule, my next question is about setting them on fire to finish em, do u guys do that??

 

[TheDane]

thanks heaps everyone you guys rule, my next question is about setting them on fire to finish em, do u guys do that??

Small hairs are often dragged to the surface, as you sand/pounce the hat. These hairs can be burned away in different ways.

One way is to mist the hat very(!) lightly with denatured alcohol in a spray bottle. Then you ignite the fumes, holding a cloth or towel ready for beating out the flames.

Another is to "fan" the hat with a soft flame from a (kitchen) blowtorch like the ones used for crème brûlée. In my eyes this is the safest way. The spray bottle will not be mistaken for one with water - and there are no burning alcohol, that can be hard to put out. Others may tell you otherwise, though

 

[TheDane]

Could not agree more!

Esther, I'm a little curious as how and when you mount the wire. Do you in any way secure the ends of the wire to each other? Is it mounted before or after the flanging? If before, how do you then accommodate for the smaller brim circumference after the flanging?

 

[jimmytbk]

Small hairs are often dragged to the surface, as you sand/pounce the hat. These hairs can be burned away in different ways.

One way is to mist the hat very(!) lightly with denatured alcohol in a spray bottle. Then you ignite the fumes, holding a cloth or towel ready for beating out the flames.

Another is to "fan" the hat with a soft flame from a (kitchen) blowtorch like the ones used for crème brûlée. In my eyes this is the safest way. The spray bottle will not be mistaken for one with water - and there are no burning alcohol, that can be hard to put out. Others may tell you otherwise, though

 

[jimmytbk]

thank yo so much , and after that do u need to do anything else??

 

[TheDane]

If you have tiny dark spots from the burnt off hairs on a light hat, you can gently erase them with a fine emery-paper, -pad or -block. Also a special "greasing" and brushing usually follows.

You should find a copy of Henry L. Ermatinger's book "Scientific Hat Finishing and Renovating" on the web. It's a "must" among Loungers, and it's free - "in public domain"

 

[EstherWeis]

Esther, I'm a little curious as how and when you mount the wire. Do you in any way secure the ends of the wire to each other? Is it mounted before or after the flanging? If before, how do you then accommodate for the smaller brim circumference after the flanging?

Well, it all depends on how I'm finishing the hat.
But with a bound brim I flange, look if I'm content with the shape. If so I trim to required length if needed.
I actually have my thread pulled to a special diameter. The ones on the market are often to thick.
Then I measure the length, cut my wire, attach them together.
You have to attach your wire, if not it will cut through your ribbon.
There needs to be a certain tension, or it will just bend out of shape and poke out on one side.
You don't add any strength that way either.
It's just like soldering the seam of a ring, a certain tension in the metal is needed to create a flawless invisible seam.

 

[TheDane]

Well, it all depends on how I'm finishing the hat.

Thank you, Esther. The post flanging wiring makes really good sense

I've seen wiring done in this video where Stig, owner of CPH-located Andersen & Berner, is making a cap-fedora crossover. I have also visited the small factory and seen it done, but that was on a "special" hat.

He makes only few fedoras, and not really in the Lounge-league. He makes mostly fashion, ceremonial and ladies hats and hats for theater, movies and showbiz. Some of those - his juggling hats - are renowned all over the World. Like most others of their kind, they are made up from three sandwiched bodies. He has developed his own special technique, where simultaneously blocking of all three bodies is only a part, that is said to make the hats extremely well balanced and stable.

It's been an interesting experience for this old, prejudice "fedora snob" to talk hats with Stig. There are people out there, who are deeply concerned with quite different details about their hats, than any of we are. Some of them even base their living on those details! In that context, considerations on "finish", "hand" or "Petersham vs. Edge Woven" seem so ... out of context. It's been an interesting lesson to see the dedication and long experience of a skilled hatter go into details, I never understood could be appreciated

Anyway, that doesn't mean I don't reserve the rights to remain a prejudice and stubborn old fool ... I still prefer to go wireless

 

[LuvMyMan]

Thank you, Esther. The post flanging wiring makes really good sense

I've seen wiring done in this video where Stig, owner of CPH-located Andersen & Berner, is making a cap-fedora crossover. I have also visited the small factory and seen it done, but that was on a "special" hat.

He makes only few fedoras, and not really in the Lounge-league. He makes mostly fashion, ceremonial and ladies hats and hats for theater, movies and showbiz. Some of those - his juggling hats - are renowned all over the World. Like most others of their kind, they are made up from three sandwiched bodies. He has developed his own special technique, where simultaneously blocking of all three bodies is only a part, that is said to make the hats extremely well balanced and stable.

It's been an interesting experience for this old, prejudice "fedora snob" to talk hats with Stig. There are people out there, who are deeply concerned with quite different details about their hats, than any of we are. Some of them even base their living on those details! In that context, considerations on "finish", "hand" or "Petersham vs. Edge Woven" seem so ... out of context. It's been an interesting lesson to see the dedication and long experience of a skilled hatter go into details, I never understood could be appreciated

Anyway, that doesn't mean I don't reserve the rights to remain a prejudice and stubborn old fool ... I still prefer to go wireless

Depending on the hat, and how it is made and "look" , some hats do not need anything at all to help keep their overall shape. I have a vintage Mallory, from the 1940's it would remind you of a Stetson Stratoliner. Very smooth, very lightweight, and not very much stiffener. It stays fairly much how I have the brim shaped, and of course keeps it's bash very well. Several other vintage hats my Husband owns are the very same way. But a few just seem to be a bit too floppy. As you say it it a preference issue. But for the look we wanted to have (semi formal) with the hat Esther made it was very nice to have her do the brim the way she did. The felt is fairly lightweight, and I think maybe without the wire some additional stiffener would have been needed to be applied. With the wire, no need for all that sticky stiffener!

 

[TheDane]

But a few just seem to be a bit too floppy. As you say it it a preference issue. But for the look we wanted to have (semi formal) ...

I believe a lot happened as hats went from "necessity" to "accessory". If you watch old footage and imagery from the 20s - 40s, you will see a lot of floppy brims and very "organic" (some would say "sloppy") creases and pinches on very formal persons in very formal situations. Pretty much like the creasing, Moon shows in his bashing-vids.

What was good enough for the Roosevelts is good enough for me