Why were the 70s such a tacky decade?

[Zombie_61]

...As I've often said, when the day comes that nobody wants to be a plumber, we'll be a nation of PhD's up to their shinbones in sh**. And it'll serve us right.

I think the so-called education system here in the U.S. is partially to blame for this. Even back in the mid- to late-1970s when I was going through high school we were constantly being beaten over the head with the notion that we had to go to college and earn a degree or we would never be able to get a "decent" job. I know quite a few people who bought into this notion, went to college, got their precious degree, and still couldn't get a "decent" job.

...The only real path to freedom lies in not wanting the carrot at all.

"Excessive desires will madden the mind. Excessive possessions preoccupy the mind with fear. The more you desire, the more you’ll be discontented from what you have."
Lao Tzu

 

[V.C. Brunswick]

I think the so-called education system here in the U.S. is partially to blame for this. Even back in the mid- to late-1970s when I was going through high school we were constantly being beaten over the head with the notion that we had to go to college and earn a degree or we would never be able to get a "decent" job. I know quite a few people who bought into this notion, went to college, got their precious degree, and still couldn't get a "decent" job.

Mama, don't let your babies grow up to be Philosophy majors.

 

[Fading Fast]

...You can stay on that wheel for the rest of your life -- or you can forget about the carrot and get off the wheel. But you can't get off the wheel *and* have the carrot too. The only real path to freedom lies in not wanting the carrot at all.

I agree with this, but, for me, would modify it a bit. I choose - the Boys in Marketing don't - the few things "nice things /luxuries / modern conveniences" I want and I will work (even be on the wheel) to earn those things and the basics (food, shelter, clothing), but, basically, I'm in control.

What does that mean? It means there are some modern things that I want and enjoy, but I believe I have been very thoughtful and selective about what those are - weighing if they are things I want to improve my enjoyment of life or if I'm being sold. If the former, I'll work for it; if the later, I'm out.

Also, I simply don't care about class or status - and please let me get this in - I absolutely want people to respect me for my honesty, integrity, morality, work ethic, charity and decency (if I have any of those values). But I don't care what class one things I'm from - I'll tell anyone up front, my Dad didn't go to college, my Mom's parents were immigrants, my parents both grew up very poor in the depression. I struggled to go to a Statue University, I have worked with my hands for a living and I have sat at a desk in a job that was described as "all thought" for a living. I didn't think I was in a different class when I was doing one or the other job.

So I agree with Lizzie about not chasing the carrot, but again, my modification is that there are some carrots I want, but those are driven by a very thoughtful process by me and not, I believe, by the Boys in Marketing.

 

[Zombie_61]

Mama, don't let your babies grow up to be Philosophy majors.

lol

One of the aforementioned people was, at the time, a very close friend--a decent guy, but perhaps the laziest person I've ever known. After high school he went to USC and got a degree in "Entrepreneurship" (which I didn't even know was possible), then fumbled around for several years moving from one dead-end job to the next...when he could get a job, that is. I was joking with him one day about how much good that degree was doing him, and his rather defensive response was, "I want to be my own boss; I don't want to work for someone else." He had somehow gotten the idea in his head that his degree would magically open doors for him, and appeared to be waiting for someone--anyone--to hand him the keys to the kingdom. Meanwhile, he was forced to move home with his parents because he was always broke. shakeshead

The last time I heard from him was in 1999, when he stopped by to warn my wife and I about the impending Y2K disaster and divulge the details about why it was a very real possibility. At the time he had partnered with three other knuckleheads, and they started their own company writing gaming software for Java applications (or something like that; by then I really wasn't paying too much attention to anything he had to say). Since then I've heard "through the grapevine" that the partnership had failed, and as far as I know he's still living with his parents. Yeah, that college edumucation sure did him a lot of good. ound:

 

[LizzieMaine]

I think the so-called education system here in the U.S. is partially to blame for this. Even back in the mid- to late-1970s when I was going through high school we were constantly being beaten over the head with the notion that we had to go to college and earn a degree or we would never be able to get a "decent" job. I know quite a few people who bought into this notion, went to college, got their precious degree, and still couldn't get a "decent" job.

And that's when we quit beating around the bush and get right down in there where the rabbit is. *Who defines whether or a not a job is "decent?"* Who's defining our priorities?

What *is* decent, anyway? Is it a job that provides the worker with a bourgeois "lifestyle" while contributing to the stockpiling of wealth by monopoly capital? Or is it a job that contributes in a meaningful way to the community, a job that provides personal satisfaction in work well and honestly done? That's not to say that a job can't do both -- but really, how often are the latter two points a genuine matter of consideration when it comes to assigning social prestige?

Who is more prestigious? A kindergarten teacher or a hedge fund manager? But *who makes the more important contribution to the community?* Who is more prestigious, a marketing analyst or a city worker filling in potholes? But *who makes the more important contribution to the community?* A chief of thoractic surgery at a major hospital -- or a general practitioner working out of a low-income neighborhood clinic? Who is more prestigious? But *who makes the more important contribution to the community?*

Whose job, really, is the more "decent?"

 

[sheeplady]

I think there is a good question as to if most people are *capable* of detaching their own wants and needs from those that are marketed towards them. It requires a level of mindfulness that most people don't have or aren't capable of achieving. It takes work, and it is made harder by being raised from an infant in an environment where all you see is consumption and all you are exposed to is marketing.

 

[Fading Fast]

I think there is a good question as to if most people are *capable* of detaching their own wants and needs from those that are marketed towards them. It requires a level of mindfulness that most people don't have or aren't capable of achieving. It takes work, and it is made harder by being raised from an infant in an environment where all you see is consumption and all you are exposed to is marketing.

Yes it absolutely does take a lot of work and personal discipline, it is not easy all the time, but it results in a much happier life if you control your wants and don't let others. But again, it ain't always easy.

 

[LizzieMaine]

Before you can confront the problem, you first have to be aware that a problem exists. "Consciousness raising" got a bad name in the touchy-feely seventies, but real consciousness-raising, as in opening one's eyes to the reality of the way our civilization is structured and what it's doing to us as human beings, is absolutely essential. It's not like Saul of Tarsus having the scales suddenly fall from his eyes -- it's a gradual process of looking at one's self, looking at the system, and considering the possiblity that, just possibly, we might not be as free as we think we are. Some people will figure it all out, some people never will -- but we all owe it to ourselves to at least consider the question.

 

[V.C. Brunswick]

If you need a city worker around here go to a strip club.
http://www.dailynews.com/20100430/cbs-2-dwp-workers-at-strip-clubs-while-on-the-job

 

[Zombie_61]

...What *is* decent, anyway? Is it a job that provides the worker with a bourgeois "lifestyle" while contributing to the stockpiling of wealth by monopoly capital? Or is it a job that contributes in a meaningful way to the community, a job that provides personal satisfaction in work well and honestly done? That's not to say that a job can't do both -- but really, how often are the latter two points a genuine matter of consideration when it comes to assigning social prestige?...

I don't recall them ever coming right out and saying it, but I'm certain every time they said "decent" what they really meant was "higher paying". And I sometimes got the feeling they wanted to follow that up with, "You don't want to be a bricklayer/carpenter/plumber/gardener/garbage collector/fill-in-the-menial-labor-job-description, do you?", as if there was something wrong with earning an honest living in any of those professions.

 

[GHT]

I think there is a good question as to if most people are *capable* of detaching their own wants and needs from those that are marketed towards them. It requires a level of mindfulness that most people don't have or aren't capable of achieving.

Ain't that the truth. It explains the constant worry of most people's high level of personal debt. It also explains that herding instinct too. If one has a standard credit card but their peers have a gold one, or a platinum one, well you know the rest.

It's the same with social media, times I have been berated about not attending this or that, and when I say that I didn't know about it: "Well I put it on Facebook, Twitter or whatever." And if you don't join in this melee, then you are some kind of weirdo.

Wierdo or not, when all my bills came in during the first three months of this year, local authority tax, utilities, insurances and so on, they just got paid. There was no robbing Peter to pay Paul, no anxious dread. Pay what's important first, then if there's enough leftover, wants and desires can get a look in.

The only reason that I don't do social media is because I'm one who doesn't give out personal information. It's the same when I'm canvassed to pay by direct debit. Only my wife and I have access to our bank account, so no direct debit. Have you ever noticed how much personal information companies ask for when you buy on line? If you blindly give it to them, be prepared to be besieged by adverts.

Of late, we can no longer pay by personal cheque, to companies that is, credit card or direct debit only. It's all to get you locked in, you are no longer a valued customer, you are just a cash cow. Or should that be a credit cow. (Don't want upset your credit rating, eh?)

 

[TimeWarpWife]

I don't recall them ever coming right out and saying it, but I'm certain every time they said "decent" what they really meant was "higher paying". And I sometimes got the feeling they wanted to follow that up with, "You don't want to be a bricklayer/carpenter/plumber/gardener/garbage collector/fill-in-the-menial-labor-job-description, do you?", as if there was something wrong with earning an honest living in any of those professions.

Yet, without people willing to do these so-called menial labor positions, we'd all be homeless sitting around in overgrown jungles up to our eyeballs in trash. shakeshead Back in the 60s and early 70s when I was still in elementary school, a "decent" living meant you went to work, took care of your family, paid your bills on time, and you were a responsible person. People didn't look down on the man who picked up the trash, but were grateful he was there to do the job every week. People in my part of the country who have these "menial" jobs make a lot of money now days - you've got plumbers living in the same neighborhoods as doctors and lawyers.

 

[Fading Fast]

Yet, without people willing to do these so-called menial labor positions, we'd all be homeless sitting around in overgrown jungles up to our eyeballs in trash. shakeshead Back in the 60s and early 70s when I was still in elementary school, a "decent" living meant you went to work, took care of your family, paid your bills on time, and you were a responsible person. People didn't look down on the man who picked up the trash, but were grateful he was there to do the job every week. People in my part of the country who have these "menial" jobs make a lot of money now days - you've got plumbers living in the same neighborhoods as doctors and lawyers.

I laugh all the time about how well contractors, electricians, plumbers, do financially as, like others, growing up, my high school guidance counselor implicitly said you want to go to college and get an "office" job not a manual labor job - but like with Zombie - I don't believe he ever said "manual labor," "blue collar" or any other word like that, but it was all implied.

My Dad on the other hand seemed agnostic as he said - earning a living was your number one job. He had grown up poor in the depression and wasn't "sophisticated" enough to think money didn't matter - he saw earning a living to provide food, shelter and clothing as job 1-10 (and there was no job 11). The concept of "following your passion" or other self-awareness philosophies were beyond foreign to him. That said, and to my agnostic comment, he thought if you were inclined to work with your hands, you should get a good vocation so that you could make a good living at it and, if that wasn't your thing, then going to college was good but to get a skill to a get a good job - finding yourself, etc. - was nonsense talk to him.

Looking back, and even reading this thread and others like it, I realize that he was remarkably unconcerned about the "class or status" thing - as he was too focused on the earning-a-living thing. And he would respect an honest plumber ten times more than an sleazy lawyer, but he would also respect an honest lawyer ten times more than a plumber who cheated. It was all about honesty and integrity to him.

Absolutely not an easy man at all, but I have great respect for his value system and how much of it I have tried to live up to. I get that a lot of people care about blue versus white collar etc., but maybe because of my dad, I care about the character of the person - earn an honestly living, do your job well - and you have my respect; cheat, cut corners / etc. and I won't respect you. What it is you are doing - sweeping floors or running a Fortune 500 company - is not what I judge, but I absolutely do judge your integrity (if I have evidence of it).

 

[LizzieMaine]

I don't recall them ever coming right out and saying it, but I'm certain every time they said "decent" what they really meant was "higher paying". And I sometimes got the feeling they wanted to follow that up with, "You don't want to be a bricklayer/carpenter/plumber/gardener/garbage collector/fill-in-the-menial-labor-job-description, do you?", as if there was something wrong with earning an honest living in any of those professions.

And there you go. Gerbil, meet wheel. "They" are only repeating what's been drilled into them by a society whose god is its belly. And the rough truth of the matter is that a few of us here and there getting wise to it all and then holding ourselves aloof and above it won't make much of a difference in the long haul. There's billions more gerbils to take our places when we get off the wheel. What needs to happen for any really meaningful change in society to occur, is that the wheel itself needs to be knocked off its axle.

 

[MisterCairo]

Reminds me of an episode of Frasier, they need to call in a plumber, and it's an old bully from their school days, who drives a bigger Mercedes than Niles does.

Start at about 12:10:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JNymIqvFgQg

 

[ChiTownScion]

Before you can confront the problem, you first have to be aware that a problem exists. "Consciousness raising" got a bad name in the touchy-feely seventies, but real consciousness-raising, as in opening one's eyes to the reality of the way our civilization is structured and what it's doing to us as human beings, is absolutely essential. It's not like Saul of Tarsus having the scales suddenly fall from his eyes -- it's a gradual process of looking at one's self, looking at the system, and considering the possiblity that, just possibly, we might not be as free as we think we are. Some people will figure it all out, some people never will -- but we all owe it to ourselves to at least consider the question.

I am reminded of my favorite Steinbeck quote:

“Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.”

It's tragic in my mind that so many are duped into placing their resources, including their vote, at the very feet of those who see them as nothing more than an expendable means to their own pecuniary end. Waving, and even shoving, the flag or the cross in the face of others as a cynical manipulation by the haves really raises my hackles. In the end, I try to act to the end of my own enlightened self interest and that of my family.

And I make no apologies for that: the corporatists certainly don't have any qualms about pursuing their ends, and feel not the slightest bit of guilt over it. My lot in life improves when more of the working people of society have resources at their disposal. It really is about class conflict, if not warfare, and the sooner we are aware of that reality, the better.

 

[V.C. Brunswick]

Yet, without people willing to do these so-called menial labor positions, we'd all be homeless sitting around in overgrown jungles up to our eyeballs in trash. shakeshead Back in the 60s and early 70s when I was still in elementary school, a "decent" living meant you went to work, took care of your family, paid your bills on time, and you were a responsible person. People didn't look down on the man who picked up the trash, but were grateful he was there to do the job every week. People in my part of the country who have these "menial" jobs make a lot of money now days - you've got plumbers living in the same neighborhoods as doctors and lawyers.

And I'll bet many of those doctors and lawyers are still paying for their schooling 10-15 years after graduation.

 

[MisterCairo]

Speaking of the 70s, I came across this blog post recently. I'd forgotten about the 70s penchant for brown. I guess I remained blinded by the Harvest Gold and Avocado Greens:

http://flashbak.com/when-living-rooms-went-brown-earth-toning-of-american-homes-in-the-1970s-33482/

 

[jamespowers]

Gas lines only happened for a short time in 73 and 79. Vietnam ended in 1975, though too late for my Cousin in Nixon's secret war in Cambodia, and two of my friends in Vietnam. That was pre 73, so not the whole decade. Unemployment was below 6% all but four years, with 78 at 6.1%, the high was 8.5%. in the 80s, it was above 6% all but two years, 88-89 and the high was 9.7%! Interest rates hit 20% in 1980! 80s had the worse cloths and interiors.

On gee thanks. Gas lines only lasted for two years---great...... Vietnam lasted until half way into the 70s gee thanks.....

We have been through all those figures before and you know you are wrong so just leave it at that before I have to put the chart up again and prove you wrong. Everything was up in the 70s, unemployment, inflation and interest rates. It sucked like a Dyson and there is no getting around it. No matter how much people want to lie about it. It was bad. if you lived through it, it was even worse.

 

[jamespowers]

Speaking of the 70s, I came across this blog post recently. I'd forgotten about the 70s penchant for brown. I guess I remained blinded by the Harvest Gold and Avocado Greens:

http://flashbak.com/when-living-rooms-went-brown-earth-toning-of-american-homes-in-the-1970s-33482/

Not only living rooms. If you didn't have a brown fridge in the 70s then be thankful, be very thankful......