Why I do not recommend Simmons Bilt Type B-7 parka

[kiril]

Ordered https://simmonsbilt.com/products/type-b7-parka?_pos=1&_psq=parka&_ss=e&_v=1.0 in Seal Brown 18mm, size 40.
Although I did tell SB that I am a standard built, they wanted me to take my measures - and produced the parka by them, not as a standard size.
Now the issues:
- It took SB 3 months to produce and ship the garment
- Parka came much shorter (about 2 inches) than displayed on their website (mine is shorter by a button as you can see in the attached files)
- Sheepskin top layer quality is really bad - the friction areas started to worn out within the first 2 days of light usage. Looks like cheap Pakistan leather.
- For an 1000 GBP garment, overall quality is disappointing

I did complain, had the parka returned to them at my own cost. SB customer support lady (there is only one person responding) said they looked at the jacket and could not find any issues with the sheepskin. They offered me to either return it back - or list it at their outlet for sale - obviously at a lower price. I decided to keep it, as selling it did not look like a viable option.

Long story short - I am not recommending Type B-7 Parka from Simmons Built due to the low quality and SB tricking the customer going to custom sizing.

I have another SB jacket I bought some years ago, and I like it. It was from their outlet, so already made by someone's custom size. Looks like SB screwed up quality and are happy to lose a formerly loyal customer of theirs.

 

[Aloysius]

No one should ever buy a shearling from SB.

Even leaving aside the ethical issues of dealing with them and even the lack of QC, when they stole their patterns from Aero, the shearling ones in particular were actually WIP.

In practical terms, this means their shearlings have mistakes like the sleeves not fitting right, which are fixed on the actual Aero versions.

Shouldn’t be any surprise though that they they swindled you lol. It’s their raison d’être.

 

[Aloysius]

Forgot to add this earlier.

I think you should actually fight this.

I finally go a response from S-B: No offer to remake or refund and not taking any responsibility.

They claimed Pandemic’s obviously faulty jacket was correct even though it looked like a garbage bag.

It took four emails and seven days to get the initial response, that that is the was just how a 38 is supposed to fit.

I sent a link to this post and got a response within an hour that they will refund me and take it back. Still not accepting any responsibility, not that I care about that.

But eventually they got pressured into refunding, because of the forum thread here, though they still insisted it's normal and correct for a person with a 38" chest to have a 44" hem.

Keep up the pressure. Don't relent. They screwed you and you shouldn't be left holding the £1000 + shipping bag. Frankly they should reimburse you for the shipping it cost you to send it back to them as well.

Use the money to buy something else; if you're still after a B-7 you can get the Aero model that they ripped off.

 

[CatsCan]

They offered me to either return it

I decided to keep it

I don't know S-B from experience.

But as I get it, they offered a return but this was refused by the buyer.

Isn't it then a slightly better way to accept their offer and give them the chance to correct the issue or pay the money back, instead of deciding to keep it as it is and enter a public forum with a first post like this?
I am just curious as to the practice of things like this.

Edit: Looking through the threads it seems others have had similar experiences. So the question remains: Why did you keep it?

 

[TartuWolf]

Really sorry to hear about your bad experience.
I hope it does not end like this and you manage to work a better solution out with them.
But if you already chose to keep it then nothing else can really be agreed.

Seems to me that with them the best course of action is either buying from their sale pages or providing your own measurements, getting confirmation and getting thorough QC before shipping to make sure it adheres to their own 0.5" tolerance.

 

[Aloysius]

But as I get it, they offered a return but this was refused by the buyer.

He phrased it weirdly; he meant he was offered a choice between them returning it to him or listing it as a consignment item on their sale page so he gets the discounted sale price when someone buys it.

I.e. he meant ‘return’ literally as opposed to refunding him.

 

[CatsCan]

Thanks for clarification!

 

[Canuck Panda]

The man created his account just for this review. Not when he ordered, not when he waited, not when he gotten the jacket and had issue with it, only after he has worn it, and returned it, this review now comes to surface. Many reviews like this on Google and Yeelllp. Some with less words. I pray for all small business and self employed during this internet one hit review era.

 

[CatsCan]

The man created his account just for this review. Not when he ordered, not when he waited, not when he gotten the jacket and had issue with it, only after he has worn it, and returned it, this review now comes to surface. Many reviews like this on Google and Yeelllp. Some with less words. I pray for all small business and self employed during this internet one hit review era.

This was also my main concern.

 

[Observe]

Yeah... Small business or not, do right by your customers and bad PR generally won't be an issue.

 

[Aloysius]

Yeah I don’t see the point of white knighting SB here.

When people have leather jacket queries or concerns, they make an account here. We shouldn’t be upset about it.

And frankly it’s a bit ridiculous to see concern trolling over Simmons Bilt as a ‘small business’ when they are backed by a major businessman who runs chain stores in the UK and only exist due to an attempt to put an existing family business out of business. On top of that, their products themselves are the result of defrauding said small business.

I lived in Scotland. Sandy Alexander’s stores are everywhere.

 

[Aloysius]

Not when he ordered, not when he waited, not when he gotten the jacket and had issue with it, only after he has worn it, and returned it, this review now comes to surface.

Well, obviously. Why would he complain before attempting to go through the process that any other company would honor?

Same thing could be put on any of the other members who had this experience.

 

[cbez]

I've received a lot of 'expensive' items with issues in my day.

IMO, whatever you as a business put out there to your customers, is free game to be put on blast. If a customer is willing to resolve things quietly that's purely extra courtesy on their part. If you don't like it improve your QC and make better stuff.

 

[Bfd70]

I dunno about some of the complaints.
3 months to produce. Sounds about right.
Sheepskin looks like cheap pakistan leather.
Have you handled sheepskin military repros before?
It is typically thin and will flake…
2” shorter than displayed on the website
measurements are not given. They recommended custom.
Maybe the op is 5’2” with a 44” chest and therefore it had to be shorter.

All’s I‘m saying is that there is too little info to determine SB is at fault.
Regarding Simmons bilts past business practices, anyone using an Apple product to participate in TFL and feeling like comparing their ethics with SB?

 

[Aloysius]

It is typically thin and will flake…

They weren't designed to flake in two wears.

2” shorter than displayed on the website
measurements are not given. They recommended custom.

It's not just the 2"; the jacket is awkwardly cropped and has the wrong number of buttons; the button layout is kind of important. If I got to a tailor for a 3-button suit and he gives me two buttons, something got messed up.

Regarding Simmons bilts past business practices, anyone using an Apple product to participate in TFL and feeling like comparing their ethics with SB?

"Past" business practices? Their entire line is still built on stolen Aero patterns.

And yes, I am comfortable using Apple products but would never buy a SB.

Sorry, Simmons Bilt is a den of crooks and I won't be gaslit into thinking otherwise, whether by their fans on TFL or their boosters like Standard & Strange which popularized their crap among American hipsters. (Not saying you're doing this, but this is a trend whenever their stuff comes up.)

If anything I would have expected them to run an extra tight ship to contrast with their other practices, but unfortunately they don't.

 

[Bfd70]

Fair point pics wont open on tfl for me so i did not make a comp,ete assessment of the delivery. However, I take anything written by an OP with 1 post that is a rant with a reasonable amount of skepticism

This was typed on my apple i pad made by an anti-union corporate giants that subcontract child labor. I use it guilt free and would happily own a SB too

 

[Aloysius]

Sorry for getting harsh there; I got kind of annoyed by the repeated "how dare OP do this to a business?" thing when TFL is full of people who made posts after companies in the leather biz screwed them in some way. I think it's the closest thing we offer to a 'service'. There are people who avoided the Legendary scam jacket last year because of our thread, for example.

When I just saw the months and inches thing I would have written it off too; when I saw the pics I realized it was a full disaster. The bottom portion of the jacket is basically cut off with the pockets accordingly moved up. Reminded me of that infamous Diamond Dave Buco.

 

[CatsCan]

I think there are three things here.

The first is that there is somebody nobody else here knows who comes with a first post telling us why he doesn't recommend S-B because of his own experience he describes. The choice for other readers is if they judge a company because of this alone. And obviously they shouldn't. We all don't know for sure, who the OP is and what his intention is with his post. He will not have his money back through this nor will he get the coat altered to his liking through this. His only aims so far could have been a) a kind of revenge or b) honestly warning others to not go into the same trap.

The other is, that this seed falls on a previously plowed field with many obviosly having made bad experiences with the company, too. This is supporting the claim of the OP and makes it more relevant to others. It kind of somewhat balances out the naturally low credibility of a one time poster.

The third is, that there seems to be other underlying conflicts showing up, triggered by this post, and related to business practices who are considered morally wrong by some saying there were stolen patterns involved.

In the end, a reader like me, who never ever bought a Simmons Bilt is put off by these disputes alone and is pulled to another company like the one that has also been mentioned, Aero. But can I know for sure or can a forum guarantee me that the reviewers are customers and not supporters of a company in a hidden business conflict? Only when I am a long time member here who knows how to seperate the wheat from the chaff.

The only way to make his mind is to read other threads about the same company and use common sense.

The OP has not responded nor taken part in this discussion over the course of this thread. He does not seem interested in what others have to say about it or any kind of support by others here. So my impression is that his only aim was to unload his frustration and maybe take some revenge for it.

If the OP had come up with a first post like: "Hi, I am a new member. I have created an account here because of my frustration with a purchase. I bought a custom made Jacket from... I don't think it is how it should be. Have others made similair experiences? I emailed the company and got this reply. What would you recommend me doing?"

It would have been a better style I guess.

 

[TartuWolf]

Well he only posted it only yesterday, does not mean that he won't come back to respond.
But what you wrote also reminds me of the general principle that people who have bad experience are more likely to talk about it / report it than people who have had good experience. There are plenty of members on TFL that had great experience with SB but are just not that vocal about it - they are simply happily enjoying their jackets. Then there are some that had bad experience and condemn SB loudly and proudly, drawing most attention.
Readers looking for feedback on SB will have to make up their opinion based on the info they find here and elsewhere. For example there's a thread on the Iron Heart forum with nothing but praise from many members and owners of SB jackets. So it also depends on how deep the readers wants to dig and where she/he ends up finding info.
Personally I've had a mixed experience with SB (great communication / support, poor execution) and still have a neutral opinion about them as a maker - willing to potentially give them another shot in the future, being more careful this time. But it's already a bit sad that a potential buyer ideally has to be "careful" about dealing with a maker.

 

[mumpy]

OP just tell them you want your money back, worst case file a chargeback. This jacket is unacceptable.