Who watches the WATCHMEN?

[Son_of_Atropos]

I commented on this before but I think it is relevant here. I never thought of myself as a prude, but whoa... the violence was pretty graphic and the sex scenes were only a few camera angles away from hardcore porn.


The Kennedy assassination footage was poignant. As a person who grew up past the assassination I never thought about how the actual scene went down. For me it was interesting and like reliving that event. If that makes any sense.


Also, maybe a more literal take on your thread title, I was a bit shocked how some of the violence inspired laughter (i can't remember if the Kennedy scene sparked such a reaction) but I recall people laughing during the rape scene. WOW, really, laughing at a woman being raped? Good God. The genius of Watchmen is that response to such a stimulus shows that mankind really is a mess.

Off topic:
If Watchmen is any indication of a trend, I predict hardcore sex scenes in R movies soon.


Loved the movie. by the way.

 

[Hemingway Jones]

Housekeeping

These posts would only be covered here at the Lounge under the discussion of the film.

Thanks,
HJ

 

[kiltie]

H,
I posted in the Observation Bar because I felt my post was relative to the other thread, and not meant to pertain expressly to Watchmen. It was intended to be a comment on something broader but exemplified in that movie.
I mean only to state my case here and not to argue. You gotta do your job. I didn't want the gravity of the post to be lost in general discussion of the film, just as I felt it was a sharp enough point not to tack onto the "Depression" thread I felt it was relative to.
It's not meant to be a comment on the movie specifically, as you can see I did not reference the sex or other scenes of violence, but the fictionalized portrayal of an actual event in history and how people today perceive it. Whether or not it is a sign or symptom of something much broader perhaps infecting people. Is it something people born after a certain time are afflicted with, or is it pan-generational ( such a word? ).

Thanks

 

[Hemingway Jones]

PM sent. Thanks.

 

[flat-top]

Well, who else saw this?
I did. I would have preferred an entire "Minutemen" movie.

 

[Esme]

I saw yesterday and I thought it was pretty good.
I knew (from who directed it) that there was going to be pretty graphic violence in it, so I was prepared. I was more offput by the nudity (Dr. Manhattan and his blue friend) than by the violence and sex, really.
Overall I thought it was excellent, well handled, really well translated to film, but like I said, I knew about most of the changes, because I have been following the online development of the film.
I didn't even think about the Kennedy thing being disrespectful, sorry, it flowed with the time line narrative to me. I saw it at a sparsely populated theatre (maybe 20 people?) in Perth and heard no inappropriate laughter at all. There were a few gasps at some of the bloodier scenes, and, for once, no children!! Well done, Perth.
Anyway, I thought it was really good. And my husband, who has never read the comic, found it quite entertaining, also.
Wish there had been more Bubastis, she was my fave. LOL.

 

[mike]

These posts would only be covered here at the Lounge under the discussion of the film.

Thanks,
HJ

I'm not too clear about what we're allowed to talk about or not regarding this movie. [huh]

 

[kiltie]

I initially posted my commentary/observation/question in Observation Bar. Hemingway felt it better served the tone of the site if it was moved to this section, as it did not pertain expressly to vintage. I whined a little bit. No big deal.

 

[carter]

Saw it this evening. Just OK.

 

[swinggal]

I loved it. It captured the graphic novel from 1987 perfectly. As for the violence, sex etc...have you read the GN? Pretty much how it is portrayed guys. Too many superhero movies that derive form comics these days steer clear of this, when in fact the comics are very violent (yes, even Spiderman etc). The GN wasn't written for family entertainment. It was an adult story with adult themes.

I thought it couldn't have been done better. People really need to read the GN first I believe. One of my friends here in Oz is a writer for DC and knows superhero history back to front. He also loved the movie and said it couldn't have been made better. it had some small flaws yeah, but overall, I felt like I was reading the GN

 

[Mahagonny Bill]

I saw it this weekend as well. I have been a huge fan of the GN since it first came out and this movie is everything I wanted to see since the first time I read the book (giant squid aside).

I agree with Son_of_Atropos that the movie seemed very close to a US MPAA "X" rating, although I wouldn't call it hardcore pornography. The sex and violence in the movie is shocking, but it should be. The content of the GN was shocking as well, especially at the time it was originally published.

As a fan of the book, I am very happy with the movie. I am too close to the original material to judge the film objectively and I have no idea how "the mundanes" are going to react, but I think that this movie will be an artistic triumph if not a commercial one. Now I'm looking forward to the four-hour directors cut DVD slated for December release.

 

[Queue]

I saw yesterday and I thought it was pretty good.
I knew (from who directed it) that there was going to be pretty graphic violence in it, so I was prepared. I was more offput by the nudity (Dr. Manhattan and his blue friend) than by the violence and sex, really.
Overall I thought it was excellent, well handled, really well translated to film, but like I said, I knew about most of the changes, because I have been following the online development of the film.

I'm no longer really off put by sex or violence in films (mod Sin City) and I think, as several others have said, that the tone of the film and its content stay true to its sourcey. The film depicts the nitty gritty of the dark lives of dark individuals (and a blue one). The point, as I understand it, of Doctor Manhattan's nudity (which I think was very tastefully done, it wasn't a focus and seemed somewhat incidental to the character) is that it is one more indication of his detachment from human affairs and concerns.

The violence, most notably Rorschach's attack on the dogs, is always a bit of a disturbing/trying moment but it's part of his character and ultimately part of what makes him endearing to me (I see him as the good guy, well perhaps the least bad guy). As for the sex, well perhaps my personal views are showing but it's just sex and all the X rated bits were covered.

I must say that I do appreciate that the violence is getting a mention along side the sex; that's one of the things that bothers me most about modern American society, there can be blood and gore everywhere and that's fine but if there's some nudity it's a blight on the face of freedom and all things good.

</rant>

 

[swinggal]

For those that call that hard core porn...you obviously have never seen any! I haven't see a lot, but that ain't it!!! That wasn't even in a porn category. Erotica maybe, but that's it. You see more flesh on Australian TV than that in prime time series.

I am always amazed at how much censorship there is in US TV. Our shows have no problem with showing women's naked breasts, bums etc and mens. If it's a show to shown later at night frontal nudity is often there. What's the big deal? We watch 'Survivor' here and they blur out the tops of bum cracks or wet mens crotch areas. What tha??

Anyway, the violence was in context. Do some research and if you know it's going to bother you, why go see it?

 

[CopperNY]

thanks for the warning about the dogs. i may end up seeing it alone now. i don't think the wife will stand for the animal violence. i read the GN, but didn't hear whether they left it in or not.

yeah, the US is pretty puritanical regarding nudity. i see what shows like "Family Guy" and "South Park" get away with -saying-, but nudity is strictly off limits. heh, i remember being in Paris and seeing full frontal in commercials.

every culture has it's own little quirks. in Japan hardcore has to blur out genitals. now in the US, you can pretty much avoid an 'X' as long as you don't show genitals. now i'm curious, based on some members reactions, to see how far they pushed. the last movie that surprised me with graphic sex was "Taking Lives" w/ Angelina Jolie. pretty rough.

but yes, true hardcore is one step beyond. one of the two jobs i used to pay for college was as night manager of a porn shop (the other was as a janitor), where you see quite a bit more than you ever wanted to .

 

[Miss 1929]

Loved it.

I thought it was the best movie version of a book I have seen yet, and that's saying a lot. The original GN is indeed a masterpiece, and part of what made it so, was that it had a lot of sex and violence in it (one of the first GNs to do so back in the 80s, as I recall being shocked at the time). Life is full of sex and violence, so if it's part of the plot it doesn't bother me.
And I agree, that is not porn. A flaccid blue one does not porn make. The sex scenes between Dan and Laurie were just plain hot. The not-quite-rape scene (they didn't get all the way, they conceive Laurie off-camera after that event) was disturbing, but again, it is an important plot line. This is not a movie for kids so why pull the punches?
I didn't see much that they changed. The casting was brilliant, all the characters rang true to me, although hubby thought that Oz could have been more sophisticated, and Bubastis could have been larger.
And they didn't change the ending, and I don't see room for a sequel (which would probably suck).
All in all, I give it five fedoras out of five.

 

[Son_of_Atropos]

I commented on this before but I think it is relevant here. I never thought of myself as a prude, but whoa... the violence was pretty graphic and the sex scenes were only a few camera angles away from hardcore porn.


The Kennedy assassination footage was poignant. As a person who grew up past the assassination I never thought about how the actual scene went down. For me it was interesting and like reliving that event. If that makes any sense.


Also, maybe a more literal take on your thread title, I was a bit shocked how some of the violence inspired laughter (i can't remember if the Kennedy scene sparked such a reaction) but I recall people laughing during the rape scene. WOW, really, laughing at a woman being raped? Good God. The genius of Watchmen is that response to such a stimulus shows that mankind really is a mess.

Off topic:
If Watchmen is any indication of a trend, I predict hardcore sex scenes in R movies soon.


Loved the movie. by the way.

People, people, please stop jumping to conclusions.

First, I said if this is a trend then eventually there will be hardcore sex scenes soon. I didn't say there was a hardcore scene in the movie. But it is getting close.

Second, the violence did not disturb me but the moviegoers response to it.

Third, third I said I liked the movie, I am not bashing it. The only major flaws in the movie is some of soundtrack selections and Silk Spectres' (both of them) acting.

Fourth, relax, and don't mischarcterize my statements

 

[mike]

I initially posted my commentary/observation/question in Observation Bar. Hemingway felt it better served the tone of the site if it was moved to this section, as it did not pertain expressly to vintage. I whined a little bit. No big deal.

ooh! ok that makes sense then!

I thought it was delving too far towards social commentary and not enough about the movie, but that's intertwined with what the actual movie is dealing with so it would have been a catch22, ya know?! :eusa_doh:

 

[Feraud]

Potential Spoiler Below!!

ummm.... I said if this is a trend then eventually there will be hardcore sex scenes soon. I didn't say there was a hardcore scene in the movie. But it is getting close.

What exactly in the movie makes you sense a trend towards hardcore in popular films?

Was it the love scene between the two characters or the attempted rape? Both themes have been around in films for years and other films have "shown more" than Watchmen. The violence in this film was mediocre compared to other films.

Is this all some people are taking from Watchmen?

 

[Son_of_Atropos]

Potential Spoiler Below!!





What exactly in the movie makes you sense a trend towards hardcore in popular films?

Was it the love scene between the two characters or the attempted rape? Both themes have been around in films for years and other films have "shown more" than Watchmen. The violence in this film was mediocre compared to other films.

Is this all some people are taking from Watchmen?

C'mon Feraud, is that what I am taking from the movie, no. I just made a comment on the sex scenes and the violence. Its a trend, Watchmen is part of that trend. 300 is part of that trend. Sin City is part of that trend. The only reason I mention those movies is because they are the only ones I have seen that are R in the past few years. That obviously means that I liked them. Yeah and you are right most movies are worse but the point is that there is a trend to pushing the envelope and eventually I think it would lead to hardcore porn in R movies. C'mon be honest, some of these scenes are a few thrusts or camera angles away, I think that is undeniable.


Can I give you a specific date, no. Can I tell you what movie will do it, no.


"What happened to the American dream? It came true."

 

[K.D. Lightner]

I may actually go see this movie, know little or nothing about the comic or the characters.

I did see Ironman, which I enjoyed. This new film is better than that?

I was a young, idealistic student when Kennedy was assassinated, so will be interesting to see what I think and feel about it.

karol