Which leather for an Aero Premier Halfbelt?

[MrProper]

You have so many nice and similar jackets... why not something else entirely in terms of cut and leather?

Hmm... that's a fair question. Thanks.

I got a taste for HB quite late, ultimately thanks to @ton312 and 5* and now I'd like a "proper" HB.
The reason my jackets are all very similar is because I think the style suits me best.
With the trucker and cossack jackets I've found that I'm not such a button person, with the latter that I don't like a shawl collar.
I don't wear my Amelia Earhard jacket, which is actually great, because I like my others better and I don't like the bomber style and patch pockets for me.
So I will clean up my closet

Interestingly, what cut/leather did you have in mind when you asked?

 

[Carlos840]

I know this goes against the TFL grain, but i personally have never understood the whole "CXL is too heavy and thick" thing that keeps coming up.
Yes it feels like cardboard when new, but wear it daily for a couple weeks and it will be as soft as any other leather if not softer.

To me it's the same kinda thing as the people who would go on and on about LW leather being impossible to break in that would then admit to wearing the jacket twice before deciding they didn't like it. IF you wear it it breaks in...

I've posted these numbers before, but you can see that both my Aero CXL FQHH jackets barely make it past the mid point, they are the same weight as most of my Shinki jackets are and no one ever calls Shinki too thick or too heavy.

Thurlow Leatherworld (deer): 1,51kg / 3.32Lb
ELMC Californian: 1.53 kg / 3.37 lb
Langlitz Cascade: 1.77kg / 3.91lb
DC J-100: 1.80 kg / 3.98 lb
Lewis Leathers 551: 1.94 kg / 4.25 lb
Schott 644: 1.95 kg / 4.31 lb
Lee Storm Rider: 1,97kg / 4.35Lb
Lewis Leathers Universal Racer Mk2: 2,03kg / 4.47Lb
Metropolitan Uniform CO. PJ27: 2.08kg / 4.58lb
DC JH-1: 2.09kg / 4.61lb
Schott B3: 2.11kg / 4.66 lb
Golden Bear Deck Jacket: 2.16kg / 4.77lb
RMC JH-1: 2.21kg / 4.87lb
Himel Chevalier: 2.23 kg / 4.93 lbs
Schott 613H: 2,24kg / 4.94Lb
Aero Bootlegger CXLFQHH(brown): 2.31 kg / 5.09 lb
Schott 621: 2,41kg / 5.31Lb
Frewheelers San Mateo: 2.5kg/ 5.5lb
Langlitz Columbia: 2.50kg / 5.56lb
Schott 602: 2.53kg / 5.59lb
Aero Bootlegger CXLFQHH(black): 2.55 kg / 5.63 lb
Legendary USA Trojan Horse: 2.56kg / 5.64lb
Aero Leather Grizzly: 2.61kg / 5.75lb
Freewheelers La Brea: 2.61 kg / 5.76 lb
AL Cafe Racer: 2.72 kg / 5.66 lb
Apparel Annex CHP: 2.73 kg / 6.03lb
Legendary USA J-24 HH: 2,76kg / 6.08Lb
Vanson Swedish Rider: 2,79kg / 6.16Lb
Vanson x Left Field Commando: 2.89kg / 6.37lb
Oje malung Swedish Rider: 2,90kg / 6.40Lb
Vanson CHP2: 2.90kg / 6.39lb
Lost Worlds J-23: 2.98kg / 6.57lb
Lost Worlds Leathertogs: 3.44kg / 7.58lb
Vanson Chopper: 3.60 kg / 7.95 lb

All that to say i would pic CXL (FQHH or Steer) for it's aging abilities, not for it's weight, it's not that big a deal.
Personally i think Vincenza ages like crap, i don't like that hide.

 

[Edward]

I know this goes against the TFL grain, but i personally have never understood the whole "CXL is too heavy and thick" thing that keeps coming up.
Yes it feels like cardboard when new, but wear it daily for a couple weeks and it will be as soft as any other leather if not softer.

To me it's the same kinda thing as the people who would go on and on about LW leather being impossible to break in that would then admit to wearing the jacket twice before deciding they didn't like it. IF you wear it it breaks in...

I've posted these numbers before, but you can see that both my Aero CXL FQHH jackets barely make it past the mid point, they are the same weight as most of my Shinki jackets are and no one ever calls Shinki too thick or too heavy.

Thurlow Leatherworld (deer): 1,51kg / 3.32Lb
ELMC Californian: 1.53 kg / 3.37 lb
Langlitz Cascade: 1.77kg / 3.91lb
DC J-100: 1.80 kg / 3.98 lb
Lewis Leathers 551: 1.94 kg / 4.25 lb
Schott 644: 1.95 kg / 4.31 lb
Lee Storm Rider: 1,97kg / 4.35Lb
Lewis Leathers Universal Racer Mk2: 2,03kg / 4.47Lb
Metropolitan Uniform CO. PJ27: 2.08kg / 4.58lb
DC JH-1: 2.09kg / 4.61lb
Schott B3: 2.11kg / 4.66 lb
Golden Bear Deck Jacket: 2.16kg / 4.77lb
RMC JH-1: 2.21kg / 4.87lb
Himel Chevalier: 2.23 kg / 4.93 lbs
Schott 613H: 2,24kg / 4.94Lb
Aero Bootlegger CXLFQHH(brown): 2.31 kg / 5.09 lb
Schott 621: 2,41kg / 5.31Lb
Frewheelers San Mateo: 2.5kg/ 5.5lb
Langlitz Columbia: 2.50kg / 5.56lb
Schott 602: 2.53kg / 5.59lb
Aero Bootlegger CXLFQHH(black): 2.55 kg / 5.63 lb
Legendary USA Trojan Horse: 2.56kg / 5.64lb
Aero Leather Grizzly: 2.61kg / 5.75lb
Freewheelers La Brea: 2.61 kg / 5.76 lb
AL Cafe Racer: 2.72 kg / 5.66 lb
Apparel Annex CHP: 2.73 kg / 6.03lb
Legendary USA J-24 HH: 2,76kg / 6.08Lb
Vanson Swedish Rider: 2,79kg / 6.16Lb
Vanson x Left Field Commando: 2.89kg / 6.37lb
Oje malung Swedish Rider: 2,90kg / 6.40Lb
Vanson CHP2: 2.90kg / 6.39lb
Lost Worlds J-23: 2.98kg / 6.57lb
Lost Worlds Leathertogs: 3.44kg / 7.58lb
Vanson Chopper: 3.60 kg / 7.95 lb

All that to say i would pic CXL (FQHH or Steer) for it's aging abilities, not for it's weight, it's not that big a deal.
Personally i think Vincenza ages like crap, i don't like that hide.

I've found the same. My CXL Horse jackets took *maybe* a month of regular wear to bed in nicely. I enjoyed the process, but they never needed more than just regular wear like any jacket over a couple of weeks to not feel like armour.

I tend to find a lighter hide is a much better option for some climates / temperatures, but that's a slightly different consideration. Course, that's also very subjective - I hear all the time people saying that "a b3 is too hot for these temperatures"; mine was always ideal for London Winters.

 

[ton312]

I know this goes against the TFL grain, but i personally have never understood the whole "CXL is too heavy and thick" thing that keeps coming up.
Yes it feels like cardboard when new, but wear it daily for a couple weeks and it will be as soft as any other leather if not softer.

To me it's the same kinda thing as the people who would go on and on about LW leather being impossible to break in that would then admit to wearing the jacket twice before deciding they didn't like it. IF you wear it it breaks in...

I've posted these numbers before, but you can see that both my Aero CXL FQHH jackets barely make it past the mid point, they are the same weight as most of my Shinki jackets are and no one ever calls Shinki too thick or too heavy.

Thurlow Leatherworld (deer): 1,51kg / 3.32Lb
ELMC Californian: 1.53 kg / 3.37 lb
Langlitz Cascade: 1.77kg / 3.91lb
DC J-100: 1.80 kg / 3.98 lb
Lewis Leathers 551: 1.94 kg / 4.25 lb
Schott 644: 1.95 kg / 4.31 lb
Lee Storm Rider: 1,97kg / 4.35Lb
Lewis Leathers Universal Racer Mk2: 2,03kg / 4.47Lb
Metropolitan Uniform CO. PJ27: 2.08kg / 4.58lb
DC JH-1: 2.09kg / 4.61lb
Schott B3: 2.11kg / 4.66 lb
Golden Bear Deck Jacket: 2.16kg / 4.77lb
RMC JH-1: 2.21kg / 4.87lb
Himel Chevalier: 2.23 kg / 4.93 lbs
Schott 613H: 2,24kg / 4.94Lb
Aero Bootlegger CXLFQHH(brown): 2.31 kg / 5.09 lb
Schott 621: 2,41kg / 5.31Lb
Frewheelers San Mateo: 2.5kg/ 5.5lb
Langlitz Columbia: 2.50kg / 5.56lb
Schott 602: 2.53kg / 5.59lb
Aero Bootlegger CXLFQHH(black): 2.55 kg / 5.63 lb
Legendary USA Trojan Horse: 2.56kg / 5.64lb
Aero Leather Grizzly: 2.61kg / 5.75lb
Freewheelers La Brea: 2.61 kg / 5.76 lb
AL Cafe Racer: 2.72 kg / 5.66 lb
Apparel Annex CHP: 2.73 kg / 6.03lb
Legendary USA J-24 HH: 2,76kg / 6.08Lb
Vanson Swedish Rider: 2,79kg / 6.16Lb
Vanson x Left Field Commando: 2.89kg / 6.37lb
Oje malung Swedish Rider: 2,90kg / 6.40Lb
Vanson CHP2: 2.90kg / 6.39lb
Lost Worlds J-23: 2.98kg / 6.57lb
Lost Worlds Leathertogs: 3.44kg / 7.58lb
Vanson Chopper: 3.60 kg / 7.95 lb

All that to say i would pic CXL (FQHH or Steer) for it's aging abilities, not for it's weight, it's not that big a deal.
Personally i think Vincenza ages like crap, i don't like that hide.

Your brown bootlegger is lighter than my seal brown vic HB! I mentioned to Carrie that my jacket feels much heavier than any of the other vic hides I’ve handled (I hated the stuff myself for years) and she told me there have been several batches where the weights are almost the same, lighter CXL=heavier vic. The lightest CXL jacket I owned was my BL 3.0, which was just over 6lbs.

I agree that CXL will age better. Certainly anything brown. Vic is pretty flat and uniform. Kind of boring in a way. It is far more comfortable to wear. I consider vic to be an improvement over what ELMC uses. It’s thicker and just feels more substantial. For me those two hides occupy the same kind of category of leather.

For all the years I’ve spent praising CXL, it’s the last leather I would choose for a new jacket. It’s beautiful to look at, but I hated wearing it, and I think that’s why I left a trail of Aero’s behind me.

 

[ton312]

Maybe one additional
Question: Does anyone know how big the front drop is on the PHB?

I think you may want to ask Aero if you can spec the drop. On my wool HB and this 30’s HB the drop is quite steep. About 2.5”. Grainy pic but you get the idea.

The OG Herc (also a 30’s pattern) has a much less steep drop of 1.5”.

 

[Marc mndt]

I consider vic to be an improvement over what ELMC uses.

I don't think it makes much sense making generalized claims about some maker's hides. Carlos' elmc californian weights 1,51 kg. My californian weights 1,85 kg. Not that much of a difference but it does feels more substantial than my Aero Grizzly's Vicenza which feels thin and looks like it's printed. Your Aero Hercules' Vicenza looks much nicer. I think it all depends on the particular batch.

 

[ton312]

I don't think it makes much sense making generalized claims about some maker's hides. Carlos' elmc californian weights 1,51 kg. My californian weights 1,85 kg. Not that much of a difference but it does feels more substantial than my Aero Grizzly's Vicenza which feels thin and looks like it's printed. Your Aero Hercules' Vicenza looks much nicer. I think it all depends on the particular batch.

View attachment 451668

Oh I don’t disagree, for sure every batch is unique. My seal vic has a similar printed look, mainly on the torso:

But even the thinner vic I’ve had felt better than the ELMC. My californian weighed about 3lbs. It felt paper thin. My lightest vic jackets were around 4-4.5lb. But it’s certainly true that each batch of leather is different and as I said up until recently I absolutely hated vic. I considered it to be the worst leather ever. The first seal brown vic jacket I had being the absolute worst. This one:

But this ^ still felt better than the ELMC. For me that jacket was just awful. Too thin, crispy feeling hide. Just not good, even for a deliberate attempt at a lightweight jacket. I felt that if I tried I could burst the sleeve seams by bending my arms. That’s not a flex, I’m not Arnold but they are cut super trim and combined with the thin leather, it was legit concern. There were other things about the jacket I disliked but that’s irrelevant. Suffice it to say I hated both equally.

I’m equally surprised to see a CXL jacket weigh 5lbs. I never had one that light, and I had a fair number of CXL jackets. So indeed to your point individual batches are everything.

 

[Canuck Panda]

MrProper there are some variations between hides but you can always call in and ask them to be your eyes on the ground when your spot is up. Given they’re not bombed with orders. There’s a few time slots in a year when the makers aren’t so busy I’m trying to figure out these time slots. Orders are always given more attention and turn around time is faster. I think last couple weeks was one of those slots and the next one coming up is sometime early next year.

 

[Jasonindenver]

I like my Seven in dark seal Vicenza. I had a badalassi fit jacket and did not care for the shiny finish and incredibly annoying squeak. While the badalassi swatch looked great, it definitely is a different beast on a whole jacket.

 

[MrProper]

Thanks again for the other posts. The other thread by talking about jerky HH has influenced me a bit and so I could well imagine the jerky in seal. The question then would be if the extra grain is worth the extra cost. Let's see, maybe I can find some pictures of jackets made from the leather.

 

[JMax]

Thanks again for the other posts. The other thread by talking about jerky HH has influenced me a bit and so I could well imagine the jerky in seal. The question then would be if the extra grain is worth the extra cost. Let's see, maybe I can find some pictures of jackets made from the leather.

The Tumbled CXL could be the best of both worlds. Grainy CXL=yummy. You’d own all the raves.

 

[nick123]

Oh I don’t disagree, for sure every batch is unique. My seal vic has a similar printed look, mainly on the torso:
View attachment 451675
But even the thinner vic I’ve had felt better than the ELMC. My californian weighed about 3lbs. It felt paper thin. My lightest vic jackets were around 4-4.5lb. But it’s certainly true that each batch of leather is different and as I said up until recently I absolutely hated vic. I considered it to be the worst leather ever. The first seal brown vic jacket I had being the absolute worst. This one:
View attachment 451670
But this ^ still felt better than the ELMC. For me that jacket was just awful. Too thin, crispy feeling hide. Just not good, even for a deliberate attempt at a lightweight jacket. I felt that if I tried I could burst the sleeve seams by bending my arms. That’s not a flex, I’m not Arnold but they are cut super trim and combined with the thin leather, it was legit concern. There were other things about the jacket I disliked but that’s irrelevant. Suffice it to say I hated both equally.
View attachment 451674

I’m equally surprised to see a CXL jacket weigh 5lbs. I never had one that light, and I had a fair number of CXL jackets. So indeed to your point individual batches are everything.

It’s funny you considered that russety-seal 30s HB Vic to be your worst. I had that very jacket briefly after you let it go. Having owned probably close to 10 Vic jackets of different colors and varieties and I’ve often thought that 30s HB hide was one of the nicer ones!

 

[ton312]

It’s funny you considered that russety-seal 30s HB Vic to be your worst. I had that very jacket briefly after you let it go. Having owned probably close to 10 Vic jackets of different colors and varieties and I’ve often thought that 30s HB hide was one of the nicer ones!

For me, that one was just too thin feeling and too uniform/flat in color.

 

[58panheadfan]

Hmm... that's a fair question. Thanks.

I got a taste for HB quite late, ultimately thanks to @ton312 and 5* and now I'd like a "proper" HB.
The reason my jackets are all very similar is because I think the style suits me best.
With the trucker and cossack jackets I've found that I'm not such a button person, with the latter that I don't like a shawl collar.
I don't wear my Amelia Earhard jacket, which is actually great, because I like my others better and I don't like the bomber style and patch pockets for me.
So I will clean up my closet

Interestingly, what cut/leather did you have in mind when you asked?

I didn’t have a special cut/leather in mind when I asked… but thought myself why not to go another route this time instead to order a similar jacket/cut again and again… however I am looking forward to your project and finally most important, you should be happy with your new jacket if you go a new route or not…

 

[Grayland]

Have you considered goat?

 

[MrProper]

Have you considered goat?

In fact, I had briefly considered this since I read good things about Aeros goat.
But since I already have three jackets made of goat, I thought I'd rather take something I don't have yet (ok, Vicenza I already have too, but there I like the dark seal quite a bit).

 

[Spiney]

In fact, I had briefly considered this since I read good things about Aeros goat.
But since I already have three jackets made of goat, I thought I'd rather take something I don't have yet (ok, Vicenza I already have too, but there I like the dark seal quite a bit).

I’ve just been sent some leather samples from Aero. Seal and Dark Seal Vicenza, Seal Jerky HH and Seal Goat. The Goat is actually my favourite and what I’m going to order.

 

[Pandemic]

What did you decide on, Mr P?

I ask because I think you and I are looking at similar options. I want a medium weight with a fairly matte finish. I feel that I should get a brown jacket for variety, so dark Seal Vic is top of my list. But a part of my keeps gravitating to pics of well worn black jackets with lots of brown showing through (hence another blackened brown Vic or black jerky remain contenders).

 

[MrProper]

What did you decide on, Mr P?

I ask because I think you and I are looking at similar options. I want a medium weight with a fairly matte finish. I feel that I should get a brown jacket for variety, so dark Seal Vic is top of my list. But a part of my keeps gravitating to pics of well worn black jackets with lots of brown showing through (hence another blackened brown Vic or black jerky remain contenders).

View attachment 452327

I'm not quite sure yet.
Currently Seal jerky is on top of the list, although I like the color dark seal Vicenza better. But I already have Vicenza.
CXL I haven't completely ruled out yet because there is a midnight blue and that would be something different.
Let's see lol

 

[Imuricecreamman]

If I were to do a 1930 halfbelt I'd ask for grainy chestnut badalassi. I had Tobacco badalassi on another jacket and it was the most vivid color of any leather I've seen. Mine came completely smooth though so I would specify grainy this time. Chestnut didn't exist when I ordered mine and I probably would have ordered that since it seems quite a few shades darker than tobacco. The squeeks didn't bother me, but they were most difinately there.