What's the real deal with Sam Walker jackets?

[handymike]

For about a year and a half I've been looking to Sam Walker jackets as a less expensive alternate to Aero. But one just sold for $600!!!
So, apart from the politics of whatever happened years back between the two businesses (Aero/Sam Walker)- Can anyone here speak to the details of the jackets?
Here's what I've observed in several EBay auctions:
I purchased a Sam Walker Horsehide halfbelt 38 last year.
It was labeled as "quality Horsehide" but definitely wasn't Horween Aero style horse. And a 38 fit more like a 36.
Many have written that there Sam Walker Highwayman jackets are Horsehide, but extremely heavy...could they actually be steer? Most are tagged "quality Hide".
Sellers say a lot of things... I was bidding on a Tan one that the seller swore was horse and made by Aero, but Aero doesn't sell Horsehide in tan....
If anyone out there can help me figure it all out, I'd appreciate it.
I do know that the older Sams have Talon zips and the later ones have YKK.....
Thanks again!

 

[wild_balls]

I just sold the sam walker for 600 dollars on ebay! It is a stunning jacket with beautiful brown color and an awesome hide that I for sure can say is at least as good as Aeros Horween, I would never have sold this jacket if it was my size.
It is a size 38 but it is slightly larger than my Aero highwayman size 38! If you take a close look at the seams you can see that the one who made this jacket sure has the skill of a experienced craftsman.
It has talon zipper. I have never seen another sam walker than this one in real life,
The only thing I can say is that it is a remarkable jacket, shame it was a tad large. As I am an owner of several Aeros I can say that this particular sam walker are second to none.
Maybe it went to someone on the lounge!!!

Cheers Joakim

 

[handymike]

That one was a beauty!
Congratulations on the sale.
The size did seem a bit large for a 38. That's also something I've noticed; the SW Highwayman Jacket runs larger than you'd expect.
Thanks for the info, again congrats!

 

[Plumbline]

It should be noted that only SOME Sam Walker jackets were manufactured by Aero ... the source of the dispute was that Sam Walker managed to source an alternative manufacturer and used the Aero designs as a template and had these jackets manufactured by a firm other than Aero. Naughty ( as I have said in previous posts) and morally a little bit dubious but not ILLEGAL in so far as I understand.

I have owned 3 or 4 Sam Walkers .. a couple of Highwayman clones ( I believe), one Barnstormer clone (I believe), one "Aero" Sam Walker Barnstormer. I no longer have any of these but I have to say the non-Aero jackets are a little neat ( prob a size down vs an Aero) and the quality of the hide .. while not bad ... isn't like Aero.

The Aero Sam Walkers are ALMOST JUST LIKE AN AERO's even down to the Alpaca lining .... the non Aero's are very close but don't have the same quality of construction ... they are VERY similar to the Aero "Thunder Bay" jackets.

I wouldn't hesitate to buy one ... they are REALLY good jackets .... but to use a Malt Whisky analogy if an Original Aero is a Johnnie Walker Blue Label .... the "Aero" Sam Walker is a Black Label ...... still very nice but just a shade not as good .... and the Sam Walker is a Red still very drinkable but you wouldn't bring it out to impress your guests

Hope this helps

 

[Davy Crockett]

I'm fairly sure that Holly from Aero has posted on here before saying that Sam Walker was once a retailer of Aero jackets but at no time did Aero ever make jackets for Sam Walker with a Sam Walker label sewn into them! all the Aero jackets sold by Sam Walker carried the Aero label, and I believe they fell out after Sam Walker copied the Highwayman using another company to manufacture these jackets.

D

 

[HoosierDaddy]

I'm fairly sure that Holly from Aero has posted on here before saying that Sam Walker was once a retailer of Aero jackets but at no time did Aero ever make jackets for Sam Walker with a Sam Walker label sewn into them! all the Aero jackets sold by Sam Walker carried the Aero label, and I believe they fell out after Sam Walker copied the Highwayman using another company to manufacture these jackets.

D

Exactly...Ken Calder explained this as well years ago on another forum.
HD

 

[Plumbline]

Then Sam Walker must have copied the jackets even down to the label in the inside pocket with the initials of the machinist who made it ... who actually worked for Aero at the time. Most of the Aero Copies had subtle differences e.g. the inside pockets on Aero Barnstormer jackets are quite unique in that they consist of a zig-zag cut pocket placard sewn into the lining ... most of the copies I have seen did not include this feature and had a more traditionally tailored solution ... a small number did. Indeed the Alpaca lining on the "Aero" Sam Walker Barnstormer was identical to that used on the Aero Barnstormer (Weight, Weave and Cut) ........... indeed I sent my Sam Walker Barnstormer to Aero to have the lining re-stitched at the bottom .... and was told that it was in fact manufactured BY AERO ....

So to hear that Ken and Holly both denied this is interesting to say the least .....

 

[rocketeer]

I have had two Sam Walker jackets, a Highwayman and a half belt. Both dead ringers for Aero's original versions.
The Highwayman was awful, looked like it was made of rubber, probably a steer hide but with a not very good finish. originally black, this one had a 'greenish' sheen to it. Zip was a large YKK, stitching was wider apart and wonky in places. Lining of Black Watch wool but not good quality and storm cuffs sewn with a twist in one.
The Half belt was a little better. Hide was ok, large Talon zip, same features as Highwayman version.
Both won on the Bay for less than £75, I think the Highwayman clone was £35 and the Half belted design around £66.
Not rubbish but I would never pay decent money for one.
Johnny Tee

 

[handymike]

I've heard that Aero sold in the SW shop, but that all the Aero's were labeled as such.
My questions are really aimed at the jackets labeled Sam Walker and "genuine Hide" vs " genuine Horsehide"
Any knowledge on the labels? Funny that the SW tags look a lot like the northeastern flying togs, and Alexander leather labels too....(just an observation).
Thanks guys!

 

[Sloan1874]

I've heard that Aero sold in the SW shop, but that all the Aero's were labeled as such.
My questions are really aimed at the jackets labeled Sam Walker and "genuine Hide" vs " genuine Horsehide"
Any knowledge on the labels? Funny that the SW tags look a lot like the northeastern flying togs, and Alexander leather labels too....(just an observation).
Thanks guys!

Don't think the similarities with AL stop at the labels either...

 

[rocketeer]

I've heard that Aero sold in the SW shop, but that all the Aero's were labeled as such.
My questions are really aimed at the jackets labeled Sam Walker and "genuine Hide" vs " genuine Horsehide"
Any knowledge on the labels? Funny that the SW tags look a lot like the northeastern flying togs, and Alexander leather labels too....(just an observation).
Thanks guys!

Mine were both Sam Walker labelled but cant remember whether it was 'Genuine' or Horse, Dont think it had either because it said on the label. "????? Flying Togs The best leather jackets in the world", also has a hand written label probably copying Aero's one maker one jacket idea was present.
In any shop in any high street you can find Highwayman clones. Usually the leather is split down the back rather than one piece and made from napper lamb, a poor quality hide often used to produce cheap bike jackets and the like from the far east and Asia.

 

[Plumbline]

Don't think the similarities with AL stop at the labels either...

You're right ..... Both Alexanders and Aero's will have been made by the same people

 

[HoosierDaddy]

Originally Posted by rocketeer
So as suspected Sam Walker liked Aero's products so much they stopped selling Aero clothing, directly copied their[Aero's] designs, made them slightly inferior(YKK zips, poorer quality hides) and stuck a label inside telling the world Sam Walker made
"The Best Leather Jackets In The World"
So now you know when you see an eBay or similar auction stating "Made for Sam Walker by Aero" someone is telling fibs.


You're right, Aero NEVER put Sam Walker labels in the jackets we sold to them. Any jacket bearing a Sam Walker label was NOT made by Aero, this is 100% fact.
cloudylemonade

 

[Sloan1874]

Sounds like a twist on the old Remington razor ad: "I liked the product so much, I had to copy their most successful design..." As I said, same could possibly said of AL...

 

[Davy Crockett]

Also, to the best of my knowledge Sam Walker own labelled jackets never had a label specifying which leather was used!

D

 

[Edward]

Then Sam Walker must have copied the jackets even down to the label in the inside pocket with the initials of the machinist who made it ... who actually worked for Aero at the time. Most of the Aero Copies had subtle differences e.g. the inside pockets on Aero Barnstormer jackets are quite unique in that they consist of a zig-zag cut pocket placard sewn into the lining ... most of the copies I have seen did not include this feature and had a more traditionally tailored solution ... a small number did. Indeed the Alpaca lining on the "Aero" Sam Walker Barnstormer was identical to that used on the Aero Barnstormer (Weight, Weave and Cut) ........... indeed I sent my Sam Walker Barnstormer to Aero to have the lining re-stitched at the bottom .... and was told that it was in fact manufactured BY AERO ....

So to hear that Ken and Holly both denied this is interesting to say the least .....

The obvious answer is that prior to sourcing stock elsewhere, the Sam Walker people bought in Aeros and changed the labels themselves.

 

[Plumbline]

Sounds like a twist on the old Remington razor ad: "I liked the product so much, I had to copy their most successful design..." As I said, same could possibly said of AL...

Depends on who designed them ..................................

 

[Plumbline]

I agree Edward .... and there may be some of this unfortunately. All I can say is that some of my Sam Walker labeled jackets were AS NEAR AS IDENTICAL to their Aero equiv. Some were clearly NOT and those that were not were quite obvious.

 

[Edward]

I agree Edward .... and there may be some of this unfortunately. All I can say is that some of my Sam Walker labeled jackets were AS NEAR AS IDENTICAL to their Aero equiv. Some were clearly NOT and those that were not were quite obvious.

Such a change in quality would tend to suggest a change in supplier.

 

[Sloan1874]

Can you imagine somebody in Aero saying "Och, it's kinda greenish looking, and has a rubberised feel, but who'll notice? Off it goes!"