What is Vintage

[Foofoogal]

I see this all just as I see the idea that Everyone can make a MIllion Dolllars on ebay and/or everyone can be as a seller of old stuff and call themselves an antique dealer.

what we're getting into here is the difference between what "insiders" consider Vintage with a capital V, and what the general public considers "vintage" with a small v.

not to get fftopic: but really the very same thing.

I honestly believe there is a new group of people that could care less if it is old or looks old. This to be honest alarms me greatly. For history sakes.

Reproduction...sure....but vintage. nah.

Even if it is made from fabric from 1939 and a pattern from 1939 and thread from 1939....the dress itself did not exist in 1939....

A reproduction of a 1939 dress made with vintage materials.
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ok Lizzie. Am I way off base?

This can be said about things all across the categories of "vintage"
It is very hard to tell the real thing on alot of things and with the mindset of lately I fear it will only get harder and less people will be able to tell.

For sake of discussion. Say someone drills a hole in a stoneware bowl to make into a lighting device. Some kid 30 years from now may just think it is a lighting device and never know the intent of the original design. Not too far fetched I don't think.

 

[miserabelle]

Technically in Fashion, 'vintage' applies to anything that isn't of the current season. It is a bit odd to see nineties 'vintage' though, in my mind if I remember it, then it's just old... but I am a young 'un xx

 

[Elaina]

In a fashion textbook published this year I ran across, they had vintage pre-1979 and antique being pre-1930 in textiles and patterns.

As to garments, I make clothing. They happen to be from vintage and retro patterns, but I use whatever textiles I want, including vintage ones. Most of the time for ease on my own blog (since it's sewing focused and my visitors come for the sewing, not a discussion on vintage) I don't bother with the distinction. I may title it "Vintage Vogue 1234" since the pattern is vintage, but I don't recall ever calling them vintage or reproductions.

On copying, if I copy a garment or line drawing to get a usable pattern, I do call those copies, since that's what I did. I may have to draft it, but I did it from something to have a copy made of it (again, I only go into this on a blog/sewing friends/people who care).

Like Lizzie, most of the time I just say "I made it" or "I made it from a vintage pattern" depending on how the question is asked.

 

[C-dot]

I would put "vintage" at least 40 years back.

Which is probably why it bothers me to see girls like this called vintage: http://la.racked.com/uploads/2008_12_nicole.jpg

I guess 2003 is considered a "vintage" era.

 

[ShoreRoadLady]

And this is why I stick with "vintage style". It's easier!

Generally speaking, "vintage" as applied to clothing seems to refer to the decades between 1920-1970, though you'll frequently see things from 1980-90 referred to as "vintage" - generally in Ebay listings. IMHO, the better term for 1970-2000 clothes would be "retro". But a lot of people call anything from 1950-2000 "retro". As we use it today, the term's pretty vague.

Basic rule of thumb seems to be that if your parents wore it, it's retro (or outdated!). If your grandparents or great-grandparents wore it, it's vintage.

 

[C-dot]

Basic rule of thumb seems to be that if your parents wore it, it's retro (or outdated!). If your grandparents or great-grandparents wore it, it's vintage.

That should be the new rule of thumb! It can apply to future generations aswell! :eusa_clap

 

[Elaina]

And this is why I stick with "vintage style". It's easier!

Generally speaking, "vintage" as applied to clothing seems to refer to the decades between 1920-1970, though you'll frequently see things from 1980-90 referred to as "vintage" - generally in Ebay listings. IMHO, the better term for 1970-2000 clothes would be "retro". But a lot of people call anything from 1950-2000 "retro". As we use it today, the term's pretty vague.

Basic rule of thumb seems to be that if your parents wore it, it's retro (or outdated!). If your grandparents or great-grandparents wore it, it's vintage.

ROFL both of my parents had me later in life, so most of the things on here would be retro by that definition.

 

[jamespowers]

"Oooh, I love your vintage dress," it's not really worth the trouble to explain, "No, see, I made this dress from a 1937 pattern using contemporary fabric and notions, except for the buttons, which are old stock from 1950 so it's actually semi-authentic vintagesque repro, but thank you."

I'd love to see that discussion.
My favorite comment came from a friend of mine who is 75. He asked me about my vintage suit. I told him it was from 1938. He siad I took really good care of my clothes. I haven't owned it since new! lol lol lol lol

 

[ShoreRoadLady]

ROFL both of my parents had me later in life, so most of the things on here would be retro by that definition.

Oops. I guess I was thinking of my own age. lol Let's say 20-40 years back is retro...

 

[reetpleat]

I have always considered vintage to be before 1980 or so. Partly, because when I was a dealer, 80s stuff was still not in yet. But more than that, 70s stuff is still distinctly different and recognizable as old. Both due to style and quality, weight, fabric etc. although you occasionally see new stuff that can fool the eye as far as 70s. Besides that, there is still a cut and quality difference. Anything newer is not only not that old, but made in pretty much the same way, and not all that distinct or different. Sure, you sometimes see crazy 80s stuff, but it could just as easily be some designers rip off of the original.

so to me, saying vintage means something older that is appreciated both for its quality and distinctly different look from modern clothing. I can appreciate someone wearing something cool or unusual from the seventies, either in a creative or period correct way as a fellow appreciator of old clothes.

As for the 80s trend, just seems kind of dumb. the stuff is neither good looking, interesting, or well made. Granted, the kids love it. but I think they a just trend followers, not truly appreciating it. Old crank that I am.

As for retro, it used to mean 70s, but now seems to be a description of new clothes done in a kind of vintage style. A lot of rockabilly stuff is retro. never would fool any knowledgeable person, but is not trying to. it is a style in and of itself.

As for copies of old, I guess i would call it done in the vintage style, but not vintage.

 

[Elaina]

Oops. I guess I was thinking of my own age. lol Let's say 20-40 years back is retro...

lol, nah it's actually the rule of thumb I used to hear when I was younger and starting to wear retro and vintage clothing, but always was told to apply it to "Normal kids" instead (which would immerse me firmly in the late 60s and 70s like most people my age, instead of the 40's, 50's and early 60s of my parents).

I've always kind of followed my dad's age on style, so to me it's less actually "vintage" and "retro" as "I dress kinda like my dad." (If my dad would have been a woman, of course.)

And no, my dad doesn't approve.

 

[jamespowers]

I have always considered vintage to be before 1980 or so. Partly, because when I was a dealer, 80s stuff was still not in yet. But more than that, 70s stuff is still distinctly different and recognizable as old. Both due to style and quality, weight, fabric etc. although you occasionally see new stuff that can fool the eye as far as 70s. Besides that, there is still a cut and quality difference. Anything newer is not only not that old, but made in pretty much the same way, and not all that distinct or different. Sure, you sometimes see crazy 80s stuff, but it could just as easily be some designers rip off of the original.

so to me, saying vintage means something older that is appreciated both for its quality and distinctly different look from modern clothing. I can appreciate someone wearing something cool or unusual from the seventies, either in a creative or period correct way as a fellow appreciator of old clothes.

As for the 80s trend, just seems kind of dumb. the stuff is neither good looking, interesting, or well made. Granted, the kids love it. but I think they a just trend followers, not truly appreciating it. Old crank that I am.

As for retro, it used to mean 70s, but now seems to be a description of new clothes done in a kind of vintage style. A lot of rockabilly stuff is retro. never would fool any knowledgeable person, but is not trying to. it is a style in and of itself.

As for copies of old, I guess i would call it done in the vintage style, but not vintage.

I am not sure I can go with including the 1970s or even the late 60s stuff as vintage. Polyester and lousy cuts make it clearly distinct from 50s and earlier clothing and other items for that matter. For some reason, everything went to poo-poo after the mid 1960s in terms of quality in general.
Granted that there was indeed a planned obsolescence previously but people still demanded quality and, in the end, the products they produced were at least durable and lasted quite long even if the execs leading the company had a different idea. Call it pride in workmanship---even on the assemblyline---or whatever you want but things were meant to last back then. Heck, I am still driving a 52 year old truck nearly every day. I don't think they meant it to last that long but it has with minor PM.
1970s clothes are pretty easy to detect due to style quality and fabric and that is actually a bad thing for those items.

 

[jamespowers]

lol, nah it's actually the rule of thumb I used to hear when I was younger and starting to wear retro and vintage clothing, but always was told to apply it to "Normal kids" instead (which would immerse me firmly in the late 60s and 70s like most people my age, instead of the 40's, 50's and early 60s of my parents).

I've always kind of followed my dad's age on style, so to me it's less actually "vintage" and "retro" as "I dress kinda like my dad." (If my dad would have been a woman, of course.)

And no, my dad doesn't approve.

You sort of had my life experience then. Dad got out of High school in 1948 and Ma in 1955 so they were of a different generation than my friend's parents who did not have older children. I had a friend with a similar life experience but many of his siblings were nearly old enough to be his parents.

 

[Elaina]

My oldest brother is 15 years older then I am, then it stair steps down to 8. I have a half sister 6 years older then I am, and one 20 years younger. Makes it interesting sometimes when I find something cool and my dad's like...that was crap then. *makes grumpy face*

 

[jamespowers]

My oldest brother is 15 years older then I am, then it stair steps down to 8. I have a half sister 6 years older then I am, and one 20 years younger. Makes it interesting sometimes when I find something cool and my dad's like...that was crap then. *makes grumpy face*

Funny thing is that I was wearing vintage back then as hand me downs and old stuff from when my father was young was still wearable. I still have his 1930s sweater that I absolutely hated to wear. It was hot and itchy. I'll have to inflict that on my son when he gets big enough to wear it. lol lol lol

 

[Elaina]

Funny thing is that I was wearing vintage back then as hand me downs and old stuff from when my father was young was still wearable. I still have his 1930s sweater that I absolutely hated to wear. It was hot and itchy. I'll have to inflict that on my son when he gets big enough to wear it. lol lol lol

There my son was fortunate. I have a few siblings I'm not close to, and another long story, so mine was the first boy around since my brothers. Now my older brother has 2 boys and the clothes I've made/bought for my son aren't "name brand enough" or are vintage he's picked out ("not cool enough"), so I keep them in a box for when he gets older/someone can use them.

My sister tried to save her 70s clothes for me, and I refused to wear them. My mom did sew, so I wasn't stuck (thank God.)

 

[YETI]

As I recall, for appraisers an item(clothes,furniture,jewelry,etc.) is considered vintage if it's at least 30 yrs. old and an antique 70+.

 

[jamespowers]

There my son was fortunate. I have a few siblings I'm not close to, and another long story, so mine was the first boy around since my brothers. Now my older brother has 2 boys and the clothes I've made/bought for my son aren't "name brand enough" or are vintage he's picked out ("not cool enough"), so I keep them in a box for when he gets older/someone can use them.

My sister tried to save her 70s clothes for me, and I refused to wear them. My mom did sew, so I wasn't stuck (thank God.)

70s clothes!? It was bad enough to have some of those when they were new. That red leisure suit still gives me nightmares. :eusa_doh:
I would put those clothes away well stored for his children----you never know.
My mother saved some of the wedding gifts she got. They got to me when I got married. Mixers and kitchen tools were much better made fifty years ago.

 

[jamespowers]

As I recall, for appraisers an item(clothes,furniture,jewelry,etc.) is considered vintage if it's at least 30 yrs. old and an antique 70+.

Appraisers are just looking for a selling point for auctions in many cases. [huh]
Antiques should be 100 years old or older. Its not like we have to adjust it back as if you wait long enough it will be old enough. Imagine a nehru jacket will be an antique in our lifetime--maybe. :eusa_doh:

 

[YETI]

Funny thing is that I was wearing vintage back then as hand me downs and old stuff from when my father was young was still wearable. I still have his 1930s sweater that I absolutely hated to wear. It was hot and itchy. I'll have to inflict that on my son when he gets big enough to wear it. lol lol lol

During my freshman year in hs, I wore my dad's old 60s sharkskin trousers with Chuck Taylors and a t-shirt. I had no clue of vintage. All I cared about was that the pants had a cool drape with a nice taper and almost highwater look. Pegged pants were big in the early-mid 80s. I do regret wearing to shreds my pop's big e Levi's back then. I thought that selvedge seam was weird. :eusa_doh: