What do you look for in a Custom / Bespoke / MTO / MTM jacket?

[Canuck Panda]

Is it sizing? (Shoulder, P2P, lengths, widths...etc.)

Is it design? (extra pockets, no pockets, different cuffs, different backs, fronts, collars, overall style...etc.)

Is it material? (different leathers, different fabrics, different zippers...etc.)

***EDIT*** Is it value?

***EDIT*** Is it practicality / versatility?

Is it anything other than the three above? Please specify.

Not trolling, genuinely asking this question. Just came to me actually. Would like to hear all opinions on this matter. Thanks.

 

[MrProper]

Sizing

 

[Marc mndt]

-Designs that aren't available otr.

-Leather options that aren't available otr

 

[photo2u]

1. Design.
2. Leather quality.
3. Construction methods.
4. Hardware.

 

[blobsterroll]

The price bro (jk... kinda) funny how I messed with +/-$2K jackets and then I went full circle and end up with a Schott (sub $1K)

In seriousness; I guess the "fit" and whether or not it fits the rest of my wardrobe.

I am not into heritage wear, I am more basic/IG/pinterest tier of dude. So I take that into consideration. Most of all, if it "flatters", thats why I gave up on Japanese jackets. The elongated fit just dont sit well with me.

When I went home to CONUS last week I visited the leather jacket shops in NYC (Schott, 3Sixteen, Self-Edge, S&S). Where I also learned that the numbers of P2P, Shoulder width, etc. is all subjective to some extent, and is at the mercy of patterns. You really have to try the thing on at the store.

Y2 ($2.5K)- Didnt pick it up because its too roomy at the body really good when zipped up, not so much when open. The leather is a bit rubbery for my taste.
Flathead ($2.5K) - The shoulders are WIDE, I think they made this for skinny 6 foot plus dudes with wide shoulders.
PER70 ($1.1K) - I came to Schott for this, only to find that the pattern and the theoretical proper shoulder and p2p did not work with everything else.
Schott 618HH ($995 + $100 collar - 15% MIL discount) - They tweaked the recipe from 3 years ago and it works for me. Theoretically should not work based on the p2p, shoulder measurements

A sub $1K leather jacket blew the rest out the water. At some point it becomes diminishing return. You can go custom and wait 4 months and get something with the details that you (and this forum) will notice, or I can go OTR and be 99% happy?

/rant

 

[ObiJuanValdez]

For me, it was the specific combination of leather, color, and lining fabric in the style/pattern that I liked. I was absolutely not going to find that OTR.

 

[Canuck Panda]

Added Value to my original question post. Not just pricing as in numbers, but more return on money spent, so value.

I agree with everything said so far. Looking for what am I missing, other than size (fit), design (a different type of fit), material (quality), value (return on investment, happiness with product).

The biggest reason I can think of why I would want to go custom right now, today, is so that I will have a jacket that no one else will have. And it's gotta tick all the other boxes too, size, design, material, value...etc.

 

[blobsterroll]

so that I will have a jacket that no one else will have.

Best part about leather jackets bro, no two are alike good luck with this quest, Double Helix accepts custom orders AFAIK. But they only have one type of leather.

 

[Canuck Panda]

Best part about leather jackets bro, no two are alike good luck with this quest, Double Helix accepts custom orders AFAIK. But they only have one type of leather.

Yeah I am wearing just a basic leather CHP today and I just went out to grab a sandwich for lunch and in a small block radius of 100 people I am the only one wearing leather. haha. Leather for life for me.

 

[Aloysius]

PER70 ($1.1K) - I came to Schott for this, only to find that the pattern and the theoretical proper shoulder and p2p did not work with everything else.
Schott 618HH ($995 + $100 collar - 15% MIL discount) - They tweaked the recipe from 3 years ago and it works for me. Theoretically should not work based on the p2p, shoulder measurements

It's amazing how clearly the 618 blows the others out of the water there.

The issue with the PER line is that the alpha sizing makes it impossible to dial in the sizing in most cases. The M is usually pretty close to (though not exactly) a 40 in the corresponding jacket, but the S is a bit smaller than a 38, the L a bit bigger than a 42 etc. Can't dial in the size like you can with the 613/618/118/141/641.

 

[blobsterroll]

It's amazing how clearly the 618 blows the others out of the water there.

The issue with the PER line is that the alpha sizing makes it impossible to dial in the sizing in most cases. The M is usually pretty close to (though not exactly) a 40 in the corresponding jacket, but the S is a bit smaller than a 38, the L a bit bigger than a 42 etc. Can't dial in the size like you can with the 613/618/118/141/641.

Agreed. The small is too small, and the M is too large. Schott really needs to stop with the 26" cross zip motorcycle-inspired jackets, its just not going to work. It just looks off.

Full transparency, this is not a perfect fit. Since I have a 41" chest and this only have a 21-21.5" P2P it does pull a bit on the chest if I zip it all the way up and pull my elbows together behind me, even with just a shirt. A concern because I maybe stressing the grainier left panel that it may rip. I might put lexol in it to help with tensile strength.

Again, 99% happy with it. I truly dont believe there is a jacket that will keep me (read; us) 100% happy, 100% of the time.

 

[Aloysius]

Agreed. The small is too small, and the M is too large. Schott really needs to stop with the 26" cross zip motorcycle-inspired jackets, its just not going to work. It just looks off.

Full transparency, this is not a perfect fit. Since I have a 41" chest and this only have a 21-21.5" P2P it does pull a bit on the chest if I zip it all the way up and pull my elbows together behind me, even with just a shirt. A concern because I maybe stressing the grainier left panel that it may rip. I might put lexol in it to help with tensile strength.

Again, 99% happy with it. I truly dont believe there is a jacket that will keep me (read; us) 100% happy, 100% of the time.

How come you didn't size up one? The PTP only goes up by 1" per size.

 

[blobsterroll]

How come you didn't size up one? The PTP only goes up by 1" per size.

Sizing up and the rest of the jacket will be too big and will open up to be too big later on. The hem on this is 19" the 42 has a 21" IIRC. The arms on the 42 wont be slim and the sleeves will be long etc.

I can live with this P2P since I dont layer with heavy layers anyways, and I would rarely zip it all the way up like in the pic (and it dont fit as tight either, no other places pull like his traps/shoulder area does) and even rarer will I bring my bent elbows together to the back while its zipped up like I dont see myself doing that in my daily life, the sleeves also ends where I want it to end. With this thin, crunchier horsehide, it will probably stretch over time.

The armhole height and shape, my body structure, and where I carry my mass, where the widest point of my chest is, the pattern, underarm footballs etc. makes it work albeit by a margin. Even enough to layer at least a generic hoodie.

When I come back to NYC next and decide to cop a 613SH, I def will need to size up due to the lack of underarm footballs.

99%

Edit: To bring this thread back, how about practicality? Will you ride motorcycles with it? What will you be doing while wearing the jacket?

 

[zebedee]

It really depends. Extended travel and I'll look for practicality (lots of pockets and medium length, so not a CR, probably a Long Half Belt). Day to day a goat half-belt works well, or a CR. In really cold climates I'll be in a hoodie and anything in heavy hides. Price is a big factor (I can, but just won't, pay over 700-800 quid for a jacket, so I'm really happy with SB now), but cuts I have no real knowledge of - I know what I think fits me and I'm ok with that.

My best purchases have been an Aero Maxwell in medium cordovan tumbled HH, a Highwayman in brown HH (only drawback is that it's overly heavy for where I am most of the year) and an SB Klondike in black goat. CRs are great, but they're pub jackets for me unless one of them is the only one I have in a cupboard wherever I am.

 

[TartuWolf]

As someone who has gone custom with Aero and very happy with the result I'll add my thoughts as well.
1 . Measurements / fit.
The main thing here for me is how it fits bellow the chest. Ideally I need a "Y" shape and that's a very hard thing to get OTR as far as I know. I need the waist/naval to be at least as narrow or slightly narrower than the bottom hem. For example my Chopper was OK in the chest and the bottom hem, but I did not like the waist/naval at all as it had way too much space. Half belt cinches/straps DO help with this, but only so much.
As a MINIMUM being able to take a certain size and then specifying the body length and sleeve length is a no brainer to me as that is where people vary a lot.
2 . Materials.
For me the main thing about a leather jacket is the LEATHER. Being able to choose that is a huge bonus, especially with makers with a wide variety of choice. Being able to choose the lining and brass instead of nickel is very important to me as well.
3 . Design.
In some cases this is not very important. Like the hooch hauler where I love it as is. But in other cases it is essential. For example the Aero Vincent - I would not buy it as it is pictured. But if you let me add shoulder gussets, v yoke and a mouton collar - I'm completely sold, take my money.

For me it's a compromise vs dream jacket. 99% OTR jackets would be a compromise in one area or another. Maybe because I'm picky. I feel like I have the right to be picky when spending this much money. That's why I will never understand why would people buy Japanese OTR jackets for 1500-2500 and have no control over anything apart from the given size.

 

[nattevagten]

Schott 618HH ($995 + $100 collar - 15% MIL discount) - They tweaked the recipe from 3 years ago and it works for me.

What did they change? The old sizing didn’t work for me at all.

 

[blobsterroll]

What did they change? The old sizing didn’t work for me at all.

https://www.thefedoralounge.com/thr...an-answer-about-outerwear.102916/post-3055699

 

[IrishStu]

Is it sizing? (Shoulder, P2P, lengths, widths...etc.)

Is it design? (extra pockets, no pockets, different cuffs, different backs, fronts, collars, overall style...etc.)

Is it material? (different leathers, different fabrics, different zippers...etc.)

***EDIT*** Is it value?

Is it anything other than the three above? Please specify.

Not trolling, genuinely asking this question. Just came to me actually. Would like to hear all opinions on this matter. Thanks.

Mainly sizing and some small changes to things like linings and leather choice.

 

[Edward]

-Designs that aren't available otr.

-Leather options that aren't available otr

I think we do need to define 'custom' here. I interpreted it in the OP in the same way as Marc has here, it seems. Of the Aeros I've owned, most were bought new and (bar my Highwayman, bought from stock) were arguably "custom" as I specced the colour / hide / lining. My Bootlegger, though, is the one I would consider true custom as it varied from the standard pattern by having button cuffs in place of the 'engineer cuffs' the standard version carries.

Whether we're talking custom as in made to measure / made to order, or as is bespoke - featuring deviations from standard to a whole new pattern (across the wide range of makers out there), like Marc if I were stumping up for that in leather as in anything else, I'd be wanting something I just couldn't get otherwise. One day I'd love to have a Lewis Lightning custom ordered in as near to the original 1958 spec as possible - i.e. no chest logo and - to me more importantly - no forearm pocket. Those details matter to me, and that's what I would want going custom - otherwise, I'd be as happy with one off the rack, or used.

In truth, most of the time I'd much rather buy off the rack for just about anything - the dream is to have sufficient funds and access to suppliers that keep what I like in stock. That said, I'm a fairly average height / weight / size, or at the upper end of what is average round here, more or less, and don't often have trouble finding things to fit me. The only real limitation is budget, and the fact that the Chinese makers (within my budget) for many things outside of leather jackets tend not to go above a 38w in trousers, and the Japanese equivalents are.... well, they're lovely and more power to those who enjoy them, but I'd never wear a pair of jeans I'd paid three ton for anywhere that I'd wear jeans - and I'm emphatically not a "dress jeans" guy.

 

[nattevagten]

https://www.thefedoralounge.com/thr...an-answer-about-outerwear.102916/post-3055699

Good to hear that they fixed the pattern. The old size 40 (from the mid-2010s) felt oversized.