We are, we are, we are the mods.

[majormajor]

My memories of the Mod scene was that it was all over by 1964/65 and had split into modyobs who had started shaving their temples and were into fighting and were evolving into skinheads, and the emerging alternative scene. A certain type of Mod had always been involved in a crossover with the coffee bar beat and folk scene, and Bob Dylan was very popular. I remember having his first LP when no one in the mainstream in the UK seemed to know who he was.

Most people seem to associate Mods with the later revivals but 80% of the people I hung around with around 1963 wore parkas over Fred Perry and later Ben Sherman shirts and rode or aspired to scooters. Tweed three piece suits, co-respondents shoes, and the twenties look did become fashionable in the mid sixties but they didn't have much to do with mods by then. Though some mod girls did wear flapper dresses earlier than that and the influence was already there.

Your description of London Mods is pretty much as I described them. After 64, it was pretty much football gangs, interested in fighting. And yes, even in the North, we were buying Bob Dylan. Used to subscribe to Oz Magazine too, and even fewer folks in the UK knew about that back then.

As for everywhere north of Watford, the scene was different. Nowt to do with football. As I said, if you weren't part of the scene, you would have been in blissful ignorance of our existence, which was pretty much how we wanted it to be.

Here is a pic taken at around 7am on a Sunday morning after an All-nighter at the Twisted Wheel Club, in 1967 (you know - flowers in your hair - the summer of love?). Whether you want to deny their existence at that time is up to you, but I can assure you they were real. I can tell you their names if you like.

Revivalists are just that. So Weller & Wiggins can have there little moments. But they have NOTHING to do with this thread

 

[Two Types]

Brilliant picture. I would never have guessed that was 1967. You can clearly see the regimental tie worn by the chap on the left. It's amazing how smart they all look despite having been up all night.

 

[Sloan1874]

Fantastic pics, MM. I'm surprised what you said about the Small Faces though. I thought the thing was they were proper Mods and The Who were art schoolers. The denim thing is interesting. You see pics of Lennon in the late 60s wearing jeans that are not quite half-mast but almost. Was that the way they were worn, or just JL's own thang?

 

[majormajor]

Fantastic pics, MM. I'm surprised what you said about the Small Faces though. I thought the thing was they were proper Mods and The Who were art schoolers. The denim thing is interesting. You see pics of Lennon in the late 60s wearing jeans that are not quite half-mast but almost. Was that the way they were worn, or just JL's own thang?

Hi Craig

The SFs were certainly a group whose early influence was black RnB. And an early appearance at Pete Stringfellow's King Mojo Club in Sheffield in 1965 (they played there for free after getting booed off stage at a nearby Working Men's Club) inspired them to promote their "Mod" image. The only problem was that the mods had all about disappeared from London by then, so manager Don Arden (who knew bugger all about Mod style) turned to Carnaby Street - hence the rather garish clobber they then began sporting. Not really the northern Mod they were supposed to be emulating - and not really fully fledged Carnaby Street. Somewhere in between really - and when they fell out with Arden and went to Andrew Loog Oldham, the preppy togs were soon dispensed with....

Incidentally, the Mojo club, with an excellent DJ in Pete Stringfellow (and his oppo, Dinky Dawson), was THE club to go to in 1965/66. I attended in 1966. When it closed, the Twisted Wheel in Manchester took over as the place to be. Looking at Stringfellow now, with his (to me) slightly tacky girlie clubs, it is hard to imagine just how good the guy was back then.

Re the jeans, we took just as much care in getting our Levis and Lees the right length as we did with out mohair suits. Anyone who turned up to a club in half-mast jeans would probably have been either Drug Squad trying it on, or just a gimp. Either way, they would not have had many fruitful conversations with their fellow clubgoers!

BTW, in those days, jeans were generally NOT cuffed on the outside, as is common nowadays. Not by Mods anyway. Generally hemmed or cuffed on the inside......

 

[Two Types]

That's the first time I have ever heard anyone describe Peter Stringfellow as "slighty tacky"! That is the most moderate description ever given to him.

It's also interesting to hear your perspective on Stringfellow and about how good his early clubs were. I suppose it's the same as trying to compare Elvis in the fifties to Elvis in the seventies (or any other great band who start out cool and end up naff).

Sloan: I don't know about your description of the Who as 'art schoolers'. Townsend certainly was, but not the others: Entwhistle worked for Ealing council (I think) and Daltrey was a factory worker. But certainly not genuine mods. Their manager was on the scene and wanted a band so he as the connection. That said, I think the mods in Shepherds Bush/Ealing etc adopted them, so to an extent they could be described as a 'mod band' although not actually mods (if you see what I mean).

 

[majormajor]

Here's a pic of Pete Stringfellow (in the paisley shirt), at the last Mojo gig in late 1967...

 

[Two Types]

I know you've said it before, but this is more evidence that the modern perception of 1967 'summer of love' fashions, is so far wide of the mark. Crowded and with low ceilings - just how and club should be. The only way to see bands is in a small, cramped club.

Thanks for posting.

 

[Flat Foot Floey]

Interesting read. I am too young to have witnessed the original scene in the 60s but I used to party with members of the revival subculture. Less paisely here, more polo shirts and parkas. A few suits too but not too flashy as far as I remember. It kinda blends with the skinhead/suedehead style. Fortunately most skinheads are less aggressive now at Reggae, Ska and Soul events. All the boneheads went to simple rock or Oi! music. I think the mod drugs also went away but of course I don't have proof for that.

 

[Capesofwrath]

I know you've said it before, but this is more evidence that the modern perception of 1967 'summer of love' fashions, is so far wide of the mark. Crowded and with low ceilings - just how and club should be. The only way to see bands is in a small, cramped club.

Thanks for posting.

Depends who you were and where you were. In 1967 the alternative was well under way and in many clubs people were dressing very differently to these boys.

 

[majormajor]

Depends who you were and where you were. In 1967 the alternative was well under way and in many clubs people were dressing very differently to these boys.

Dead right. I don't think anyone is saying otherwise. But this thread is about the Mods. Is that a problem?

 

[Gene]

Figured I would chime in here. I was a "Mod" for a few years some years back. I was really into the suits, scooters and music. I still am really, definitely not die-hard like I used to be.

Our crew (me on the far right)

 

[Capesofwrath]

Dead right. I don't think anyone is saying otherwise. But this thread is about the Mods. Is that a problem?

Not to me priend, I was one. But like I said it was all over by the mid sixties. These kids are just dressing the way most fashionable kids were by then. Nothing particularly mod about it.

 

[Two Types]

Shall we just agree that there were geographical differences that divide this argument? Thus, whilst the notion of 'mod' might of been outdated in one area, it was still relevant elsewhere.

 

[majormajor]

As I said, the London Mods degenerated into Football gangs after 1964. No-one is denying that. If Cape wants to argue the toss, good for him. I've said all I'm saying in the subject

 

[Sloan1874]

Hi Craig

The SFs were certainly a group whose early influence was black RnB. And an early appearance at Pete Stringfellow's King Mojo Club in Sheffield in 1965 (they played there for free after getting booed off stage at a nearby Working Men's Club) inspired them to promote their "Mod" image. The only problem was that the mods had all about disappeared from London by then, so manager Don Arden (who knew bugger all about Mod style) turned to Carnaby Street - hence the rather garish clobber they then began sporting. Not really the northern Mod they were supposed to be emulating - and not really fully fledged Carnaby Street. Somewhere in between really - and when they fell out with Arden and went to Andrew Loog Oldham, the preppy togs were soon dispensed with....

Incidentally, the Mojo club, with an excellent DJ in Pete Stringfellow (and his oppo, Dinky Dawson), was THE club to go to in 1965/66. I attended in 1966. When it closed, the Twisted Wheel in Manchester took over as the place to be. Looking at Stringfellow now, with his (to me) slightly tacky girlie clubs, it is hard to imagine just how good the guy was back then.

Re the jeans, we took just as much care in getting our Levis and Lees the right length as we did with out mohair suits. Anyone who turned up to a club in half-mast jeans would probably have been either Drug Squad trying it on, or just a gimp. Either way, they would not have had many fruitful conversations with their fellow clubgoers!

BTW, in those days, jeans were generally NOT cuffed on the outside, as is common nowadays. Not by Mods anyway. Generally hemmed or cuffed on the inside......

I missed this when you first posted it. Fantastic photo and great insight in the Small Faces - it's amazing how a successful band's past is sandpapered to fit the fans' perception: "They were proper Mods, not like The Who", though I'd heard the early songs were so rudimentary to accommodate Steve Marriott's utter cack-handed playing - I'm not even sure he improved that much while he was in the band.
I'm surprised by your account of Stringfwellow being a bit of a diamond geezer and decent DJ to boot, but I suppose people change to suit their circumstances, and not always for the better. [huh] And the less said about the guy's hair, the better...

 

[Tommy]

an interesting link

http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/may/18/newsid_2511000/2511245.stm

 

[Flat Foot Floey]

There is a book... Mod: A Very British Style by Richard Weight

Don't know if it is any good. Maybe it only decribes the mainstream interpretation of mod?

 

[Capesofwrath]

For example he calls the Mod Revival of 1979-82 ‘one of the oddest episodes in the history of British youth culture… they demonstrated how thin the wall was between a subculture being imaginatively reconfigured for a contemporary audience, and one that was merely being copied as an escape from the present’.

Yes I'd have to agree with that. Turning Japanese.

 

[RegentSt1965]

Ah, the battle of wills with the Burtons MTM manager over what I wanted, and what he thought was "trendy". The back that was incurably short ("the Beatles have it like that");
the lining that was pressed badly and showed below the back hem. But, they got the shoulders, lapels and trouser cuff size right!
Living in an area with a large expat Italian community meant I could eventually plug into the stock from the vans that ferried the real stuff through Europe to us benighted souls here in Surrey! Then the deals to supplement my school blazer allowance into a decent tailored Barathea one without a badge (I fashioned a clip on one for emergency use!) and to get decent grey flannels with the right taper and length. And the day Levis came into local stock - all those sizes (inches in waist increments) - lovingly treated to some bathing in the sea at Brighton and the the Ouse near Southend - it seemed to work, anyway.