USAuthentic A2 question about a detail

[Technonut]

There is one glaring inaccurate feature of the US Authentic A-2 (and others) pattern which cannot be 'fixed' without leaving stitch-holes visible.... The epaulet placement. The shoulder epaulets on the originals should lie centered over the shoulders, and not rolled towards the front.

Looking at pics in the other thread where you successfully applied the HWT it is noticeable, as on all US Authentic A-2's. This is especially evident due to the shoulder decal.. The epaulet should be centered directly over the decal, not rolled-over towards the front. This may not be a big-deal to many who are not concerned with accuracy, but bothers folks who are. In fact, Acme Depot goes on to say:

http://www.acmedepot.com/a2jacket/a2detail.html (Under 'Shell Construction')

One other characteristic which is often misrepresented by poorer replicas is the point of attachment of the back to the front pieces at the shoulder. Some replicas place this seam too far forward on top of the shoulder. Since the back edge of the epaulets is coincident with this seam, this construction often places the epaulets not on top of the shoulder, as with an authentic A-2, but falling forward off of the shoulder. This simply looks wrong if not altogether comical.

Here's a close-up of one of your pics to illustrate:

The US Authentic "is-what-it-is", and IMO, I would leave it alone... The previous recommendation of AVI's new Bronco pattern is a good one if you are indeed looking for an inexpensive, but accurate A-2 repro. I have owned two Good Wear Perry repros, and IMO, it would be a difficult and more than likely expensive task to make the US Authentic resemble the Perry.

Good Luck with whichever route you decide to take.

EDIT: Here's a pic showing the epaulet on one of the GW Perry's I owned (sold-on since I found it to be a bit large):

 

[kowalski]

This is a valuable note I did not know about! and I did not pay attention to it, very thanks for info
it's an option to think about

AVI's, ? this made in china, Pakistan or India ? no , thanks , sorry it's not my story.
Jacket a2 must be sewn ONLY in USA, here i am purist. ( it my fixation )

ps
question ; what about the collar, semi-circular or like is in GW 42-16175-P is no rounded ? which is ok?

 

[kowalski]

The shoulder epaulets on the originals should lie centered over the shoulders, and not rolled towards the front. in all model jacket ? whether only model Perry ?
i have Eastman and epaulets rolled toward sslightly the front.
I swear, I see it (rolled towards the front) in some also original ww2 A2
see

This is my Eastman and epaulets, it old jacket have 20 y ) Eastman mfg is considered to be very accurate repro

 

[Technonut]

The shoulder epaulets on the originals should lie centered over the shoulders, and not rolled towards the front. in all model jacket ? whether model Perry ?
i have Eastman and epaulets rolled toward sslightly the front.
I swear I see it in some also original ww2 A2
see
it me Eastman and epaulets, it very old jacket have plus minus 20 y ) Eastman mfg it is considered to be very accurate

Whoa!.... That is some serious epaulet roll to the front... I'm not aware of any wartime contract that had epaulet placement like that. It would definitely make applying a shoulder decal difficult to look 'right'. I have around 1000 pics of various wartime A-2's, and have not seen anything that extreme. I suggest that you look through Good Wears site, and look at the side view of JC's contracts with him wearing them.

From what I gather, older Eastman's were not the most accurate of A-2's. I have personally owned a couple, and was not happy with them. One had the pockets placed almost up to the armpits, and the other had SERIOUS epaulet / shoulder droop despite the measurements looking right for me..

EDIT: Acme Depot is much more knowledgeable than I when it comes to original construction of the A-2, and you read what they had to say about proper epaulet placement.. Straight across the tops of the shoulders.

 

[kowalski]

strange the more that it Limited edytion

I suggest that you look through Good Wears site, and look at the side view of JC's contracts with him wearing them.

That's what I did

From what I gather, older Eastman's were not the most accurate of A-2's. I have personally owned a couple, and was not .

maybe because at the beginning production, it's their beginnings

edit;

I will do as you advised.. with epouletes
narrow the sleeves ; yes
exchange buckle collar stand ; yes
other cuffs - yes

 

[Technonut]

That's what I did

Did you see any that were not sitting straight across the shoulder tops? Both of my Perry contracts did sit straight across the shoulder tops, as well as the GW Rough Wear 27752 I currently own:

 

[Technonut]

edit;

I will do as you advised.. with epouletes
narrow the sleeves ; yes
exchange buckle collar stand ; yes
other cuffs - yes

Eastman makes very accurate repros these days.. Have you considered perhaps selling-on some of your jackets and purchasing a new Eastman? If not, as I said, I wish you the best on your project, and will be looking for pics of the completed job.

 

[kowalski]

Did you see any that were not sitting straight across the shoulder tops?

View attachment 100672

No , not here when I find it I will paste it,Maybe it seemed to me, damn.

Both of my Perry contracts did sit straight across the shoulder tops, as well as the GW Rough Wear 27752 I currently own:

View attachment 100672

lucky !

 

[kowalski]

Have you considered perhaps selling-on some of your jackets .

not because I like them very much

purchasing a new Eastman?

Yes ,in good price if i find ....maybe GW

If not, as I said, I wish you the best on your project, and will be looking for pics of the completed job.

THANKS , VERY
Pics my complete job soon (2 week)
ps

I wonder just why they were able to sewn straight up with worse equipment for sewing and in worse conditions (it war time)
and now they can not, do not want to is it so hard? .Damn something is wrong
ps

my Eastman have epoulet more that USAuth paradox

 

[Technonut]

I wonder just why they were able to sewn straight up with worse equipment for sewing and in worse conditions (it war time)
and now they can not, do not want to is it so hard? .Damn something is wrong

The military has always been strict on such things....going back to the shoulder-boards which were used for rank many, many years ago. Yes, there were many mistakes made during wartime construction of A-2's. I have seen pics of one pocket being much higher up than the other, etc.. but I have yet to see epaulets not sitting straight across the shoulder-tops, but who knows, there may be some out there..

my Eastman have epoulet more that USAuth paradox

Yep, your US Authentic epaulets are more authentic than the older Eastman pics you posted for certain...

 

[kowalski]

The military has always been strict on such things....going back to the shoulder-boards which were used for rank many, many years ago. Yes, there were many mistakes made during wartime construction of A-2's. I have seen pics of one pocket being much higher up than the other, etc.. but I have yet to see epaulets not sitting straight across the shoulder-tops, but who knows, there may be some out there..

it true , and the people who sewed it were very often unqualified it time war unfortunately

Yep, your US Authentic epaulets are more authentic than the older Eastman pics you posted for certain...

this is the situation as our neighbors say, the Russians; it's funny and scary/.///
и смешно и страшно

 

[kowalski]

Eastman makes very accurate repros these days..

Of course, i have other A2 from Eastman LE ROUGH WEAR (only made from goat leather , it also an older model) and all is OK

 

[kowalski]

On the question epoulet .I found on a friendly (i have hope) forum pics Lost World A2 jacket I know that it is not cheap price 800-1000$) epaulets also rolled toward sslightly the front.
and no one paid any attention to? damn,



http://vintageleatherjackets.org/threads/lost-worlds-a2.19698/

 

[Technonut]

On the question epoulet .I found on a friendly (i have hope) forum pics Lost World A2 jacket I know that it is not cheap price 800-1000$) epaulets also rolled toward sslightly the front.
and no one paid any attention to? damn,



http://vintageleatherjackets.org/threads/lost-worlds-a2.19698/

I'm a member over there as well, and the Lost Worlds Dubow rendition is not regarded as being the most accurate in the world either.. At VLJ, Good Wear and Eastman are king where A-2 accuracy is concerned, and most popular.

Don't allow it to drive you crazy... No one except folks knowledgeable in original A-2 construction would probably notice, but as I posted before, if one is concerned with accuracy, epaulet placement not lying straight across the shoulder-tops is wrong..

 

[kowalski]

I'm a member over there as well, .

i know

Don't allow it to drive you crazy... .

if we knew only that day when it happened we would celebrate the anniversary (maybe it's the day you bought the first one A2

No one except folks knowledgeable in original A-2 construction would probably notice, .

I think that if he did not take it in his hand, there would also be a problem with guess of the company, model , details ect..
I mean here GW,BR ,ELC ...RMC .....

At VLJ, Good Wear and Eastman are king where A-2 accuracy is concerned, and most popular.

and DD

epaulet placement not lying straight across the shoulder-tops is wrong..

Now i know

 

[Technonut]

Yes, must not forget Diamond Dave.. RMNZ did great work when they were around also. I'm still sick about selling their Rough Wear 16159 I used to own some years back. Despite various incidents and forum-drama, Bill Kelso makes a nice A-2 as well...

Acme Depot sums it up pretty well regarding repros:

http://www.acmedepot.com/a2jacket/a2repro.html

A good rule of thumb in seeking a true-to-the-original A-2 replica is a familiar one: you get what you pay for. Expect to pay in the vicinity of US$500 to $1700 for a good one, and even in that range expect to find varying levels of authenticity in the smaller details as previously described. In seeking a new jacket one must decide upon the degree of authenticity which will satisfy them. One thing is for certain and that is that there will be a broad range from which to choose.

EDIT: Here's a pic of me wearing the RMNZ RW 16159 I mentioned.. Outstanding jacket IMO:

 

[kowalski]

Nice jacket ... and Harley sportster (?)


You look younger here

 

[Technonut]

Yep, 1998 Sportster Sport Edition.. Dual spark-plug heads.. VERY fast & fun to ride.

Damn, I just realized that pic is around 10-11 years old... Oh well, I'm an old-fart of close to 55 right now, but I do my best to take care of myself. Your English is quite good, and if you meant I look younger in the more recent pic above I posted, I appreciate the compliment my friend. However, I figure you meant I look younger in the pic with the bike. Must be my gray beard in the other pics floating around making me look old. Good thing I've shaved since those were taken.

 

[kowalski]

Yep, 1998 Sportster Sport Edition.. Dual spark-plug heads.. VERY fast & fun to ride.

I, know, I was riding , my friend have sportser 1200

Oh well, I'm an old-fart of close to 55 right now, but I do my best to take care of myself.

i have 50 and in the heart of the soul only 18 .me too, a lot of sport , my job requires it (prof fire)damn, and I can not wear beards

Your English is quite good

thanks, i constantly learn
EDIT;
Loost worlds in Acme ;

the Lost Worlds Dubow rendition is not regarded as being the most accurate in the world

I do not want to have the most accurate repro in the world ,because there is no such i think . everybody makes mistakes. even the best and not mistaken he who does nothing
http://www.acmedepot.com/a2jacket/eval_LWDubow.shtml
concerning epoulet ;
......The top seams across the shoulders joining the front and back panels appear to be placed forward about a half-inch or so more than is typical. This then moves the epaulets forward a bit more than usual, but it is not visibly problematic....

.....From the perspective of pure observation of original A-2 jackets, this reproduction could be made more authentic with a proper label and with modifications to the epaulet, zip, collar snap, and throat hook. The other premium repro makers have been successful with these details, so they are not out of reach.

Because I think it is qualitatively similar Lost worlds (I had it A2 in my hands ) vs USauth I intend to make these changes + sleeves , without epaulets for obvious reasons, and i make the grade

 

[kowalski]

but who knows, there may be some out there..

Yes, this is an example of the A2 ww2 epaulets which rolled towards the front




https://www.ebay.com/itm/310977057027?rmvSB=true