Unique or Creepy? - The story of a "red" dress

[Shangas]

Prior to 1939, I believe it was de-rigeur to salute the American flag by doing the Nazi salute. Like a lot of other things, that changed pretty quick during the war.

 

[Steven180]

Um...please credibly prove that one to me.

M.

 

[Shangas]

Um...please credibly prove that one to me.

M.

Hold on, I'll check.

EDIT: I've read it in other places, but the best reference I could find on short notice was on Wikipedia, regarding the pledge of alliegence of the USA:

Swearing of the Pledge is accompanied by a salute. An early version of the salute, adopted in 1892, was known as the Bellamy salute. It started with the hand outstretched toward the flag, palm down, and ended with the palm up. Because of the similarity between the Bellamy salute and the Nazi salute, developed later, President Franklin D. Roosevelt instituted the hand-over-the-heart gesture as the salute to be rendered by civilians during the Pledge of Allegiance and the national anthem in the United States, instead of the Bellamy salute. Removal of the Bellamy salute occurred on December 22, 1942, when Congress amended the Flag Code language first passed into law on June 22, 1942.

Was accompanied by this photograph, dated 1941:

Another photo of U.S. schoolchildren saluting the flag during the pledge, using what was then called the 'Bellamy Salute' or the 'Flag Salute'. Dated 1942:

According to Wikipedia, the salute for the American flag was officially changed in 1942 to its current gesture (hand-over-heart) due to the controversy of the similarity between the Flag Salute and the Nazi salute.

According to "Historyofthepledge.com":

Following World War I, attempts were made to provide for not only a standard salute but also a uniform national flag code. At the second of two flag conferences held in Washington, DC, in 1923 and 1924, it was agreed, again according to Ellis, that “All civilians should stand with ‘the right hand over the heart,’ and then at the words ‘to the Flag’ the right hand should be ‘extended, palm upward, toward the Flag.’ At the close of the Pledge the hand was to be dropped to the side.” This virtually duplicated the salute specified in the 1892 program developed by Upham and Bellamy. However, it was conceded that civilian adults could merely stand at attention, men removing their hats, to show respect during the Pledge. Military personnel were still to salute with the right hand to the forehead.

But by 1935, people were pointing out the embarrassing similarity between the German “Heil Hitler” salute to the Führer (arm extended, palm down) and the common raised arm salute to the flag during the Pledge (arm extended, palm up), a form that continued in use well into the United States’ entry into World War II. Over the next few years—despite objections by the United States Flag Association and the Daughters of the American Revolution, despite even an official congressional codification of flag rules and etiquette adopted in June 1942 that included the raised arm salute prescribed in 1924—many groups and school districts began eliminating the extended arm portion of the salute.

Only in December 1942 did Congress officially sanction an amended flag salute in which the right hand, or a hat removed by the right hand, is held over the heart during recitation of the Pledge.

Title 4, Chapter 1, section 4 of the United States Code, as modified January 22, 2002, entitled “FLAG AND SEAL, SEAT OF GOVERNMENT, AND THE STATES CHAPTER 1 - THE FLAG” reads as follows:

“The Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag . . . should be rendered by standing at attention facing the flag with the right hand over the heart. When not in [military] uniform men should remove their headdress with their right hand and hold it at the left shoulder, the hand being over the heart. Persons in uniform should remain silent, face the flag, and render the military salute.”

According to "Pledge of Allegiance, Francis Bellamy, Edward Bellamy, Looking Backward" :

The first description of the pledge had the palm of the hand turned upward for the straight-armed gesture. The gesture changed in use, growing into the "Heil Hitler" appearance because of the military salute (palm down) extended casually straight toward the flag.

James Bailey Upham suggested to Bellamy part of the gesture (the straight-arm with the palm upward). Upham’s suggested gesture (palm up) was like saying “Here is the flag.” It was because of Bellamy’s alteration (the addition of the military salute) that the pledge evolved into the Nazi-style.

Upham was also familiar with Bellamy's "military socialism" dogma because Edward Bellamy, cousin and cohort to Francis, had written of it in the international bestseller "Looking Backward" in 1888, and both Bellamys had been openly involved in the national socialism movement and the "Nationalist" magazine.

Edward Bellamy was a bitter West Point failure but he loved Prussian militarism and the educational system. According to Tom Peyser "On his deathbed, he wiled away the hours by arranging tin soldiers along the folds of his coverlet." That would interest all who loathe the National Socialist German Workers’ Party, because Prussia led to the formation of the German empire, and after World War I, Prussia continued to exist as the largest Land (state) within the Weimar Republic and under the National Socialist German Workers’ Party. After World War II it was dissolved by decree of the Allied Control Council in 1947.

Even with the palm turned upward, people would later see the relationship to the National Socialist German Workers' Party and that is why the straight-arm salute was disfavored in 1942, and the hand-over-the-heart was adopted. (On June 22, 1942, the pledge was included in the U.S. Flag Code, but Congress gave it the modern hand-over-the-heart gesture. There is probably one overriding reason why Congress interfered: to make everyone drop the straight-arm salute, which was becoming very embarassing and very revealing. The US had entered WWII on December 7, 1941 against Japan after Pearl Harbor. On December 11, 1941 Germany and Italy declared war on the United States and the U.S. declared war on Germany and Italy.)

 

[HoosierDaddy]

That is really something that I had never heard of before this....and would probably never believed without that pic. Amazing..!
HD

 

[V.C. Brunswick]

A friend of mine who had passed away a few years ago was born in 1931 and he remembered that kind of flag salute when he was a kid.

 

[Miss sofia]

YES. I'm all for repurposing, and there is a lovely irony in what was done with this.

At the end of the day, though.... it was only a flag. All flags - any flag - is nothing, nothing, more than a bit of cloth. To fear or revere a bit of cloth for its own sake is missing the point on a colossal scale. Fight the real enemy, and all that.

:eusa_clap:eusa_clap:eusa_clap

 

[Shangas]

That is really something that I had never heard of before this....and would probably never believed without that pic. Amazing..!
HD

See? You learn things here at the Fedora Lounge

 

[V.C. Brunswick]

And the Nazi salute (which Hitler had copied from Mussolini) was in turn a revival of the ancient Roman salute.

 

[Shangas]

That is also true. I'd forgotten that, V.C.B. Very true.

As they say. Nothing is ever truly new.

 

[Steven180]

At first defensive, I must admit, but today my brain earned a new wrinkle of knowledge...

I do appreciate the unique history lesson Shangas!

Thanks, M.

 

[Shangas]

You're welcome Steven M...SteveM? Yeah that's good...

Of course stuff like this isn't limited to WWII. During WWI in Australia, anything with a German connection was renamed. The German Shepherd (dog) was renamed the Alsatsian.

 

[Kaister]

The things I learn here. Thanks Patrick and Shangas for the history lessons.

 

[Deco-Doll-1928]

Hold on, I'll check.

EDIT: I've read it in other places, but the best reference I could find on short notice was on Wikipedia, regarding the pledge of alliegence of the USA:

Swearing of the Pledge is accompanied by a salute. An early version of the salute, adopted in 1892, was known as the Bellamy salute. It started with the hand outstretched toward the flag, palm down, and ended with the palm up. Because of the similarity between the Bellamy salute and the Nazi salute, developed later, President Franklin D. Roosevelt instituted the hand-over-the-heart gesture as the salute to be rendered by civilians during the Pledge of Allegiance and the national anthem in the United States, instead of the Bellamy salute. Removal of the Bellamy salute occurred on December 22, 1942, when Congress amended the Flag Code language first passed into law on June 22, 1942.

Was accompanied by this photograph, dated 1941:

Another photo of U.S. schoolchildren saluting the flag during the pledge, using what was then called the 'Bellamy Salute' or the 'Flag Salute'. Dated 1942:

According to Wikipedia, the salute for the American flag was officially changed in 1942 to its current gesture (hand-over-heart) due to the controversy of the similarity between the Flag Salute and the Nazi salute.

According to "Historyofthepledge.com":

Following World War I, attempts were made to provide for not only a standard salute but also a uniform national flag code. At the second of two flag conferences held in Washington, DC, in 1923 and 1924, it was agreed, again according to Ellis, that “All civilians should stand with ‘the right hand over the heart,’ and then at the words ‘to the Flag’ the right hand should be ‘extended, palm upward, toward the Flag.’ At the close of the Pledge the hand was to be dropped to the side.” This virtually duplicated the salute specified in the 1892 program developed by Upham and Bellamy. However, it was conceded that civilian adults could merely stand at attention, men removing their hats, to show respect during the Pledge. Military personnel were still to salute with the right hand to the forehead.

But by 1935, people were pointing out the embarrassing similarity between the German “Heil Hitler” salute to the Führer (arm extended, palm down) and the common raised arm salute to the flag during the Pledge (arm extended, palm up), a form that continued in use well into the United States’ entry into World War II. Over the next few years—despite objections by the United States Flag Association and the Daughters of the American Revolution, despite even an official congressional codification of flag rules and etiquette adopted in June 1942 that included the raised arm salute prescribed in 1924—many groups and school districts began eliminating the extended arm portion of the salute.

Only in December 1942 did Congress officially sanction an amended flag salute in which the right hand, or a hat removed by the right hand, is held over the heart during recitation of the Pledge.

Title 4, Chapter 1, section 4 of the United States Code, as modified January 22, 2002, entitled “FLAG AND SEAL, SEAT OF GOVERNMENT, AND THE STATES CHAPTER 1 - THE FLAG” reads as follows:

“The Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag . . . should be rendered by standing at attention facing the flag with the right hand over the heart. When not in [military] uniform men should remove their headdress with their right hand and hold it at the left shoulder, the hand being over the heart. Persons in uniform should remain silent, face the flag, and render the military salute.”

According to "Pledge of Allegiance, Francis Bellamy, Edward Bellamy, Looking Backward" :

The first description of the pledge had the palm of the hand turned upward for the straight-armed gesture. The gesture changed in use, growing into the "Heil Hitler" appearance because of the military salute (palm down) extended casually straight toward the flag.

James Bailey Upham suggested to Bellamy part of the gesture (the straight-arm with the palm upward). Upham’s suggested gesture (palm up) was like saying “Here is the flag.” It was because of Bellamy’s alteration (the addition of the military salute) that the pledge evolved into the Nazi-style.

Upham was also familiar with Bellamy's "military socialism" dogma because Edward Bellamy, cousin and cohort to Francis, had written of it in the international bestseller "Looking Backward" in 1888, and both Bellamys had been openly involved in the national socialism movement and the "Nationalist" magazine.

Edward Bellamy was a bitter West Point failure but he loved Prussian militarism and the educational system. According to Tom Peyser "On his deathbed, he wiled away the hours by arranging tin soldiers along the folds of his coverlet." That would interest all who loathe the National Socialist German Workers’ Party, because Prussia led to the formation of the German empire, and after World War I, Prussia continued to exist as the largest Land (state) within the Weimar Republic and under the National Socialist German Workers’ Party. After World War II it was dissolved by decree of the Allied Control Council in 1947.

Even with the palm turned upward, people would later see the relationship to the National Socialist German Workers' Party and that is why the straight-arm salute was disfavored in 1942, and the hand-over-the-heart was adopted. (On June 22, 1942, the pledge was included in the U.S. Flag Code, but Congress gave it the modern hand-over-the-heart gesture. There is probably one overriding reason why Congress interfered: to make everyone drop the straight-arm salute, which was becoming very embarassing and very revealing. The US had entered WWII on December 7, 1941 against Japan after Pearl Harbor. On December 11, 1941 Germany and Italy declared war on the United States and the U.S. declared war on Germany and Italy.)

A very interesting read. Thank you for posting.