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Trend toward informality

FedoraFan112390

Practically Family
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642
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Brooklyn, NY
At what point can we say that the trend towards informal dress which marked a great deal of the 20th century began? At what point did you see it in your family or in your neighborhood? I'm very interested in sociology and hope you wouldn't mind talking about this.

I would say the generations born 1920 and after began to dress less formally than previous generations. For example, my Irish great grandfather (mom's mom's dad), born in 1888, wore dress shirts, sweaters, and dress jakcets and the like. He also often wore a hat, typically a fedora or newsboy cap. In all of the picture I've seen, he never wore a t-shirt or short sleeved shirt; He was cleanshaven and clean cut.

Compared with my Italian grandfather (mom's dad), a veteran of WWII, born in 1920. He wore his hair slicked back and well kept, never ever wore a hat, and wore button down shirts, bowling shirts, polo shirts, short sleeved shirts slacks and dress shoes, somethings a gabarine jacket or a wool flannel jacket (in the late 40s and 50s). He also was clean shaven and clean cut, with a proto-fade haircut, but by the end of his life (the 1970s), he would wear flared slacks and white t-shirts, and wore thick ear length sideburns and a mustache.

My step-grandfather was Irish and was born in 1917 (d. 1998) and wore button down shirts, often in blue or other colors, a flannel shirt and always wore slacks, and always kept his hair short and in the 70s to the early 90s had ear length sideburns.

My other Italian grandfather (dad's dad), born in 1929, a veteran of the Korean War, wears and always wore a white t-shirt, sometimes a button down shirt or polo shirt, moccosin shoes, and has always (even in the '50s and '60s) worn jeans, and rarely slacks, but more often than not jeans. He also never wore a hat and instead wears his hair well greased back or to the side. I've seen him wearing sports jackets and the like, very casually dressed, and has always been clean shaven with short hair.
 

MAB1

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I think that between the Great Depression and WWII it took a lot out of people. It was more than a decade of suffering and personal sacrifice. We have no idea of how tough things were. The people who came out of it were certainly tough.

Sure the wealthy were unaffected (as they are today). Fashion in moments like this will always take a back seat.
 

Marcus Brody

Familiar Face
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68
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San Francisco
Probably 20th Century wars in general had something to do with this. It was only a century ago when people still wore uniforms that served little purpose other than formality. With war becoming less traditional, so did everything else involved with that. Pretty soon you have a bunch of men accustomed to wearing t-shirts
 

MAB1

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Marcus Brody said:
Probably 20th Century wars in general had something to do with this. It was only a century ago when people still wore uniforms that served little purpose other than formality. With war becoming less traditional, so did everything else involved with that. Pretty soon you have a bunch of men accustomed to wearing t-shirts

I'm more comfortable in a T-Shirt. 'Bout all I wear in the summer. In the winter I wear these heavy cotten things called Sweat Shirts. Ever heard of 'em?

Who died and made you the Fashion God? I'll bet if you had to get down in the mud, in your regalia... you'd cry like a baby. I would. Hell, I'm still sad that I tore my best blue jeans last weekend. Din't hurt my hat though. :cool:
 

MAB1

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Feraud said:
Every generation thinks the one that follows is not as formal and respectful as theirs.
Humans forget what it was like to be young..

I have to agree and point out my own generation. I'm a byproduct of the
60's. I still fight convention. It's not about following in any way. It's about NOT following.

I better shut up. NO POLITICS :D
 

Maj.Nick Danger

I'll Lock Up
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4,469
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Behind the 8 ball,..
Who plots the course of fashion anyway? And how do I get that job???

All the thoughts and musings on the subject of fashion makes me want to revive some style from the past and make it popular again. :) What comes around goes around as they say, as history really does repeat itself. Facial hair being an obvious example.
The so-called "Grunge" look has run it's course, :rolleyes: and for a bit too long I think. And maybe more than once in human history? Suits and hats are right out,... for now anyway.:( Too soon to bring them back maybe.
But what would catch on now? Hmm,...Roman togas maybe? People tend to just wear what everybody else is wearing, ... but how do I get 'em started? How do I get my togas into Targets and Walmarts all across the country and make people want to follow the new trend?? I will of course split the profits with any marketing pros out there that can help. :) So, how to change the course of fashion?
 

Rittmeister

Familiar Face
Messages
97
Location
New Jersey
It may be the ultimate culmination of the Enlightenment, the natural right of every human being to be and do what they want, taken to the extreme. And this runaway individualism has been fueled by marketers ("be all that you can be," "you deserve a break today," etc.) People now think they are free-thinking individuals, but in reality they are merely pawns of marketers. Marketers have also figured out that the ultimate fear lurking inside virtually everyone is the fear of not fitting in, of not being "cool." Marketers tell you what you need to be cool. It is as simple as that. So people have now shucked off every convention, institution and value that does not serve empower their individuality and make them feel cool. No issue or cause is bigger than any one person, nothing worth any sacrifice (save for a small few who are invested in their belonging to insulated cultures, such as the military, law enfrocement, etc. - and there is nothing wrong with that, by the way - it just is).
 

Maj.Nick Danger

I'll Lock Up
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Behind the 8 ball,..
kabuto said:
I don't see formal clothing coming back any time soon. Traditional tailored clothing just doesn't work as well on overweight and obese bodies. By "work" I don't mean style, but mechanical functionality. For instance, trouser designs originally assumed the presense of a waist. And jacket construction cannot deal with waists that are bigger than chests very well. You can't just scale up traditional tailoring. It needs to be rethought. A new style of formal clothing that is appropriate to today's bodies needs to be developed from the ground up. Perhaps some sort of jumpsuit, overalls, or mumu look, constructed from fine wool fabrics, will eventually appear. Or perhaps the look of the humans in Wall-E is the way of the future, formal onesies made out of expensive, high-tech synthetic fabrics.
Yes, I think our propensity to be overweight nowadays is a definite factor in influencing fashion. We need to either revamp our diets and lifestyles,..or simply start wearing my new line of loose and comfy togas. ;) In stores soon. lol
 

Charlie Noodles

A-List Customer
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357
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Melbourne, Australia
It would be hard to create an acceptable mainstream fashion for the morbidly obese. Widespread or not, being overweight itself will not become 'fashionable' again.

Formal clothing would be next to impossible to revive on a large scale as it is; where is the everyman taking these formal clothes? He doesn't need them, they are expensive and they are uncomfortable.

If everyone bought them then economics could make them cheaper and provide us with better fitting for everyone. But they won't. In this age there are more important distractions to spend our disposable income on.

A toga or a robe or similar would be an interesting way to go with it. If our tux' was a toga, we wouldn't have to discuss armholes and better fitting to the same degree, I'm sure.
 

Fletch

I'll Lock Up
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8,865
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Iowa - The Land That Stuff Forgot
Yeah, I don't want to live in a world where unpressed khakis are considered "overdressed."

Rittmeister said:
No issue or cause is bigger than any one person, nothing worth any sacrifice (save for a small few who are invested in their belonging to insulated cultures, such as the military, law enfrocement, etc. - and there is nothing wrong with that, by the way - it just is).
Well...people DO care about their families. That's more than one person. And when the chips are down, most of us care about our neighbors as well. But society in general...we don't give back to it because it doesn't give back to us. The framework that made that a natural way of life has dissolved as we've become a car-consumer-computer society.

It gives one deep concern, too, if those who are dedicated to service see themselves as a breed apart from the greater society. That's happening to too great a degree these days.
 

mineral

One of the Regulars
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136
Location
Boston, MA
Charlie Noodles said:
A toga or a robe or similar would be an interesting way to go with it. If our tux' was a toga, we wouldn't have to discuss armholes and better fitting to the same degree, I'm sure.

I would dearly love for togas to be back (since I'm odd :) ), but there's a problem. For Roman citizen soldiers used to the weight of a large shield on their left arms, the folds of the toga (on that arm) isn't much of a problem.

For us modern beings where sometimes even wrist watches seem too much of a constraint, this would be a definite deal-breaker. Not to mention that in this age of political correctness no one will tolerate this type of discrimination against left-handed people ....
 

Miss Crisplock

A-List Customer
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448
Location
Long Beach, CA
kabuto said:
Traditional tailored clothing just doesn't work as well on overweight and obese bodies. By "work" I don't mean style, but mechanical functionality.
or mumu look, constructed from fine wool fabrics, will eventually appear.

It has. The trapeaze dress changed women's clothing to the "hang from the shoulders dresses" of the late 60's. The change was huge and naturally changed into the no waist polyester shifts that followed.
 

MAB1

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Maj.Nick Danger said:
Yes, I think our propensity to be overweight nowadays is a definite factor in influencing fashion. We need to either revamp our diets and lifestyles,..or simply start wearing my new line of loose and comfy togas. ;) In stores soon. lol

Look back in History and you'll see that the only people overweight... were those that could afford it. Look at all the heavy ladies in Renaissance paintings. Those weren't peasants they were painting. And nekid seemed to be the fashion. :D

And more recently... Look at ol' George Washington. He wasn't skinny. But, he was fashionable.
 

MAB1

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univibe88 said:
When did they go out of style? I wear slacks every day.

That's why you can by pre-washed demin thsese days. :D I feel uncomfortable in slacks. Can't wait to change into a pair o' jeans.

Nuthin more comfy than an old pair o' jeans and a broke in pair of steel toes. :)
 

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