This winter's 'big thing' with the kids?

[Edward]

I started out as a cultural anthropologist, so all this talk of tribes and identities is really fascinating to me.

Completely. While my field is law, I've always argued that law is a product of cultural context, and the sociology of tribal groupings (especially those leading to legal reactionism borne of moral panic) have a big role in that. Significantly, I think with most of the vintage style in which I am interested, the initial attraction was often, if not always, somehow rootedc in the various subcultures in which I've dabbled or been full-on involved. There's actually footage of me (in a 50s suit and 40s fedora) on the extra to the Rocky Horror BluRay that was released a few years ago, talking about how my love of that film/show was borne in large part of it pulling together so many of my previous interests and influneces, and in turn me coming full circle through it and gaining the confidenced to go out in full vintage without caring about the reaction. (I was always a subculture kid and well used to sticking ouyt, but it's a whole different world to step out in unconscious confidence rather than studied defiance).

Over here are no padded jeans (sounds aweful), all the MA-1s last year were very slim fit, and all this years perfecto style clones are black, and worn equally by men and women.

I actually wondered whether some of the slimfit craze of recent years was borne of Japanese influence, given that they tend to have all their jackets cut much neater than the real thing - even some of their repop A2s, to fit thec typically slighter Asian physique. Not that this has hit with the MA1s over here, though. I think that's hiphop fashion at work.

Despite globalization, international mall brands etc, it's interesting to see differentiation between tribes globally when faced with pretty much the same mass produced rubbish as kids everywhere else every year.

Interesting and, I think, quite heartening; while I love that goths, punks, rockabillies, and whatever are all still around, and while fully recognising that there have alwayd been 'gentlemen's outfitters' where the whole point was to be a one-stop shop...... somehow some scenes seem to have all the creativity sucked out of them if it all becomes too universal, too easy....

@Edward, you made me lol. I wear my MA-1 with a t-shirt jeans and Dr. Martens and I know this has got a real 'romper stomper' skinhead image, but when I was in the U.K., I was told that this was also a popular style with gay men (like Teddy boy drapes), and my mind boggles at how those two groups on both occasions reconciled this fact. It's got to be worthy of research.
I got short hair like a skinhead and my bulletproof mustache going on like one of the village people! What signals must I inadvertently be giving out?!

A tache would definitely stand out in the UK; aside from a handful of vintage folks and the Hipster set when they do fascial hair, the tache alone thing is even more unusual than a beard in the UK nowadays. (Living as I do in a very ethinically mixed area, I actually probably see more men with beards and no tach than I do with tache alone.)

The skinhead style has been popular on and off in the gay community since the early nineties. I can see that making sense: when you boil it down - much like so much of the heavy metal and biker leather thing, also types which have their fans in the gay community - it was all about being macho-macho, manliness, butchness..... the attractions for a lot of folks in the gay community (especially these days, as I gather being overly camp and effete can lead to a lot of prejudice being suffered within parts of the gay community) of a very manly-manly, butch look should be fairly obvious.... I think too there are sometimes differences between the US and the UK/Europe on that front - a lot of the redneck looks and culture that is so aggressively butch and manly in its own context in the US, for example, would be seen as ridiculously "gay" in the UK. Different cultural interpretations, I guess.

Unfortunately, while a lot of once innocent things adopted by neonazi types have been filtered back into the mainstream via the gay community, as there has been a bit of a revival in the former with the rise of groups like "Britain First" / EDL / The Football Lads' Association, there are still certain associations with which one has to be careful. A bunch of that type turned up in my area a few Saturdays ago; they're mostly from the North of England, but they like to come down to East London every so often to shout at people coming out of the Mosque or something. When a bunch of them in MA1s and shaved heads (invariably middle-age, almost to a man: they don't seem to attract too many youngsters these days) turn up round the local, there's no mistaking them for being part of the local gay community.

I have never heard of popular styles of gay men. I also think that the skinhead image has already become part of the history books.

It's such a shame, really, that the skinhead look - which still has its fans, the signiicant majority of whom were never racisat boot boys - is so associated with the far right in the mainstream even now: it's such a strong look. Arguably, it was the last British youth cult with such a strong aesthetic and identifiable style. Only really New Romantic could be a contender on that front, as there was a timing overlap, but it never had the same reach.

I don't think classic styles like MA-1 etc would ever go out of fashion. Its just that the fashion houses would add random studs here and there or splash it with a strange colour every now and then to give it a fresh look every season.

Exactly.

 

[Big J]

So, I was sitting in Starbucks today (first time since I started this thread), reading an A-4 pilots Vietnam memoirs and drinking a latte, while my wife and her mother are shopping, when I notice that some high school age girl has got a really nice jacket slung over the back of her chair. I mean, it's a thick leather, double stitched biker jacket that looks really stiff and heavy, not a mall store fashion jacket.
And I'm sitting there staring at it, when I heard some voices talking about the strange old man staring at the young girl. I look around.
Oh...

 

[Monitor]

So, I was sitting in Starbucks today (first time since I started this thread), reading an A-4 pilots Vietnam memoirs and drinking a latte, while my wife and her mother are shopping, when I notice that some high school age girl has got a really nice jacket slung over the back of her chair. I mean, it's a thick leather, double stitched biker jacket that looks really stiff and heavy, not a mall store fashion jacket.
And I'm sitting there staring at it, when I heard some voices talking about the strange old man staring at the young girl. I look around.
Oh...

Wait, you can't do that in Japan???

Related to this topic, Supreme got another deal with Vanson it would appear and this time it's the Bones jacket. My "Vanson" eBay search is spammed with it... Good for Vanson I suppose, they're getting rid of some old stock, as as with the last one.

 

[bn1966]

Skinheads are still around on British Scooter-Rally's...Boots N Braces & no politics (generally)..wouldn't question their sexuality as a rule!!.

I've got a shaved bonce & big Tache (thanks MPB!) & Green 'Flighty'..'Stetson Cap' ...known in local circles as 'The French-Man' (I do have some French ancestory appartley)..No 'Village People' jokes around here

 

[Doctor Damage]

I actually wondered whether some of the slimfit craze of recent years was borne of Japanese influence, given that they tend to have all their jackets cut much neater than the real thing - even some of their repop A2s, to fit thec typically slighter Asian physique.

This is an important point. It's often the same with footwear, different fits/sizes in the 'east'.

The skinhead style has been popular on and off in the gay community since the early nineties. I can see that making sense: when you boil it down - much like so much of the heavy metal and biker leather thing, also types which have their fans in the gay community - it was all about being macho-macho, manliness, butchness..... the attractions for a lot of folks in the gay community (especially these days, as I gather being overly camp and effete can lead to a lot of prejudice being suffered within parts of the gay community) of a very manly-manly, butch look should be fairly obvious....

When I look at myself and other men I always wonder what women see in us, and I think that if I was a woman I'd be a lesbian for sure. But that misses the point, because straight* women are 100% into masculinity, as are many gay men. I have a female friend who has a huge fetish for male construction workers in reflective vests, several days growth, and steel toed workboots. I laugh at her 'cause she's REALLY into it. But then plenty of gay men would agree with her.

I think too there are sometimes differences between the US and the UK/Europe on that front - a lot of the redneck looks and culture that is so aggressively butch and manly in its own context in the US, for example, would be seen as ridiculously "gay" in the UK. Different cultural interpretations, I guess.

Huge differences in some ways, but not always. Every time I see hipsters and copycats in their fancy haircuts and unmanly beards I laugh. I don't think any realize that a long beards and chainsaws don't go together, even if it does keep your face warm. I also laugh at men who wear their hair shaved/short on the sides and long on the top either slicked back or swept to one side... hello Waffen SS stormtrooper... which is NOT the look they're going for, but being historically ignorant they don't get it... well whatever.

* Not the best word but when one gets into this stuff none of the available words are really useful.

 

[Big J]

@Monitor, maybe you could get away with it, but clearly I'm too creepy when I do it.

@bn1966, I feel for you man. With those shoulders, you've missed your vocation in life, you should have been an Olympic swimmer. Still, green nylon and mustache, that's a great look! Worked for Robin Olds!

 

[Seb Lucas]

It's easy to knock Zara, but did you know that as a boy, Amancio Ortega, Zara's founder, was so ashamed of his family's poverty that he vowed to do something about it. He currently vies with Bill Gates as the richest man in the world, somewhere around eighty billion dollars, give or take the odd billion.

I've never heard of Zara or this Ortega guy. I'm certain he's never heard of me.

 

[Big J]

@Seb, I thought he was a conquistador! Or maybe the bad guy in Zorro...

Still, poverty is nothing to be ashamed of, but a lack of aspiration is.