This generation of kids...

[jamespowers]

Raising a teenager these days amongst children that have absolutely no rules is a very tough job.

Oh, now there is something to look forward.:eusa_doh:

 

[JimWagner]

Very tough. But not impossible.

 

[Tiller]

Amen but the problem today, and I definitely know this first hand, is that your ability to raise your own children in a way that involves morals and values is constantly being contramanded by the population at large. There are poor examples of behavior everywhere. Some have no idea what they are doing as such ideas have not been introduced in generations and others are just plain lax.:eusa_doh:

Victorian morality is a distillation of the moral views of people living at the time of Queen Victoria's reign (1837–1901) and of the moral climate of the United Kingdom throughout the 19th century in general, which contrasted greatly with the morality of the previous Georgian period.

It was in many ways the excess of the upper class during the Regency Era that brought up many of the ideals of the Victorian era. Queen Victoria had seen how William IV excess had affected the court, and culture around them and made an effort to change that culture.

It isn't a popular view probably, but I think in many ways American society is going to be heading towards a more conservative (in the culture sense) direction soon. The check is long overdo. I'm not saying it's a good thing, but I think it's bound to happen in a few decades or sooner. In time that will be replaced by a more "open" culture, and in time will then become "conservative" again. This seems to be the general pattern for me anyways.

Let's be perfectly honest the excess of the sexual revolution have almost become a parody of themselves now. I see Lady Gaga as almost a parody of Madonna, and the poor woman doesn't even realize it! Every "shocking" act that has been done, has been done in one way or another for the last 43 years. My generation doesn't seem to understand that the 70's happened before they were born, and they aren't exactly shocking their parents they are imitating them.

So hopefully by the time I have teenage children the pop culture will be a tad more turned back .

 

[jamespowers]

It was in many ways the excess of the upper class during the Regency Era that brought up many of the ideals of the Victorian era. Queen Victoria had seen how William IV excess had affected the court, and culture around them and made an effort to change that culture.

It isn't a popular view probably, but I think in many ways American society is going to be heading towards a more conservative (in the culture sense) direction soon. The check is long overdo. I'm not saying it's a good thing, but I think it's bound to happen in a few decades or sooner. In time that will be replaced by a more "open" culture, and in time will then become "conservative" again. This seems to be the general pattern for me anyways.

Let's be perfectly honest the excess of the sexual revolution have almost become a parody of themselves now. I see Lady Gaga as almost a parody of Madonna, and the poor woman doesn't even realize it! Every "shocking" act that has been done, has been done in one way or another for the last 43 years. My generation doesn't seem to understand that the 70's happened before they were born, and they aren't exactly shocking their parents they are imitating them.

I think todays morays would shock even the most Georgian Georgian.
It doesn't swing back fully at any time. It ratchets down a little at a time like a car jack not like the pendulum on a clock. The swing back may seem like a complete return but it isn't. Conservative is one thing but Victorian is another.

 

[jamespowers]

Very tough. But not impossible.

No. Just harder with each succeeding generation.:eusa_doh:

 

[rue]

No. Just harder with each succeeding generation.:eusa_doh:

Much harder.

 

[Yeps]

I see Lady Gaga as almost a parody of Madonna, and the poor woman doesn't even realize it!

I bet she does realize it. It seems very calculated to me.

 

[Tiller]

Conservative is one thing but Victorian is another.

I'm not saying the world's most famous fashion houses are going to be coming out with their "Lancaster Line" in 2020, which all proper ladies will be buying up. I am saying that the American culture that lead to the excess of the Baby Boomers and those that followed is coming to an end, and I believe change is coming. I'm not saying we are going back to "Aww shucks Wally", but I wouldn't be surprised to see the return of the family friendly sitcoms. I also believe that reality tv will one day seem as anachronistic as the Dating Game does with us today, and American Idol will one day be fondly remembered like the old variety shows are today. I mean everyone misses the Dean Martin Show, right? Even those of us who never saw it live lol.

Would anyone had predicted the Victorian age in 1798? Would the Edwardian's have predicted the roaring twenties? Did people in 1946 see Woodstock coming? All cultures change, and I don't think we are going to be any different, our neo-woodstock culture is bond to end sometime. With the changing political players in foreign affairs, and the real culture shock that is the recession, combined with the weakening economic power of the average citizen, and I think change is coming, and your going to see a rise against the pop culture at large as well.

Nostalgia and a desire for simpler times rises when their is great uncertainty, and a growing dissatisfaction with the way things are. Maybe I'm wrong, but I think that we are heading towards that (if we aren't already in the early stages of it) now.

I bet she does realize it. It seems very calculated to me.

I could be wrong, but I think she sees herself more as a tribute, or a continuation of Madonna's style not a parody of it. If she is attempting to be a parody of the culture that she now represents to so many people, then she is a better actress then I thought she ever was!

 

[scottyrocks]

Jim and Feraud - yes, indeed.

Feraud, the situation you describe is pretty much how it is. There are parents who take an active role in straightening out their kids. And then you have parents who say things like (and this drives me up the wall), 'Yeah, he (or she) is the same way at home, and I don't know what to do about it!'

Yeah, well, if you don't know what to do about it, what's left? I can't say that out loud, and I just cringe inside.

And then there are those parents who defend their kids no matter what, despite proof, multiple anecdotals, witnesses, what have you. Well, no wonder the kid is out of control. Mom-n-dad back them no matter what they do and they know it.

 

[sheeplady]

I am saying that the American culture that lead to the excess of the Baby Boomers and those that followed is coming to an end, and I believe change is coming. I'm not saying we are going back to "Aww shucks Wally", but I wouldn't be surprised to see the return of the family friendly sitcoms. I also believe that reality tv will one day seem as anachronistic as the Dating Game does with us today, and American Idol will one day be fondly remembered like the old variety shows are today. I mean everyone misses the Dean Martin Show, right? Even those of us who never saw it live lol.

One thing I have noticed with Gen Y (those born from 1982 onwards- there hasn't been an end date set yet, but I imagine it will be in the mid-2000s) is that they tend to be much more conservative in their behavior than my generation- Gen X (those born from 1965-1981). This has been shown in a lot of the research on generational differences, but what I have observed has backed this up. Gen Y tends to be more conservative about debt and there are some signs that they are more family-orientated. They are much more likely to be service-orientated and active in their community (more likely to volunteer for the military and view service as desirable too).

So, I think there is a chance that you are right about the television. I don't think we'll see the same type of shows, and "wholesome" will have a new meaning. These young adults and 20-somethings are still products of their generation and time period, and certain things are more acceptable to them than previous generations. There will still be raunch on television.

We are also experiencing some population changes as well that will impact this. In Gen X we are seeing a decreasing divorce rate compared to the boomer generation (with a dramatic drop in the rate among college-educated women), and although it is not clear if this will continue for Gen Y or decrease further. I think that more "married" or "long term" couples will contribute to there being more family-orientated programming as well.

 

[jamespowers]

I'm not saying the world's most famous fashion houses are going to be coming out with their "Lancaster Line" in 2020, which all proper ladies will be buying up. I am saying that the American culture that lead to the excess of the Baby Boomers and those that followed is coming to an end, and I believe change is coming. I'm not saying we are going back to "Aww shucks Wally", but I wouldn't be surprised to see the return of the family friendly sitcoms. I also believe that reality TV will one day seem as anachronistic as the Dating Game does with us today, and American Idol will one day be fondly remembered like the old variety shows are today. I mean everyone misses the Dean Martin Show, right? Even those of us who never saw it live lol.

Would anyone had predicted the Victorian age in 1798? Would the Edwardian's have predicted the roaring twenties? Did people in 1946 see Woodstock coming? All cultures change, and I don't think we are going to be any different, our neo-woodstock culture is bond to end sometime. With the changing political players in foreign affairs, and the real culture shock that is the recession, combined with the weakening economic power of the average citizen, and I think change is coming, and your going to see a rise against the pop culture at large as well.

Nostalgia and a desire for simpler times rises when their is great uncertainty, and a growing dissatisfaction with the way things are. Maybe I'm wrong, but I think that we are heading towards that (if we aren't already in the early stages of it) now.

Yes, unfortunately, gee Wally is over. If is replaced by much more arcane language.
When you see a family friendly sitcom, let me know. When you see books, music and art that isn't trash, let me know. Nothing will change culturally until every last hippie is dead and that isn't going to happen for another 60 years. Only then will they release control of institutions that continue their culture like termites eating the house of morality and decency.:eusa_doh: Maybe I will still be alive then to dance on the grave of depravity but I doubt it. For now, there will be small enclaves but it won't extend very far. You are far to optimistic.
However, I am impressed with the new generation. They indeed seem to have their heads screwed on despite much around them. Some of it I will even give the internet credit for because they can better obtain information readily to draw their own conclusions from unlike many generations before them that were tied inexorably to newspapers and TV news that all had their agendas cloaked in objectivity. Finally they can learn how to think rather than what to think.

 

[jamespowers]

One thing I have noticed with Gen Y (those born from 1982 onwards- there hasn't been an end date set yet, but I imagine it will be in the mid-2000s) is that they tend to be much more conservative in their behavior than my generation- Gen X (those born from 1965-1981). This has been shown in a lot of the research on generational differences, but what I have observed has backed this up. Gen Y tends to be more conservative about debt and there are some signs that they are more family-orientated. They are much more likely to be service-orientated and active in their community (more likely to volunteer for the military and view service as desirable too).

So, I think there is a chance that you are right about the television. I don't think we'll see the same type of shows, and "wholesome" will have a new meaning. These young adults and 20-somethings are still products of their generation and time period, and certain things are more acceptable to them than previous generations. There will still be raunch on television.

We are also experiencing some population changes as well that will impact this. In Gen X we are seeing a decreasing divorce rate compared to the boomer generation (with a dramatic drop in the rate among college-educated women), and although it is not clear if this will continue for Gen Y or decrease further. I think that more "married" or "long term" couples will contribute to there being more family-orientated programming as well.

I think women hold the key to any cultural change---especially one transitioning to a more family friendly environment.

 

[jamespowers]

Jim and Feraud - yes, indeed.

Feraud, the situation you describe is pretty much how it is. There are parents who take an active role in straightening out their kids. And then you have parents who say things like (and this drives me up the wall), 'Yeah, he (or she) is the same way at home, and I don't know what to do about it!'

Yeah, well, if you don't know what to do about it, what's left? I can't say that out loud, and I just cringe inside.

And then there are those parents who defend their kids no matter what, despite proof, multiple anecdotals, witnesses, what have you. Well, no wonder the kid is out of control. Mom-n-dad back them no matter what they do and they know it.

Now I know exactly what they mean when they say that some parents need a license. More like Nanny MacPhee in a lot of cases.:eusa_doh:
The little dears are never wrong. Boy are they in for some reality when they don't get three months off from their job every year, their boss isn't going to give them time off to "find themselves" and if they thought the school staff were bad then meet your new BOSS. :rofl:

 

[Yeps]

One thing I have noticed with Gen Y (those born from 1982 onwards- there hasn't been an end date set yet, but I imagine it will be in the mid-2000s) is that they tend to be much more conservative in their behavior than my generation- Gen X (those born from 1965-1981). This has been shown in a lot of the research on generational differences, but what I have observed has backed this up. Gen Y tends to be more conservative about debt and there are some signs that they are more family-orientated. They are much more likely to be service-orientated and active in their community (more likely to volunteer for the military and view service as desirable too).

So, I think there is a chance that you are right about the television. I don't think we'll see the same type of shows, and "wholesome" will have a new meaning. These young adults and 20-somethings are still products of their generation and time period, and certain things are more acceptable to them than previous generations. There will still be raunch on television.

We are also experiencing some population changes as well that will impact this. In Gen X we are seeing a decreasing divorce rate compared to the boomer generation (with a dramatic drop in the rate among college-educated women), and although it is not clear if this will continue for Gen Y or decrease further. I think that more "married" or "long term" couples will contribute to there being more family-orientated programming as well.

Please, call us millennials, I think that Gen Y would be more applicable to the next generation, which ought to be kids now, the children of Gen X. Anyway, I think you are pretty dead on with your observation. A lot of my generation is kinda rebelling against the anti-establishment establishment and going back to the establishment that was rebelled against in the first place, but with a lot more social liberality in it, that is, we generally have a very live and let live attitude towards lifestyles and choices, even if a lot of us are much more conservative. Kinda odd, the more I think about it.

 

[AtomicEraTom]

I've noticed this, too. So many people that I know, younger folks are acting more conservative in nature. I think the era of rebellion is waning, well I guess it could be said that this new generation is rebelling against the aging hippie generation.

One thing I have noticed with Gen Y (those born from 1982 onwards- there hasn't been an end date set yet, but I imagine it will be in the mid-2000s) is that they tend to be much more conservative in their behavior than my generation- Gen X (those born from 1965-1981). This has been shown in a lot of the research on generational differences, but what I have observed has backed this up. Gen Y tends to be more conservative about debt and there are some signs that they are more family-orientated. They are much more likely to be service-orientated and active in their community (more likely to volunteer for the military and view service as desirable too).

So, I think there is a chance that you are right about the television. I don't think we'll see the same type of shows, and "wholesome" will have a new meaning. These young adults and 20-somethings are still products of their generation and time period, and certain things are more acceptable to them than previous generations. There will still be raunch on television.

We are also experiencing some population changes as well that will impact this. In Gen X we are seeing a decreasing divorce rate compared to the boomer generation (with a dramatic drop in the rate among college-educated women), and although it is not clear if this will continue for Gen Y or decrease further. I think that more "married" or "long term" couples will contribute to there being more family-orientated programming as well.

 

[sheeplady]

Please, call us millennials, I think that Gen Y would be more applicable to the next generation, which ought to be kids now, the children of Gen X. Anyway, I think you are pretty dead on with your observation. A lot of my generation is kinda rebelling against the anti-establishment establishment and going back to the establishment that was rebelled against in the first place, but with a lot more social liberality in it, that is, we generally have a very live and let live attitude towards lifestyles and choices, even if a lot of us are much more conservative. Kinda odd, the more I think about it.

Sorry about that. I'll use the term Millennials. I've noticed that many of my Millennial students tend to come at their more liberal viewpoints by more "conservative" logic as well. For instance, I have had students argue for gay marriage under the logic that we should encourage marriage as a long-term commitment, because marriage is important. They are also very "live and let live" as you say- I've had many students say that while they wish to be married and want to do so (often saying they want to live together first and delay marriage until they are older, but not always) they don't care what others do, but everyone should have the option.

(Of course, generational trends do not mean that everybody in a generation thinks that way.)

I'm not trying to be political in this, but it is the best example I could think of.

 

[Yeps]

I'm not trying to be political in this, but it is the best example I could think of.

That is actually the main example I was thinking of when I said live and let live. I think it is interesting that we actually have people arriving at the same ideas from both ends of the political spectrum.

Oh, and sorry to be nitpicky about terms. I am trying to swing the popular conscious, which can't seem to make up its mind of what term to use, towards Millennial. For the reason I mentioned before, Gen Y doesn't make sense to me. I am just glad that "echo-boomer" didn't stick. While we are the children of the boomers, I don't think that we should be defined by it.

 

[scottyrocks]

Afaic, as long as such a large number of people continue to believe that things are owed to them, nothing will change. Promiscuity seems to go hand in hand with entitlement.

 

[John in Covina]

It isn't a popular view probably, but I think in many ways American society is going to be heading towards a more conservative (in the culture sense) direction soon. The check is long overdo. I'm not saying it's a good thing, but I think it's bound to happen in a few decades or sooner. In time that will be replaced by a more "open" culture, and in time will then become "conservative" again. This seems to be the general pattern for me anyways.

That is usually true, most people consider things in culture or political to be like a pendulum swinging back and forth. The question is as to some of the changes is there are some things that sometimes don't return to the way it was -which ones will remain? (Hopefully mostly good changes.) The phrase for that is you can't put the genie back in the bottle.

 

[LizzieMaine]

I wouldn't say "conservative," because of the political shadings that word carries, but I would say -- and hope -- that "self-discipline" is likely to make a comeback. Lack of that trait, more than anything, is the root of much of what's wrong with modern culture. It's tough to get in trouble when you've got your nose to the grindstone.